How to put a cap on energy direct debits?

pieroabcd

frugalmacdugal said:

Hi

are you on monthly DD or variable DD.

You ask a lot of questions, then we have to draw it info out of you.

Full monthly DD 

pieroabcd

Robin9 said:

pieroabcd said:

Does the energy provider collect money the same day that they release the bills or is there enough time to check that everything is alright?

Usually about 2 weeks

It's a nice workaround for a system that I consider ill conceived. Thankfully there is .

I think that it's very reasonable to imagine a system authorising a DD not higher than a given monthly threshold (say for example 500 pounds for energy, 50 for telephone, 30 for water and so on) but evidently it doesn't work like this. It works like a white cheque.

CSI_Yorkshire

pieroabcd said:

Robin9 said:

pieroabcd said:

Does the energy provider collect money the same day that they release the bills or is there enough time to check that everything is alright?

Usually about 2 weeks

It's a nice workaround for a system that I consider ill conceived. Thankfully there is .

I think that it's very reasonable to imagine a system authorising a DD not higher than a given monthly threshold (say for example 500 pounds for energy, 50 for telephone, 30 for water and so on) but evidently it doesn't work like this. It works like a white cheque.

I don't think that ££ amounts would make sense - but perhaps if the amount was more than X% different from the previous draw on the same DD then it flagged it to the account holder or something?

Doesn't seem like a bad thing to add to the system.

MWT

CSI_Yorkshire said:

pieroabcd said:

Robin9 said:

pieroabcd said:

Does the energy provider collect money the same day that they release the bills or is there enough time to check that everything is alright?

Usually about 2 weeks

It's a nice workaround for a system that I consider ill conceived. Thankfully there is .

I think that it's very reasonable to imagine a system authorising a DD not higher than a given monthly threshold (say for example 500 pounds for energy, 50 for telephone, 30 for water and so on) but evidently it doesn't work like this. It works like a white cheque.

I don't think that ££ amounts would make sense - but perhaps if the amount was more than X% different from the previous draw on the same DD then it flagged it to the account holder or something?

Doesn't seem like a bad thing to add to the system.

It would break the current system to add in any kind of check prior to payment, which is why the guarantee exists to fix any problems after payment.

It saves money simply because the vast majority of payments can go through the system without any delays to additional verifications.

CSI_Yorkshire

MWT said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

pieroabcd said:

Robin9 said:

pieroabcd said:

Does the energy provider collect money the same day that they release the bills or is there enough time to check that everything is alright?

Usually about 2 weeks

It's a nice workaround for a system that I consider ill conceived. Thankfully there is .

I think that it's very reasonable to imagine a system authorising a DD not higher than a given monthly threshold (say for example 500 pounds for energy, 50 for telephone, 30 for water and so on) but evidently it doesn't work like this. It works like a white cheque.

I don't think that ££ amounts would make sense - but perhaps if the amount was more than X% different from the previous draw on the same DD then it flagged it to the account holder or something?

Doesn't seem like a bad thing to add to the system.

It would break the current system to add in any kind of check prior to payment, which is why the guarantee exists to fix any problems after payment.

It saves money simply because the vast majority of payments can go through the system without any delays to additional verifications.

That makes sense I suppose - I wouldn't expect many transactions to get flagged for this extra check but if it would slow the whole system down by working out which ones needed to be flagged then that obviously wouldn't be a good thing.

I don't really know how the system works in the background, but if the guarantee isn't giving the OP the feeling of security that they need, doesn't that suggest something needs improving?

MWT

CSI_Yorkshire said:

I don't really know how the system works in the background, but if the guarantee isn't giving the OP the feeling of security that they need, doesn't that suggest something needs improving?

More explaining perhaps, but I wouldn't tinker with the entire DD system to 'improve' it, better to point out that there are alternatives if anyone is not reassured when they understand how the guarantee works.

Right now the process works quickly and cheaply because it only deals with the genuine exceptions.

So when a supplier submits the DD list for processing, the payments will be sent to the supplier before the customer's bank has even checked if the customer has the funds to cover the payment.

