PCN issued at Matisse road Hounslow by private parking solutions (London) limited - appeal rejected

wajira27

B789 said:

The Newbies/FAQ thread explains all about why the driver should not be identified. The PPC does not know the identity of the driver. They only know the identity of the RK. If the PPC has not followed the requirements under PoFA 2012, it cannot transfer liability to the RK. They are not allowed to "assume" that the RK was also the "driver". If no one has told them who the driver is, then they just don't know. They don't have some magical database they can access with every driver's identity and photo listed in it. When it comes to POPLA or even better, court, the Claimant would be put to strict proof of the driver's identity. You are making the typical suppositions of most gullible victims that you are somehow obliged to reveal the driver's identity because the big, bad, scary parking company has told you to. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Anyway, that's all academic now because your identity as the driver has been revealed. Was/is there any mention of "Protection of Freedoms Act 2012" mentioned anywhere on the PCN?

Yes they have mentioned "Protection of Freedoms Act 2012"
Further it says if the fine is not paid or driver details not revealed, they have the right to recover amount from the keeper of the vehicle. 
I have attached a picture with the details from the pcn.

Coupon-mad

You can't use the template appeal because you are at POPLA stage already.  

Read the third post of the NEWBIES thread re POPLA appeals.

wajira27

As pps have issued me the PCN again with a new date am planning to appeal to them again.
Probably they will reject it. Is that OK?

Coupon-mad

No it is not.

It is irrelevant that they've re-issued the PCN in your name (that was just an admin process to shift liability properly). The deadlines on it are not relevant now.  They probably did this to make you take your eye off POPLA stage.

You told us that you have a POPLA Code in your name already so you are NOT at first appeal stage.  Your POPLA Code will time out after a month.

You need to read the POPLA section in the third post of the NEWBIES thread.  You are at that stage, no other.

B789

wajira27 said:
Yes they have mentioned "Protection of Freedoms Act 2012"

Further it says if the fine is not paid or driver details not revealed, they have the right to recover amount from the keeper of the vehicle. 
I have attached a picture with the details from the pcn.

Nowhere does it mention the word "fine"... because it isn't. Technically, that is not PoFA compliant either. Whilst it may mention PoFA, there is a strict requirement to notify the RK which section of "Schedule 4" applies. If the PCN was a NtK it must refer to paragraph 9 of Schedule 4 and sub paragraph f. PoFA Schedule 4 (9)(f) applies and has very specific wording. which is not as shown in the example above. If you want to know why, you can look it up here:

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/9/schedule/4/enacted

Spot the difference:

Scammer says:
"If after 29 days we have not received full payment or driver details, under Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, as the creditor Private Parking Solutions (LONDON) LTD have the right, subject to the requirements of the Act, to recover the parking charge amount that remains unpaid from the keeper of the vehicle."

PoFA says:
"You are advised that if, after 28 days from the date given (which is presumed to be the second working day after the date issued), the parking charge has not been paid in full and we do not know both the name and current address of the driver, we, Private Parking Solutions (LONDON) LTD (the creditor) have the right to recover any unpaid part of the parking charge from you. This notice is given to you under paragraph 9(2)(f) of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 and is subject to our complying with the applicable conditions under Schedule 4 of the Act."

If they were really trying to keep it PoFA compliant, they could also add this bit to the paragraph:

"Failure to pay the full amount of this notice within 28 days may result in the proceeding of debt recovery action and/or issuing court proceedings against you."

wajira27

Coupon-mad said:

No it is not.

It is irrelevant that they've re-issued the PCN in your name (that was just an admin process to shift liability properly). The deadlines on it are not relevant now.  They probably did this to make you take your eye off POPLA stage.

You told us that you have a POPLA Code in your name already so you are NOT at first appeal stage.  Your POPLA Code will time out after a month.

You need to read the POPLA section in the third post of the NEWBIES thread.  You are at that stage, no other.

Yes but the new PCN is dated 11th April and its says I have 28 days to appeal etc. Also as explained earlier everything else looks reset again.  They have renewed the timeline, given 14 days to pay the reduced amount etc. If you take into account the original pcn issue date which is 14th March,  these should have been expired by now. I wondering if I appeal now again to pps....I can buy more time etc. Obviously they will reject again and I will have 28 more days to appeal to POPLA after the pps rejection. 
Please advise. 
Thanks 

Umkomaas

For what purpose do you want to delay this?  Do you have something in plan?

Coupon-mad

My advice has not changed.  POPLA is your stage.

wajira27

Umkomaas said:

For what purpose do you want to delay this?  Do you have something in plan?

Not specifically, but during summer we may be away for a while. I am thinking of it this get escalated to court stage I hoped its good to be available to see what's coming in the post etc. If I buy more time ( eg - 50 - 60 days now...) it may be past summer time when we get to that stage ( July to mid August)
That's the only benefit I get from delaying. 

Coupon-mad

But with PPL (London) they are often beaten at POPLA, IIRC usually due to woefully inadequate signage and no grace period