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BBC: Where property prices are set by what local people earn

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  • housebuyer143
    housebuyer143 Posts: 4,284 Forumite
    1,000 Posts Third Anniversary Name Dropper
    BobT36 said:
    If mortgage is set by 3.5X earnings then house prices need to get back down to there too
    Over a million people in the UK manage to buy a property every single year, even in the current climate.
    So the obvious answer for those complaining they can't afford to buy is for them to either buy something cheaper or instead better themselves to improve their earnings. Why should the rest of us be brought down to the lowest common denominator? :p

    I do feel that many first time buyers have unrealistic expectations, wanting to purchase a 3 bed semi as thier first house or larger, all done out immaculate etc. 
    It's called a ladder for a reason and people need to have realistic expectations when buying their first place if they don't have the money to buy what they are dreaming of. 

    If we ignore the south east it is very possible to get on the housing ladder if people set their sights a little smaller initially.
    The average age of FTBers is now 34... Most of those will be renting and putting off having kids due to that. Dangerously close to infertility years (especially if not had the first already). 

    Guess what happens when no-one is having kids anymore as they can't get anything better than a 1 bed flat in dangerous areas... No more pensions being paid for current retirees! 

    That, or even more mass immigration. 

    FTBers are no longer 19 year olds wanting to get their first foot on the property ladder and happy with a small 1-2 bed flat/terrace..
    Do people really put off kids until they buy? Not that I have noticed. 
    Someone in a 2 bed could easily fit two kids and two adults but they don't want to and so they complain how they can't afford to buy anywhere when in reality they could afford to if they either comprised on area or bought something smaller. Why can't a 34 year old buy a 2 bed flat? 

    Everyone I know and worked with managed to buy a house in their 20s. Some bought in the city but went for 2 beds, the others moved 30 mins out and bought 3 beds for the same price. You make compromises until you can get into the house you want in the area you want - most people can't buy their dream home right off the bat.

  • MobileSaver
    MobileSaver Posts: 4,372 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper
    edited 24 January at 5:59PM
    If mortgage is set by 3.5X earnings then house prices need to get back down to there too
    Over a million people in the UK manage to buy a property every single year, even in the current climate.
    So the obvious answer for those complaining they can't afford to buy is for them to either buy something cheaper or instead better themselves to improve their earnings. Why should the rest of us be brought down to the lowest common denominator? :p

    It's really sad that people think this is acceptable. ... It's not at all wrong to want the same opportunities your parents and grandparents had.
    Young people have far more opportunities and a much easier and more comfortable life than their parents and grandparents ever had.
    I find it really sad that some people just focus on high house prices and ignore everything else when they could be appreciating all the incredible benefits and improvements introduced by the hard work, tenacity and inventiveness of previous generations.
    Up until the age of around 11 our home was one bedroom which was shared by us five children while our parents slept on a sofa bed in the lounge. Today's generation come on to this forum asking how they can get an extra bedroom because they have a newborn on the way, the sense of entitlement is palpable!

    This argument that some people had it bad in the past is not a justification for people having it bad now.
    Thanks for proving my point; the younger generation have a huge number of opportunities and improvements to quality of life that their parents and grandparents couldn't even have dreamed of, yet some just want to whinge and moan about house prices while disregarding all the positive things.
    nobody has to have 5 kids if they can't afford it.
    I don't remember going without anything; my parents fed us, clothed us and we had toys to play with.
    The difference is that there was no sense of entitlement to brand new clothes, brand new toys or a bedroom each. Clothes and toys (often second-hand already) were handed down to younger siblings while bunk beds allowed us to share a single room.
    My parents got married in the local church and the reception was in the local social club, not on a beach in the Maldives costing five figures. They drove an old car bought with cash not a brand new model on HP. Many people we knew lived in old two-up, two-down terraces regardless of how many kids they had, people just made do and didn't expect everything to be brand new and shiny.
    The fundamental problem is that the younger generation don't understand or care about any of this, they just see the previous generations living in nice houses in nice areas and want the same, completely overlooking that it took those people decades of earning a living to get where they are now.

