Re Rerouting CH & DHW pipes

badger09

Moved into a large 4 bed bungalow Feb 2021. Original build early 1970s, extended 1990s & some reconfigured 2015. Large tiled kitchen diner. Bathroom & 2 en-suites tiled, rest is carpeted,  solid concrete floors. 

Old boiler soon developed several faults & CH engineer commented that pressure was low. 

Boiler replaced Sept 2021, began losing pressure Oct/Nov 2021. CH engineer confirmed no boiler fault, Homeserve Emergency cover confirmed same & diagnosed leak somewhere in system. No signs of leak or damp patches visible anywhere. Specialist leak system trace company thought they’d found fault, dug up tiles in en-suite but no leak detected. Sealant applied to system. 

Worked for a while but then started losing pressure again. More sealant applied, and it’s started again a few weeks ago. Managing to keep it going but topping up every few days, more frequently in cold weather. 

Feels like living under a big cloud so we’ve decided to have the pipes rerouted above ground. 

Quote from a local plumber who has already done work for us & rerouted friends pipes a few years ago when they had same problem:
‘All materials needed to repipe CH system in loft spaces 
Surface mount pipework on all radiator drops 
Clip & lag all pipework in loft space
Test & add inhibitor back into system’
£4088.25 + VAT 
There are 12 radiators & 2 towel rails. 

I know having pipes surface mounted will not be the most aesthetically pleasing but having had most of the place redecorated, we’re prepared to live with it. 

Apologies for lengthy essay but thought I’d try to head off any obvious questions. 

Just short of £5k is a lot of money but the current situation is stressful. Thoughts? 
 

FreeBear

If the pipes currently run through the concrete floor, there is a very good chance that one or more spots have corroded. Copper in contact with cement is not good in the long term..

If pipes can be dropped down from the loft in  the corners of the room, it is possible to box them in - If you re-think the location of the radiators (moving them to internal walls rather than sited under windows), you should be able to keep pipework to a minimum. Might also be worthwhile increasing the size of some of the radiators - This gives you the opportunity to run at a lower flow temperature which means the boiler is a little more efficient.

badger09

Thanks FreeBear. 

My thoughts exactly. Even if we found ‘the leak’ it’s likely there will be others in the not too distant future. Feels like Russian Roulette & we’d like to be able to go away in winter without worrying about boiler shutting down.

I’ll discuss the possibility of re moving some of the radiators with the plumber, though in some rooms there’s limited scope to reposition.  

Any comment on the price? Semi rural Shropshire, but we know he’ll do a decent job. 

FreeBear

You are effectively installing a new heating system, so that isn't going to be cheap. As to whether £4K is reasonable, I'm rather biased - Plumbing is something I can do myself, so wouldn't think to pay anyone to solder a few bits of copper pipe.

mcplumb

Will all the pipework in the loft be copper and insulated using decent insulation, not just 13mm wall thickness. 

Obviously its difficult to comment on price. Is the loft fairly open an easy to access areas where new pipe drops will be?

A hard weeks work for 1 man I'd guess and 1-1.5k for materials (1.5k buys a lot of tube, insulation and fittings)

badger09

FreeBear said:

You are effectively installing a new heating system, so that isn't going to be cheap. As to whether £4K is reasonable, I'm rather biased - Plumbing is something I can do myself, so wouldn't think to pay anyone to solder a few bits of copper pipe.

Not quite, as there will be no boiler or radiator replacement, unless we decide to ‘upscale’ some of them. 

We’re a couple in our 70s. No skills in that area & too old to be learning them now 😊 

badger09

mcplumb said:

Will all the pipework in the loft be copper and insulated using decent insulation, not just 13mm wall thickness. 

Obviously its difficult to comment on price. Is the loft fairly open an easy to access areas where new pipe drops will be?

A hard weeks work for 1 man I'd guess and 1-1.5k for materials (1.5k buys a lot of tube, insulation and fittings)

That I don’t know, but quote does include lagging. 

Because of the layout & various extensions, access to some of the loft spaces is very restricted. Our plumber is a fit 40 something & slightly built but he did say he had a young man working with him who should be able to crawl to feed the pipes in the smaller spaces. He suggested 4-5 days work.  I think our friends place took at least 3 days and their layout was far easier than ours. 

tacpot12

That price is about right for five days work from a plumber and plumber's mate. It's clearly a big job, and you will get a warranty from them on the work, which should give you peice of mind. 

badger09

 @tacpot12
Thanks for confirming approx cost. 

What sort of warranty do you envisage? We’ve not had anything from previous work done by them. It’s a very small local family firm & we’ve been happy with what they’ve done so far. Any minor issues have been quickly rectified but never had anything in writing. 

badger09

Looking for some positive vibes please. 

Day 8 of our plumbing rerouting. Plumber working alone. Gone well so far but system now being filled up so a bit anxious. 

As an added bonus, after crawling through very narrow gaps, plumber spotted daylight from 2 slipped tiles on our roof not visible from ground level. Fixed now with minimal damage. If he hadn’t been up there, we wouldn’t have known until water came through pitched & old flat roof😱

FreeBear

badger09 said:

Looking for some positive vibes please. 

Day 8 of our plumbing rerouting. Plumber working alone. Gone well so far but system now being filled up so a bit anxious.

It took me the best part of two months to replumb my CH/DHW system (and still have remains of the old stuff to remove). 8 days for a plumber on his own isn't that excessive.

On the bright side, the work is being done during the summer, so he is under no pressure to get everything ready for the winter.