Step-mother concerns re fathers money

NoTB

Hello 

My father and step mother recently brought up the fact they are getting a Will in place. The house they are currently living in was bought outright using solely my fathers funds after the marital home between him and my mother was sold. She made several comments that 1. “Everybody thinks it was just your father who bought this house” and that she “put just as much into the house that he has, if not more”. Utter nonsense. 

Before she met my father she lived in a council flat, working a minimum wage job and previously told us of the struggles it was to even pay the rent on her flat to the point her son would sometimes pay the rent for her. She does not come from, or have, money hidden away but as soon as the Will conversation was had, she now claims that she has a substantial “trust fund” and a “very large” pension therefore has more than my father thus entitles her to split the house with her two sons in addition to my fathers 4 (6 ways instead of the original 4). She claimed to have inheritance of £15k from her parents although we are very dubious as to where this money came from given we know her parents were also poor who struggled, used food banks etc and did not own their home. Also, we didn’t actually see the £15k rather it was spent on building materials for the house therefore we’re suspicious she actually got finance and there was no “inheritance”.

My father is self employed and doesn’t have a pension and all his money is either in savings or the house. 

Does she need to prove that she has all of this supposedly hidden away money when writing a Will or is her word just taken at face value? 

Thanks

RAS

I hope that they are getting two wills in place? One each.

The complication is that normally beneficiaries aren't in the same room as the donor, but spouses may be.

Do they own the house as joint tenants, tenants in common or in his name only?

What one of my families did was split one half of the estate between all the children including half and step children, and the other half solely between the blood line.

sheramber

If the house is in joint ownership it will automatically belong to the spouse that survives.

If it is owned as tenants in common then each owner can leave their share to whoever they want. 
 
Your father can stipulate in his will who benefits from his estate  but his wife can make a claim for her legal rights , if appropriate.

Your father needs to decide what he wants to happen to his estate and get his will drawn up by a solicitor to ensure it is properly drawn up.

Similarly, his wife can leave her estate to whoever she wishes.

It is a matter for both parties to sort out, not any potential beneficiaries.
 

MalMonroe

My daughter is in the position where her dad is living overseas with his 4th wife and he owns properties in Australia and the country he's in at present. He bought both himself, no input from his wife. He's told our daughter that he no longer has a will (he did when he was with wife number 2 though and I was an executor - we're on friendly terms - although not always the case) because he has married a few times and now the wills he made in the past are worthless.

For a long time I felt it didn't matter, that he would leave our daughter something, as he is far better off than I am and although she can have everything I leave, I don't own property so she's not going to be wealthy by any means. But now we are aware that if he dies intestate, it'll all go to his wife and her two daughters. The two properties, all his worldly goods, everything. We don't think that his wife will pass anything on. Even though there are two properties. And I don't mean small houses, either.

My daughter has reconciled to this and is expecting nothing whatsoever when he dies. Fortunately she is savvy enough to have made her own way in the world, in spite of suffering from a debilitating illness for over 20 years. If she does get something, brilliant. If not, oh well. Even though he and I were divorced, he's been a  really brilliant dad and she loves him unreservedly. That is what she considers to be the most important thing, she couldn't care less about what she'll get when he's no longer here. She doesn't want to lose him. 

It doesn't matter what your dad's wife did or where she lived before she married him. She's his wife and deserves some respect simply because of that. He loves her, obviously so you have to like it or lump it. If she had to struggle in the past, don't you think it's good that she's now married to someone who can ensure that she doesn't have to struggle now?

A will should just contain the wishes of the person who made it, not their full financial background. Your stepmother's solicitor will guide her and not just take her word for anything, in the will-making process.

As sheramber says above, it's not for beneficiaries to sort anything out.

My advice would be to expect nothing because everything else is going to be a bonus - and try to enjoy time with your dad and his wife without bitterness or grudges while they're here. You will honestly really feel a lot better for it.

NoTB

Thanks for the replies.

For clarity, not expecting, nor wanting anything. I’d give away everything to have some more time with him. 

1. I believe the house was bought solely by my father and is in his name only. Value is ~£80k.

2. We are merely concerned she is lying, given her background, in order to benefit both herself and her sons. My father has said he is willing to stipulate in the Will that the house is split six ways as long as her “trust fund” and “pension” are also split six ways to make it fair. She is saying “of course”, but has provided no evidence that she has anything other than her word. 

My question was simply does she need to prove to the solicitor when drawing up a Will that these things actually exist or does the solicitor just draw up what she asks?

Appreciate the matter is for the spouses to sort out but I just don’t want my father getting wronged. 

Just to also add - there is absolutely no bitterness between us. I love her but she has been bad for us as a family over the years so we are wary of her actions and motives in certain situations, such as this. 

doodling

Hi,

She doesn't need to prove anything at all when drawing up her will - she could leave you a Ferrari if she wanted but if she didn't have one when she died then it would have no effect.

Your Dad can draw up his will as he chooses, he can ask his wife for proof of anything he wants and if he doesn't get it he can write his will accordingly.

Note that both parties can change their will whenever they choose so even if she does write a will saying something that makes your Dad happy, she could change it the following week - you can't rely on what is written in a will until that person has died (and even then there may be complications).

Whilst the house is entirely in your Dad's name, if that makes up the majority of their assets and he doesn't make provision for her in some way then the will may to be open to challenge.  Not making provision for his wife's children is unlikely to be open to challenge however unless they are currently dependant on him in some way.