    You didn't go without anything, but there were 5 of you to a bedroom? ... You should not expect people to raise children if they can't properly house them. Incredible that has to be said in 2023 but here you are.
    Thank you for yet again completely and utterly proving my point. :D
    We were kids and didn't know or care that you could have your own bedroom. We were properly housed; we had a roof over our heads and a warm and dry home to live in.
    The fact you are aghast that we shared a room says all anyone needs to know about how entitled some of the younger generation are.

    Every generation blames the one before...
    Mike + The Mechanics - The Living Years
  • Sunsaru
    Sunsaru Posts: 737 Forumite
    500 Posts Second Anniversary Photogenic Name Dropper
    edited 24 January at 5:59PM
    If mortgage is set by 3.5X earnings then house prices need to get back down to there too
    Over a million people in the UK manage to buy a property every single year, even in the current climate.
    So the obvious answer for those complaining they can't afford to buy is for them to either buy something cheaper or instead better themselves to improve their earnings. Why should the rest of us be brought down to the lowest common denominator? :p

    It's really sad that people think this is acceptable. ... It's not at all wrong to want the same opportunities your parents and grandparents had.
    Young people have far more opportunities and a much easier and more comfortable life than their parents and grandparents ever had.
    I find it really sad that some people just focus on high house prices and ignore everything else when they could be appreciating all the incredible benefits and improvements introduced by the hard work, tenacity and inventiveness of previous generations.
    Up until the age of around 11 our home was one bedroom which was shared by us five children while our parents slept on a sofa bed in the lounge. Today's generation come on to this forum asking how they can get an extra bedroom because they have a newborn on the way, the sense of entitlement is palpable!

    This argument that some people had it bad in the past is not a justification for people having it bad now.
    Thanks for proving my point; the younger generation have a huge number of opportunities and improvements to quality of life that their parents and grandparents couldn't even have dreamed of, yet some just want to whinge and moan about house prices while disregarding all the positive things.
    nobody has to have 5 kids if they can't afford it.
    I don't remember going without anything; my parents fed us, clothed us and we had toys to play with.
    The difference is that there was no sense of entitlement to brand new clothes, brand new toys or a bedroom each. Clothes and toys (often second-hand already) were handed down to younger siblings while bunk beds allowed us to share a single room.
    My parents got married in the local church and the reception was in the local social club, not on a beach in the Maldives costing five figures. They drove an old car bought with cash not a brand new model on HP. Many people we knew lived in old two-up, two-down terraces regardless of how many kids they had, people just made do and didn't expect everything to be brand new and shiny.
    The fundamental problem is that the younger generation don't understand or care about any of this, they just see the previous generations living in nice houses in nice areas and want the same, completely overlooking that it took those people decades of earning a living to get where they are now.

    You didn't go without anything, but there were 5 of you to a bedroom? ... You should not expect people to raise children if they can't properly house them. Incredible that has to be said in 2023 but here you are.
    Thank you for yet again completely and utterly proving my point. :D
    We were kids and didn't know or care that you could have your own bedroom. We were properly housed; we had a roof over our heads and a warm and dry home to live in.
    The fact you are aghast that we shared a room says all anyone needs to know about how entitled some of the younger generation are.

    I think it's harsh to call the younger generation entitled. They only know what we've taught them. They haven't lived what we've lived and we haven't lived what our parents generation lived. Could you live through a time when bombs could (and in some cases did) drop on the house next door? Do you think thats okay? The biggest problem is that we don't empathise enough with other generations. I look at my 10 year old daughter and sometimes regret bringing her into this world because of what she's going to have to face not only as a female, but the current state of the world. What the current generations are facing is real and hard to them because that's all they know. You should see the face of my partner's 21 y/o son when I tell him about times before a mobile phone! :confused:

    We, as the supposed "adults in the room" should be looking forward on how to make the world a better place and schemes like this could be the start instead of just saying "Well I had it tough so deal with it".
    Nothing is foolproof to a talented fool.
  • housebuyer143
    housebuyer143 Posts: 4,284 Forumite
    1,000 Posts Third Anniversary Name Dropper
    edited 24 January at 5:59PM
    Sunsaru said:
    If mortgage is set by 3.5X earnings then house prices need to get back down to there too
    Over a million people in the UK manage to buy a property every single year, even in the current climate.
    So the obvious answer for those complaining they can't afford to buy is for them to either buy something cheaper or instead better themselves to improve their earnings. Why should the rest of us be brought down to the lowest common denominator? :p