Then as an exception, the bank will reclaim the funds from the supplier for any customers who could not cover the payment. This is one reason why a lot of suppliers do not immediately show the DD payment as received in the customer account as they have to wait a couple of days to ensure the payment is not being reclaimed and also why most banks will charge a customer if they lack the funds to cover a DD. .

mmmmikey

pieroabcd said:

EssexHebridean said:

Why do you expect that they will charge you incorrectly? I mean, it's always possible, but you have a note of the old reading immediately prior to the meter change, so if the initial bill after the change comes up incorrectly you can challenge it as soon as it's raised, surely? Many people have meter changes each and every month,  but reports of people being charged as though their old meter has "gone around the clock" are unsurprisingly very rare indeed. 

Why? Past experience, mine and someone else's.

Does the energy provider collect money the same day that they release the bills or is there enough time to check that everything is alright?

More info here:

https://www.directdebit.co.uk/faqs/managing-direct-debits/

The energy company has to give you enough notice (normally at least 10 working days) if the payment amount changes. This is specifically done to give you enough time to query it if necessary. With most banks you can cancel the direct debit with a days notice to stop the payment going out, although best to give them a couple of days if possible.

Although cancelling your direct debit can put you on a higher tariff, in practice I suspect it is unlikely that the energy company would do that if the reason you'd cancel was because of their error and you reinstated it after the error was corrected. I cancelled a DD with EDF in error once and it was easy enough to set up again and there was no question of additional charges even though it was my fault.

Having said that, as others have said I really do think your worrying unnecessarily as meter swaps are routine and AFAIK usually trouble free. I can see why your own experience makes you wary though.

MorningcoffeeIV

CSI_Yorkshire said:

MWT said:

CSI_Yorkshire said:

pieroabcd said:

Robin9 said:

pieroabcd said:

Does the energy provider collect money the same day that they release the bills or is there enough time to check that everything is alright?

Usually about 2 weeks

It's a nice workaround for a system that I consider ill conceived. Thankfully there is .

I think that it's very reasonable to imagine a system authorising a DD not higher than a given monthly threshold (say for example 500 pounds for energy, 50 for telephone, 30 for water and so on) but evidently it doesn't work like this. It works like a white cheque.

I don't think that ££ amounts would make sense - but perhaps if the amount was more than X% different from the previous draw on the same DD then it flagged it to the account holder or something?

Doesn't seem like a bad thing to add to the system.

It would break the current system to add in any kind of check prior to payment, which is why the guarantee exists to fix any problems after payment.

It saves money simply because the vast majority of payments can go through the system without any delays to additional verifications.

I don't really know how the system works in the background, but if the guarantee isn't giving the OP the feeling of security that they need, doesn't that suggest something needs improving?

No. It suggests there is a level of paranoia amongst a cohort of customers that others may not wish to pay to address. 

Mobtr

pieroabcd said:

frugalmacdugal said:

Hi.

why not set up your own wee spreadsheet, record usage, at least once a month, keep track of cost.

You said you use 'thousands of m3 of gas' is this weekly/monthly, any record of recent usage?

Nothing like that. I started with 3109 with the old meter, and after a week I ended up with 3110.
The new meter started with 0 and went to 3.5. The only problem is if the accounting system doesn't consider that I've changed meter: in this case  it's easy to see that it could be considered a consumption of almost 7000 m3.

It’s very unlikely this would happen as the reading would fail validity & if it did it would flag up as a higher than expected bill so would get checked. 

OP can you let us know if this happens as you expect or if everything updates correctly as everyone else expects? 

pieroabcd

Mobtr said:

pieroabcd said:

frugalmacdugal said:

Hi.

why not set up your own wee spreadsheet, record usage, at least once a month, keep track of cost.

You said you use 'thousands of m3 of gas' is this weekly/monthly, any record of recent usage?

Nothing like that. I started with 3109 with the old meter, and after a week I ended up with 3110.
The new meter started with 0 and went to 3.5. The only problem is if the accounting system doesn't consider that I've changed meter: in this case  it's easy to see that it could be considered a consumption of almost 7000 m3.

It’s very unlikely this would happen as the reading would fail validity & if it did it would flag up as a higher than expected bill so would get checked. 

OP can you let us know if this happens as you expect or if everything updates correctly as everyone else expects? 

Of course