Your Dad needs to talk to the solicitor drawing up his will explaining what he wants to achieve.  If your Dad is concerned that his wife might say things that are untrue or might change her will after his death then he needs to tell his solicitor that so that his will can be written accordingly.  They may need to have separate appointments with the solicitor, or use different solicitors so that they can speak freely.

Keep_pedalling

The best option for your father would be to make a will leaving his home to his children and giving his wife a life interest through an immediate post death interest trust. That protects both his children’s inheritance and her long term security.

If he takes this option he needs to be honest with her and advise her to leave all her assets to her children.

Pollycat

NoTB said:

Hello 

My father and step mother recently brought up the fact they are getting a Will in place. The house they are currently living in was bought outright using solely my fathers funds after the marital home between him and my mother was sold. She made several comments that 1. “Everybody thinks it was just your father who bought this house” and that she “put just as much into the house that he has, if not more”. Utter nonsense. 

Before she met my father she lived in a council flat, working a minimum wage job and previously told us of the struggles it was to even pay the rent on her flat to the point her son would sometimes pay the rent for her. She does not come from, or have, money hidden away but as soon as the Will conversation was had, she now claims that she has a substantial “trust fund” and a “very large” pension therefore has more than my father thus entitles her to split the house with her two sons in addition to my fathers 4 (6 ways instead of the original 4). She claimed to have inheritance of £15k from her parents although we are very dubious as to where this money came from given we know her parents were also poor who struggled, used food banks etc and did not own their home. Also, we didn’t actually see the £15k rather it was spent on building materials for the house therefore we’re suspicious she actually got finance and there was no “inheritance”.

My father is self employed and doesn’t have a pension and all his money is either in savings or the house. 

Does she need to prove that she has all of this supposedly hidden away money when writing a Will or is her word just taken at face value? 

Thanks

What does your Father think to this idea?

Why do you think you (and presumably your siblings) should have seen proof of the £15k she allegedly put into this new house?

Flugelhorn

NoTB said:

My question was simply does she need to prove to the solicitor when drawing up a Will that these things actually exist or does the solicitor just draw up what she asks?

No solicitor will draw up what she asks. he has no idea what she owns or might own in the future. She may say "I leave the property X" to my children but if she doesn't own the property as it was solely owned by your father then there is nothing to leave

NoTB

Pollycat said:

NoTB said:

Hello 

My father and step mother recently brought up the fact they are getting a Will in place. The house they are currently living in was bought outright using solely my fathers funds after the marital home between him and my mother was sold. She made several comments that 1. “Everybody thinks it was just your father who bought this house” and that she “put just as much into the house that he has, if not more”. Utter nonsense. 

Before she met my father she lived in a council flat, working a minimum wage job and previously told us of the struggles it was to even pay the rent on her flat to the point her son would sometimes pay the rent for her. She does not come from, or have, money hidden away but as soon as the Will conversation was had, she now claims that she has a substantial “trust fund” and a “very large” pension therefore has more than my father thus entitles her to split the house with her two sons in addition to my fathers 4 (6 ways instead of the original 4). She claimed to have inheritance of £15k from her parents although we are very dubious as to where this money came from given we know her parents were also poor who struggled, used food banks etc and did not own their home. Also, we didn’t actually see the £15k rather it was spent on building materials for the house therefore we’re suspicious she actually got finance and there was no “inheritance”.

My father is self employed and doesn’t have a pension and all his money is either in savings or the house. 

Does she need to prove that she has all of this supposedly hidden away money when writing a Will or is her word just taken at face value? 

Thanks

What does your Father think to this idea?

Why do you think you (and presumably your siblings) should have seen proof of the £15k she allegedly put into this new house?

Father is happy to do this as long as, in his words, “my children get a share of what you have”. Which we have absolutely no problem with (and I’d have no problem if he gave his house to the dogs trust), it’s simply we don’t want him blindly trusting her given her past antics.

Re the £15k - a few years ago my father began to receive some very strange debt collection letters from Lowell and others, totalling an amount not so dis-similar to what she claimed to have received. It looks very likely to my siblings and I that she took finance out in his name and claimed this was inheritance. My father has no need for credit and has not looked at his credit file in 10+ years so he would be none the wiser if something were amiss here. We have no way to prove this but it looks very suspicious. My father brushes it off that “it must be a mistake” as we presume he doesn’t want to rock the boat with her. 

I appreciate the above is hard to believe and may sound far fetched. You may even think there is some sort of grudge here. But as I say, I love her but she is trouble and has a history of dodgy antics.

I do believe the question has been answered and I suppose it’s up to him if he blindly believes her claims of Monopoly money. Thanks 

Scorpio33

Just to play devils advocate....

Lets say dad dies first, property is sold and split 6 ways.

What is then stopping her from changing her will after the fact?

Or lets assume she can't change her will - how can you possibly ensure the value of her trust fund / pension are equitable to the value of the house? Its impossible. Lets assume she spends her pension fund & most of the trust fund before she dies - result is no more inherentace.

If I was your dad, I wouldn't put any stipulations about the house being split as long as she does the same. 

However, it is ultimately up to your dad, if he wants to transfer everything to her now and live as a pauper whilst she enjoys his house, that is up to him. All you can do is advise him and be there for him.