    It's really sad that people think this is acceptable. ... It's not at all wrong to want the same opportunities your parents and grandparents had.
    Young people have far more opportunities and a much easier and more comfortable life than their parents and grandparents ever had.
    I find it really sad that some people just focus on high house prices and ignore everything else when they could be appreciating all the incredible benefits and improvements introduced by the hard work, tenacity and inventiveness of previous generations.
    Up until the age of around 11 our home was one bedroom which was shared by us five children while our parents slept on a sofa bed in the lounge. Today's generation come on to this forum asking how they can get an extra bedroom because they have a newborn on the way, the sense of entitlement is palpable!

    This argument that some people had it bad in the past is not a justification for people having it bad now.
    Thanks for proving my point; the younger generation have a huge number of opportunities and improvements to quality of life that their parents and grandparents couldn't even have dreamed of, yet some just want to whinge and moan about house prices while disregarding all the positive things.
    nobody has to have 5 kids if they can't afford it.
    I don't remember going without anything; my parents fed us, clothed us and we had toys to play with.
    The difference is that there was no sense of entitlement to brand new clothes, brand new toys or a bedroom each. Clothes and toys (often second-hand already) were handed down to younger siblings while bunk beds allowed us to share a single room.
    My parents got married in the local church and the reception was in the local social club, not on a beach in the Maldives costing five figures. They drove an old car bought with cash not a brand new model on HP. Many people we knew lived in old two-up, two-down terraces regardless of how many kids they had, people just made do and didn't expect everything to be brand new and shiny.
    The fundamental problem is that the younger generation don't understand or care about any of this, they just see the previous generations living in nice houses in nice areas and want the same, completely overlooking that it took those people decades of earning a living to get where they are now.

    You didn't go without anything, but there were 5 of you to a bedroom? ... You should not expect people to raise children if they can't properly house them. Incredible that has to be said in 2023 but here you are.
    Thank you for yet again completely and utterly proving my point. :D
    We were kids and didn't know or care that you could have your own bedroom. We were properly housed; we had a roof over our heads and a warm and dry home to live in.
    The fact you are aghast that we shared a room says all anyone needs to know about how entitled some of the younger generation are.

    I think it's harsh to call the younger generation entitled. They only know what we've taught them. They haven't lived what we've lived and we haven't lived what our parents generation lived. Could you live through a time when bombs could (and in some cases did) drop on the house next door? Do you think thats okay? The biggest problem is that we don't empathise enough with other generations. I look at my 10 year old daughter and regret bringing her into this world because of what she's going to have to face not only and a female, but the current state of the world. What the current generations are facing is real and hard to them because that's all they know. You should see the face of my partner's 21 y/o son when I tell him about times before a mobile phone! :confused:

    We, as the supposed "adults in the room" should be looking forward on how to make the world a better place and schemes like this could be the start instead of just saying "Well I had it tough so deal with it".
    Really like this response. I personally would hate to be a child/teenager growing up at the moment. 
    I think back fondly to a time where my every embarrassing moment was not captured on camera to be relived over and over (esp at school), where the internet was in its infancy and wasn't the depressing doom and gloom it is now, and the days where you learnt to entertain yourself because you didn't have a phone glued to your hand. It is no surprise mental illness is so high for kids now. 
    Every generation has it's challenges.
  • Sarah1Mitty2
    Sarah1Mitty2 Posts: 1,838 Forumite
    1,000 Posts First Anniversary Name Dropper
    edited 24 January at 5:59PM
    If mortgage is set by 3.5X earnings then house prices need to get back down to there too
    Over a million people in the UK manage to buy a property every single year, even in the current climate.
    So the obvious answer for those complaining they can't afford to buy is for them to either buy something cheaper or instead better themselves to improve their earnings. Why should the rest of us be brought down to the lowest common denominator? :p

    It's really sad that people think this is acceptable. ... It's not at all wrong to want the same opportunities your parents and grandparents had.
    Young people have far more opportunities and a much easier and more comfortable life than their parents and grandparents ever had.
    I find it really sad that some people just focus on high house prices and ignore everything else when they could be appreciating all the incredible benefits and improvements introduced by the hard work, tenacity and inventiveness of previous generations.
    Up until the age of around 11 our home was one bedroom which was shared by us five children while our parents slept on a sofa bed in the lounge. Today's generation come on to this forum asking how they can get an extra bedroom because they have a newborn on the way, the sense of entitlement is palpable!

