Loopholes to rights

miznoma

It appears that buying /building any kind of property does not afford you the same rights as other purchases. We recently had an extension built following much discussion with the constructor as we wanted a view through the roof but needed to know about the effects of the sun.
We were assured that the blue tint solar control glass is designed to reduce the effects of heat and glare. We were so impressed that we asked if the blue tint could be added to some of the small vertical windows in the wall.

It became evident with the first show of the sun we could not be in that extension at all as the glare was blinding. We complained but got the shoulder shrug " we don't make the glass, we only tell you what the manufacturers claim" not our problem. 
So no joy from installer. Can't get to manufacturers of the glass.
Is it the case we have no claim?

eskbanker

Do you have any documentation explaining the characteristics of the glass, and can you demonstrate objectively that it doesn't meet its specifications?

user1977

Think you’re confused about the “loopholes” as you call them. Yes, if you buy a property certain consumer rights don’t apply (on the basis that you’ll generally have your own solicitor and surveyor advising you, it won’t be an impulse purchase, etc).

But that isn’t what you were doing. What exemption do you think applies for employing someone to build an extension? If the specification of the glazing was in the contract then you can (in theory) enforce that.

Aylesbury_Duck

There is no loophole.  If what was specified was not supplied, then you have the right to a resolution.  If it's purely a matter of subjectivity (you consider the glare to be excessive but the product has reduced glare by the promised amount) then you're reliant upon goodwill.

Grumpy_chap

miznoma said:

It appears that buying /building any kind of property does not afford you the same rights as other purchases. We recently had an extension built following much discussion with the constructor as we wanted a view through the roof but needed to know about the effects of the sun.
We were assured that the blue tint solar control glass is designed to reduce the effects of heat and glare. We were so impressed that we asked if the blue tint could be added to some of the small vertical windows in the wall.

It became evident with the first show of the sun we could not be in that extension at all as the glare was blinding. We complained but got the shoulder shrug " we don't make the glass, we only tell you what the manufacturers claim" not our problem. 
So no joy from installer. Can't get to manufacturers of the glass.
Is it the case we have no claim?

Is the glass the Pilkington product?
https://www.pilkington.com/en-gb/uk/products/product-categories/solar-control#

We have the blue tint solar control glass installed in our rear windows upstairs and not downstairs, on a south facing projection.  We can certainly notice the difference between the two on a hot day.  We can also recall the old glass which did not have the solar control and the rooms got much warmer before.

It is still glass, though, and the solar control is only a reduction in the heat gain, not an absolute control of the heat gain.  The glass is designed to still allow all the visible spectrum through, so very little change to how much light enters the room.  We still have blinds.

I would certainly get the same glass again and, in hindsight, wish we had the glass downstairs also.

I think expecting glass, in a roof light, to totally mitigate glare is rather optimistic.  Glare also depends what you have in the room and where.  In our study, I don't get glare on the screen, but my wife does - just one example.

What were you expecting with regard to the muting of sunlight?

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Hello OP

The builder is incorrect that he isn't responsible for what he said.

Can you advise whether your quote/final bill was detailed as:

glass £x
install £x

or glass and install £x 

(or perhaps it was just extension £x)?

This will determine whether the contract was supply or transfer of goods which affects which rights you may have.

tightauldgit

If you were promised something by a salesman that turns out not to be true you absolutely have rights. The problem is generally being able to show what you were promised because I imagine it's not written down anywhere.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

tightauldgit said:

If you were promised something by a salesman that turns out not to be true you absolutely have rights. The problem is generally being able to show what you were promised because I imagine it's not written down anywhere.

With regards to goods being of satisfactory quality this takes into account any public statement about the specific characteristics of the goods made by the trader, the producer or any representative of the trader or the producer.

I would expect a product such as this to have claims made by the manufacturer and possibly some kind of data sheet detailing how it reduces light and glare. 

There are 3 caveats to that requirement but I don't think they would apply in this instance, however that would I believe require the contract to be for supply rather than transfer.  

tightauldgit

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

tightauldgit said:

If you were promised something by a salesman that turns out not to be true you absolutely have rights. The problem is generally being able to show what you were promised because I imagine it's not written down anywhere.

With regards to goods being of satisfactory quality this takes into account any public statement about the specific characteristics of the goods made by the trader, the producer or any representative of the trader or the producer.

I would expect a product such as this to have claims made by the manufacturer and possibly some kind of data sheet detailing how it reduces light and glare. 

There are 3 caveats to that requirement but I don't think they would apply in this instance, however that would I believe require the contract to be for supply rather than transfer.  

yes the problem is the datasheet will have a technical spec which says X - but that's not how salespeople talk. When a salesman says 'if you fit this wonder glass then you won't have any problems with glare at all' then technically that's part of the contract too, but completely unenforceable. Then you have to rely on the tech specs which say 'reduces glare by 15% as measured by BS463527454839393Cy234B which of course it does but is not what the salesman promised you.  

Keep_pedalling

Just fit some blinds.

sheramber

the blue tint solar control glass is designed to reduce the effects of heat and glare. 

Reduce by how much?

Reduce does not mean elimjnate.