Ofgem to increase Winter Price Cap to cover cost of people not paying their bills.

The_Green_Hornet

MattMattMattUK said:

Qyburn said:

There's a small faction promoting the idea that removing the supplier's meter and fitting a replacement, in some way gives you free energy. As usual with these "something for nothing" theories, it's being promoted by people who make money carrying out that work. Octopus has started disconnecting and capping off supplies for some of these people but I do think that a few actual criminal prosecutions would do wonders.

They are often connected to the "freeman of the land" nutjobs. I agree, prosecutions are the way forward with those idiots. 

Nice turn of phrase. Do you mean people with mental health conditions?

EssexHebridean

The_Green_Hornet said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Qyburn said:

There's a small faction promoting the idea that removing the supplier's meter and fitting a replacement, in some way gives you free energy. As usual with these "something for nothing" theories, it's being promoted by people who make money carrying out that work. Octopus has started disconnecting and capping off supplies for some of these people but I do think that a few actual criminal prosecutions would do wonders.

They are often connected to the "freeman of the land" nutjobs. I agree, prosecutions are the way forward with those idiots. 

Nice turn of phrase. Do you mean people with mental health conditions?

I read it as meaning the sorts of idiots who cheerfully go round spreading false information and leading others into significant levels of trouble as a result, usually in spite of having the correct information provided to them repeatedly. This is absolutely NOT something that the vast majority of people with mental heath conditions do!   

MattMattMattUK

The_Green_Hornet said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Qyburn said:

There's a small faction promoting the idea that removing the supplier's meter and fitting a replacement, in some way gives you free energy. As usual with these "something for nothing" theories, it's being promoted by people who make money carrying out that work. Octopus has started disconnecting and capping off supplies for some of these people but I do think that a few actual criminal prosecutions would do wonders.

They are often connected to the "freeman of the land" nutjobs. I agree, prosecutions are the way forward with those idiots. 

Nice turn of phrase. Do you mean people with mental health conditions?

No, I mean those who spew dangerous, unhelpful and demonstrably wrong information in thr hope that they convert others to their cause, such as the self proclaimed "freemen" do. Though that was fairly obvious from the post you quoted.

The_Green_Hornet

MattMattMattUK said:

The_Green_Hornet said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Qyburn said:

There's a small faction promoting the idea that removing the supplier's meter and fitting a replacement, in some way gives you free energy. As usual with these "something for nothing" theories, it's being promoted by people who make money carrying out that work. Octopus has started disconnecting and capping off supplies for some of these people but I do think that a few actual criminal prosecutions would do wonders.

They are often connected to the "freeman of the land" nutjobs. I agree, prosecutions are the way forward with those idiots. 

Nice turn of phrase. Do you mean people with mental health conditions?

No, I mean those who spew dangerous, unhelpful and demonstrably wrong information in thr hope that they convert others to their cause, such as the self proclaimed "freemen" do. Though that was fairly obvious from the post you quoted.

Oh you mean someone who has a different point of view than you. I get it now. Sorry for misunderstanding.

michaels

The_Green_Hornet said:

MattMattMattUK said:

The_Green_Hornet said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Qyburn said:

There's a small faction promoting the idea that removing the supplier's meter and fitting a replacement, in some way gives you free energy. As usual with these "something for nothing" theories, it's being promoted by people who make money carrying out that work. Octopus has started disconnecting and capping off supplies for some of these people but I do think that a few actual criminal prosecutions would do wonders.

They are often connected to the "freeman of the land" nutjobs. I agree, prosecutions are the way forward with those idiots. 

Nice turn of phrase. Do you mean people with mental health conditions?

No, I mean those who spew dangerous, unhelpful and demonstrably wrong information in thr hope that they convert others to their cause, such as the self proclaimed "freemen" do. Though that was fairly obvious from the post you quoted.

Oh you mean someone who has a different point of view than you. I get it now. Sorry for misunderstanding.

The earth is flat

GingerTim

Freemen on the Land don't just have a 'different point of view' - they are wrong in fact and in law, and will lead people - often desperate - into considerable financial and legal difficulty with their wrongheaded claims.

TheElectricCow

The_Green_Hornet said:

MattMattMattUK said:

The_Green_Hornet said:

MattMattMattUK said:

Qyburn said:

There's a small faction promoting the idea that removing the supplier's meter and fitting a replacement, in some way gives you free energy. As usual with these "something for nothing" theories, it's being promoted by people who make money carrying out that work. Octopus has started disconnecting and capping off supplies for some of these people but I do think that a few actual criminal prosecutions would do wonders.

They are often connected to the "freeman of the land" nutjobs. I agree, prosecutions are the way forward with those idiots. 

Nice turn of phrase. Do you mean people with mental health conditions?

No, I mean those who spew dangerous, unhelpful and demonstrably wrong information in thr hope that they convert others to their cause, such as the self proclaimed "freemen" do. Though that was fairly obvious from the post you quoted.

Oh you mean someone who has a different point of view than you. I get it now. Sorry for misunderstanding.

There is perhaps an important distinction it be made between a person who holds a different point of view and someone who holds a factually incorrect one while wielding it in such a way that may prove extremely harmful to anyone who knows no better than to believe them.

Particularly if this differing opinion involves them attempting to draw others into a cult-like group entirely on the basis of false information or acting with hostility against anyone who dares disagree with their “opinion”.

The term “nutjob” seems appropriate enough to describe such people.

Spoonie_Turtle

[Deleted User] said:

TheElectricCow said:

wrf12345 said:

Bad debt needs to come out of the energy companies profits and then out of their salaries (including Ofgem's as they are plainly incompetent) not out of the pockets of "good" customers. Prepayment meters fitted where there is no debt need to be run at a discount as there is no bad debt risk for the energy companies compared to other methods - preferably by removing standing charges.

And what happens if we reach a point where those losses from bad debts eliminate all of the energy company’s profits and they have to go out of business? Or what if to avoid that happening they decide to double down and go for installing prepayment meters at the first sign of any consumer debt that isn’t immediately paid?

Not to mention making a zero standing charge tariff with the same standard unit costs as everyone else would be a terrible idea. That would mean everyone can avoid the standing charge entirely by simply switching to prepayment (there would be little reason not to) and suddenly there’s no one to pay for the network infrastructure and supply costs of getting energy to your home, other than those in bad debt.

I struggle with this decision. The default position in energy is that when something in the sector goes wrong, the consumer pays. This doesn’t happen with broadband; water; Sky etc.

To me, the main difference seems to be that the profits of energy suppliers are mostly* capped, in practice, whereas in other sectors (I don't know enough to know whether it's all/many/some) that's not the case.  I can't imagine Sky's profits are regulated, let alone capped at 2%!

*Exceptions are obviously fixes and non-SVT tariffs that aren't constrained by the cap (and currently EPG).

[I agree we could do with a better system though, but not a clue what that could be.]

wild666

A friend of someone I know moved into a property and it had prepayment meters and they asked for them to be replaced with credit meters and the company refused so they went online and found a company that was cheaper and moved to them then after a few weeks asked for them to be replaced and the company did replace the meters. This was about 12 years ago before they was such a big push for people to change to smart meters.

agentcain

In other news, Ofgem continuously proving it brings no benefit to the situation, unless you're a supplier.