Advice needed on taking finance company to court

kimwp

Can you not report the van stolen and then sell it to pay off the debt?

Exodi

kimwp said:

Can you not report the van stolen and then sell it to pay off the debt?

This is why people asked whose name the van was in:

Myci85 said:

_Penny_Dreadful said:

Initially you said your OH was a guarantor and now you mention him being the main applicant. Who actually owns the van? What kind of finance is this? Personal loan, higher purchase or PCP? 

Yes, so he agreed to be guarantor for the finance, it was car finance, not sure which type but not a personal loan. However when the FOS looked into it, they have confirmed my OH's suspicions that he was actually listed as the sole applicant. The van has always been owned by his 'friend'.

It appears the van is in the friends name (otherwise as you suggest, this issue would be relatively simple to solve - just repossess the van).

Guarantor credit agreements usually send the money to the guarantor (it reduces the possibility of the guarantor claiming no knowledge of the arrangement and also reduces fraud) which they may then pass on. If this was the case, the OH has effectively gifted the friend the money to buy the van.

While it seems it was a loan, there is no evidence to prove this - and we all know from this forum how often loans between friends/family are successfully enforced, even with evidence.

I have much sympathy for the OP (even if it doesn't sound like it)... people get swindled by friends and family out of money all the time... it's one of the reasons the majority of the people on this forum shout till they're blue in the face not to mix friends/family and money.

Myci85

kimwp said:

Can you not report the van stolen and then sell it to pay off the debt?

Sadly not as we don't have the van and never have. Does anyone know if there's a way to find out who the registered keeper of a vehicle is? I'd be interested to know if he still owns it.

Exodi said:

kimwp said:

Can you not report the van stolen and then sell it to pay off the debt?

This is why people asked whose name the van was in:

Myci85 said:

_Penny_Dreadful said:

Initially you said your OH was a guarantor and now you mention him being the main applicant. Who actually owns the van? What kind of finance is this? Personal loan, higher purchase or PCP? 

Yes, so he agreed to be guarantor for the finance, it was car finance, not sure which type but not a personal loan. However when the FOS looked into it, they have confirmed my OH's suspicions that he was actually listed as the sole applicant. The van has always been owned by his 'friend'.

It appears the van is in the friends name (otherwise as you suggest, this issue would be relatively simple to solve - just repossess the van).

Guarantor credit agreements usually send the money to the guarantor (it reduces the possibility of the guarantor claiming no knowledge of the arrangement and also reduces fraud) which they may then pass on. If this was the case, the OH has effectively gifted the friend the money to buy the van.

While it seems it was a loan, there is no evidence to prove this - and we all know from this forum how often loans between friends/family are successfully enforced, even with evidence.

I have much sympathy for the OP (even if it doesn't sound like it)... people get swindled by friends and family out of money all the time... it's one of the reasons the majority of the people on this forum shout till they're blue in the face not to mix friends/family and money.

I'm a bit confused about the guarantor agreement you're referring to, as what I've read online suggests you can't apply for vehicle finance on behalf of someone else because it is classed as fronting?

I totally agree about not mixing money with friends/family, it was an entirely foolish move on OH's part. 

I contacted the friend asking him to pay the outstanding debt by x date and explaining the situation. Unsurprisingly he was not very forthcoming with agreeing to send the money, however I feel that in his messages he has admitted that he was the one it was for, and he was making payments, and he is under the impression he had paid the full amount owed (though went on to say it would only be circa £300 left to pay). Using bank statements we could also evidence the money previously coming from him to be paid to the finance company. I am tempted to find someone who offers a free 30-60 minutes of legal advice to see if they think we'd stand a chance through small claims court, as from what I gather with claims to the value of £1000-1500, the court fee is just £80 and if you lose the only extra you could possibly be made to pay is reasonable travel costs for defendant. They can't make you pay their legal fees except in exceptional circumstances. 

DullGreyGuy

Myci85 said:

I have also found that by putting the finance in OH's name, the application was fronted, which is illegal, however like you said with no paperwork or anything to prove OH was not intending to be main applicant, how do we prove it was the finance company that acted fraudulently. I don't know if the fact he had no driving licence at all, not even provisional, at this time would make any difference, or if that isn't a requirement to buy a vehicle on finance. 

Taking them to court would be less about any financial gain, and more about getting them to take responsibility and wipe the information off his credit file. But we aren't in a position to fork out god knows how much if we lose. 

Why do you think its illegal for one person to take finance for a vehicle that another will use? Plenty of people buy cars on finance for their partners, kids, parents etc.  What can be an issue is lying about the arrangement to the finance company or their agent but you've not presented any evidence to that fact and if it was "illegal" its your husband not the finance company that would be the "criminal".

There is no requirement for someone taking finance for a car or any other reason to need a driving license. 

The law of limitations is 6 years from the breach and so the finance company would have a statutory defense that its time barred for the same reason why the FOS wont look at the case. You can spend a couple of thousand on hiring a lawyer to look into it and come to the conclusion that you've no case or you could use that same money to simply pay off the debt your husband took out and be done with it. 

kimwp

Myci85 said:

kimwp said:

Can you not report the van stolen and then sell it to pay off the debt?

