Elderly parents - no will

WickedWitch123

Hi all
Was just after a bit of advice please in what I think is not a straight forward situation.  So my parents are elderly (mid 80s) and my mum has dementia.  Me and my brother have managed to get LPA done but they will not do a will, they are just not interested (sigh).  My parents have 2 children (me and my brother) in the UK, but there are also children abroad in 3 different countries.  These children were born before us and before my mum and dad got together (so have different mums/dads).  I know we will eventually need legal advice but what will happen without a will? Anything I can research beforehand?
Thanks
WW

tacpot12

This tool on the GOV.UK site can help: Intestacy - who inherits if someone dies without a will? - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

If you go through the tool and answer the question as though it was your mother (or father) that died first it will tell you the situation that will apply at that point. With that in mind, you can then repeat the exercise for the second person to die. The tool will tell you what will apply at that point. 

You are likely to need legal advice, or more correctly, the next of kin that wants to apply for letters of administration are likely to need legal advice. 

In England, it doesn't matter who was born before whom or whether they are overseas or not, if they are natural or adopted children (but not step-children), they can inherit from their parent. I don't know about other jurisdictions. 

These rules apply to the assets that your parents have in the relevant juristiction you select when using the tool. If they have assets outside of the UK, then usually the country's rules of intestacy apply depending on where the assets are located. 

WickedWitch123

tacpot12 said:

This tool on the GOV.UK site can help: Intestacy - who inherits if someone dies without a will? - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

If you go through the tool and answer the question as though it was your mother (or father) that died first it will tell you the situation that will apply at that point. With that in mind, you can then repeat the exercise for the second person to die. The tool will tell you what will apply at that point. 

You are likely to need legal advice, or more correctly, the next of kin that wants to apply for letters of administration are likely to need legal advice. 

In England, it doesn't matter who was born before whom or whether they are overseas or not, if they are natural or adopted children (but not step-children), they can inherit from their parent. I don't know about other jurisdictions. 

These rules apply to the assets that your parents have in the relevant juristiction you select when using the tool. If they have assets outside of the UK, then usually the country's rules of intestacy apply depending on where the assets are located. 

Thank you so much for your quick reply.  I shall have a go at the tool. 

Thanks

WW

Mojisola

WickedWitch123 said:

So my parents are elderly (mid 80s) and my mum has dementia. 

My parents have 2 children (me and my brother) in the UK, but there are also children abroad in 3 different countries.  These children were born before us and before my mum and dad got together (so have different mums/dads). 

what will happen without a will?

I feel for you - it will get messy.

Only the children of the survivor will inherit from the estate - although the legal beneficiaries could be very generous and do a deed of variation to distribute the estate between all the children of the couple. 

Do your parents really want to risk their older children to be disinherited? 

Maybe they do, in which case intestacy won't be a problem.

elsien

If your mum has dementia then she may or may not have capacity to make a will. 

Have they said why they don’t want to - some people just don’t want to go there whereas others think there’s no need because the people they want to inherit will do so anyway. 

Are they property owners, and if so how is the property owned - joint tenant, tenant in common? 

theoretica

Roughly how large will your parents' estate be?  Is their house owned as joint tenants or tenants in common? 

If the estate of the first to die is worth more than 270k then a portion will go to the children of the deceased, not all to the surviving spouse.  This could cause challenges if they are asset rich but without much cash, for instance.

Keep_pedalling

Does you mother have sufficient mental capacity to make a will?

WickedWitch123

Mojisola said:

WickedWitch123 said:

So my parents are elderly (mid 80s) and my mum has dementia. 

My parents have 2 children (me and my brother) in the UK, but there are also children abroad in 3 different countries.  These children were born before us and before my mum and dad got together (so have different mums/dads). 

what will happen without a will?

I feel for you - it will get messy.

Only the children of the survivor will inherit from the estate - although the legal beneficiaries could be very generous and do a deed of variation to distribute the estate between all the children of the couple. 

Do your parents really want to risk their older children to be disinherited? 

Maybe they do, in which case intestacy won't be a problem.

Yes this is our worry.  I don't know my siblings at all - we have no contact whatsoever and they don't with their respective parents either.  My mum does not have the mental capacity anymore so its all on my dad and he is 100% not interested in even talking about it.  It took us 4 years to get the LPA done and that was only with the help of the  Alzheimers society, they were brilliant.  The sense is now that he's done enough and doesn't want to be bothered with anything else.

Thank you for clarifying about the children of the survivor, that was my thinking too.  My mum has 2 other children and my dad has 4 others, so there's 8 of us in total but who misses out depends on which of my parents passes first.

WickedWitch123

elsien said:

If your mum has dementia then she may or may not have capacity to make a will. 

Have they said why they don’t want to - some people just don’t want to go there whereas others think there’s no need because the people they want to inherit will do so anyway. 

Are they property owners, and if so how is the property owned - joint tenant, tenant in common? 

She still has some capacity, but its a now or never situation as it is diminishing day by day.  

My dad just literally cannot be bothered with it all (his words).  We've just done the LPA for them both and it took years for him to agree to this.  In this defence he's caring for his wife of 40+ years and is unwell himself so I suppose its just too much.  We have offered all the support we can but its his decision when push comes to shove.  

yes they are joint tenants, they own their house outright now.  My dad also owns large pieces of land and property abroad but my head can't even go there because its just too complicated.  Nothing has been sorted over the years and nothing in writing.

WickedWitch123

Keep_pedalling said:

Does you mother have sufficient mental capacity to make a will?

Yes to a degree but not for much longer.  The Alzheimers society have been such a massive help but even they have said if they don't want to make a will there's not much we can do.

WickedWitch123

theoretica said:

Roughly how large will your parents' estate be?  Is their house owned as joint tenants or tenants in common? 

If the estate of the first to die is worth more than 270k then a portion will go to the children of the deceased, not all to the surviving spouse.  This could cause challenges if they are asset rich but without much cash, for instance.

The house will be worth around the £250k mark.  They are joint tenants.  Cash in the bank i would say around the £80k mark.  My dad has property and land abroad but I have no way of knowing or finding out where or what.  If my dad passes first then my mum will need to go into a care home.