    Both mostly due to cheap credit which wasn`t available to previous generations, and both going into reverse as interest rates rise.
  • Sarah1Mitty2
    Sarah1Mitty2 Posts: 1,838 Forumite
    1,000 Posts First Anniversary Name Dropper

    The fundamental problem is that the younger generation don't understand or care about any of this, they just see the previous generations living in nice houses in nice areas and want the same, completely overlooking that it took those people decades of earning a living to get where they are now.

    I think the fundamental problem is actually people making sweeping (and demonstrably inaccurate) statements about whole generations. 


    And misunderstanding the economic drivers that brought us here.........
  • Sarah1Mitty2
    Sarah1Mitty2 Posts: 1,838 Forumite
    1,000 Posts First Anniversary Name Dropper
    spoovy said:
    Many people on here seem to believe that there is a "natural limit" to house prices, as there is with bread or fuel, where society begins to unravel beyond a certain point. But this is not true. Having somewhere to live is a basic human necessity like bread or fuel; but owning property is not.
    There is no upper limit to the differential between incomes and house prices for this reason. I see no reason why, say one hundred years from now, owning your own house won't be considered a rare luxury.
    The upper limit is borrowing costs, we have just hit the upper limit unfortunately.
  • Altior
    Altior Posts: 1,144 Forumite
    1,000 Posts Fifth Anniversary Name Dropper
    current state of the world

    Yours is a well intended post but this highlights the predicament. If you have the attitude that your daughter has it bad, this will surely permeate through to her. They are bombarded online and through news channels, education et al that everything is bad. The world is going to burn up. We can either heat or eat. I believe the modern term for it is gaslighting. To be born, in the UK in 2012/13 is one of the luckiest times and places to be born in human history (even as a female!). I wish we could start telling kids that they should take the (vast) opportunities that they do have, and how fortunate they really are. 

    And yes, it's not their fault that they are being gas lit. But, unfortunately, many mature adults (who should know better) encourage and ramp up the bitterness, often for political reasons. I did not grow up with the worry that at any time, a bomb could drop on my house. However, my parents and good educators did teach me what it was like for people who grew up without the opportunities I enjoyed. I never felt like the world owed me, I felt like I had to go out and get it. 
  • Sunsaru
    Sunsaru Posts: 737 Forumite
    500 Posts Second Anniversary Photogenic Name Dropper
    Altior said:
    current state of the world

    Yours is a well intended post but this highlights the predicament. If you have the attitude that your daughter has it bad, this will surely permeate through to her. They are bombarded online and through news channels, education et al that everything is bad. The world is going to burn up. We can either heat or eat. I believe the modern term for it is gaslighting. To be born, in the UK in 2012/13 is one of the luckiest times and places to be born in human history (even as a female!). I wish we could start telling kids that they should take the (vast) opportunities that they do have, and how fortunate they really are. 

    And yes, it's not their fault that they are being gas lit. But, unfortunately, many mature adults (who should know better) encourage and ramp up the bitterness, often for political reasons. I did not grow up with the worry that at any time, a bomb could drop on my house. However, my parents and good educators did teach me what it was like for people who grew up without the opportunities I enjoyed. I never felt like the world owed me, I felt like I had to go out and get it. 
    My post was meant more out of empathy than an overall attitude tbh. and re-reading it I missed out a key word when I started talking about my daughter. "Sometimes I regret...". (I'll edit the post)
    Nothing is foolproof to a talented fool.
  • Altior
    Altior Posts: 1,144 Forumite
    1,000 Posts Fifth Anniversary Name Dropper
    Yes Sunsaru, many thanks for clarifying and I did read it as well intended anyway, as I noted. However I feel it does show what the modern world is up against, in my opinion. The country is producing kids into adulthood who are pretty bitter, angry, and I do feel somewhat, entitled. There is no prospect in this situation being reversed. There's currency in clickbait and attention seeking, not so much in pragmatism.
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