Sadly not as we don't have the van and never have. Does anyone know if there's a way to find out who the registered keeper of a vehicle is? I'd be interested to know if he still owns it.

Exodi said:

kimwp said:

Can you not report the van stolen and then sell it to pay off the debt?

This is why people asked whose name the van was in:

Myci85 said:

_Penny_Dreadful said:

Initially you said your OH was a guarantor and now you mention him being the main applicant. Who actually owns the van? What kind of finance is this? Personal loan, higher purchase or PCP? 

Yes, so he agreed to be guarantor for the finance, it was car finance, not sure which type but not a personal loan. However when the FOS looked into it, they have confirmed my OH's suspicions that he was actually listed as the sole applicant. The van has always been owned by his 'friend'.

It appears the van is in the friends name (otherwise as you suggest, this issue would be relatively simple to solve - just repossess the van).

Guarantor credit agreements usually send the money to the guarantor (it reduces the possibility of the guarantor claiming no knowledge of the arrangement and also reduces fraud) which they may then pass on. If this was the case, the OH has effectively gifted the friend the money to buy the van.

While it seems it was a loan, there is no evidence to prove this - and we all know from this forum how often loans between friends/family are successfully enforced, even with evidence.

I have much sympathy for the OP (even if it doesn't sound like it)... people get swindled by friends and family out of money all the time... it's one of the reasons the majority of the people on this forum shout till they're blue in the face not to mix friends/family and money.

I'm a bit confused about the guarantor agreement you're referring to, as what I've read online suggests you can't apply for vehicle finance on behalf of someone else because it is classed as fronting?

I totally agree about not mixing money with friends/family, it was an entirely foolish move on OH's part. 

I contacted the friend asking him to pay the outstanding debt by x date and explaining the situation. Unsurprisingly he was not very forthcoming with agreeing to send the money, however I feel that in his messages he has admitted that he was the one it was for, and he was making payments, and he is under the impression he had paid the full amount owed (though went on to say it would only be circa £300 left to pay). Using bank statements we could also evidence the money previously coming from him to be paid to the finance company. I am tempted to find someone who offers a free 30-60 minutes of legal advice to see if they think we'd stand a chance through small claims court, as from what I gather with claims to the value of £1000-1500, the court fee is just £80 and if you lose the only extra you could possibly be made to pay is reasonable travel costs for defendant. They can't make you pay their legal fees except in exceptional circumstances. 

I think you'd be better to put together the numbers to show this person that he owes you more than he thinks. 

Myci85

kimwp said:

Myci85 said:

kimwp said:

Can you not report the van stolen and then sell it to pay off the debt?

Sadly not as we don't have the van and never have. Does anyone know if there's a way to find out who the registered keeper of a vehicle is? I'd be interested to know if he still owns it.

Exodi said:

kimwp said:

Can you not report the van stolen and then sell it to pay off the debt?

This is why people asked whose name the van was in:

Myci85 said:

_Penny_Dreadful said:

Initially you said your OH was a guarantor and now you mention him being the main applicant. Who actually owns the van? What kind of finance is this? Personal loan, higher purchase or PCP? 

Yes, so he agreed to be guarantor for the finance, it was car finance, not sure which type but not a personal loan. However when the FOS looked into it, they have confirmed my OH's suspicions that he was actually listed as the sole applicant. The van has always been owned by his 'friend'.

It appears the van is in the friends name (otherwise as you suggest, this issue would be relatively simple to solve - just repossess the van).

Guarantor credit agreements usually send the money to the guarantor (it reduces the possibility of the guarantor claiming no knowledge of the arrangement and also reduces fraud) which they may then pass on. If this was the case, the OH has effectively gifted the friend the money to buy the van.

While it seems it was a loan, there is no evidence to prove this - and we all know from this forum how often loans between friends/family are successfully enforced, even with evidence.

I have much sympathy for the OP (even if it doesn't sound like it)... people get swindled by friends and family out of money all the time... it's one of the reasons the majority of the people on this forum shout till they're blue in the face not to mix friends/family and money.

I'm a bit confused about the guarantor agreement you're referring to, as what I've read online suggests you can't apply for vehicle finance on behalf of someone else because it is classed as fronting?

I totally agree about not mixing money with friends/family, it was an entirely foolish move on OH's part. 

I contacted the friend asking him to pay the outstanding debt by x date and explaining the situation. Unsurprisingly he was not very forthcoming with agreeing to send the money, however I feel that in his messages he has admitted that he was the one it was for, and he was making payments, and he is under the impression he had paid the full amount owed (though went on to say it would only be circa £300 left to pay). Using bank statements we could also evidence the money previously coming from him to be paid to the finance company. I am tempted to find someone who offers a free 30-60 minutes of legal advice to see if they think we'd stand a chance through small claims court, as from what I gather with claims to the value of £1000-1500, the court fee is just £80 and if you lose the only extra you could possibly be made to pay is reasonable travel costs for defendant. They can't make you pay their legal fees except in exceptional circumstances. 

I think you'd be better to put together the numbers to show this person that he owes you more than he thinks. 

Yes we are in the process of collating this information however due to a falling out this friend had with my OH's wider family (nothing to do with OH but said 'friend' has a grudge now as he feels my OH should have helped him sort out this issue) even if I can prove the outstanding amount, I don't think he will willingly pay it.