Litter Warden Fine?

MoodyMand45

I have received a fixed penalty charge letter for dropping a cigarette even though i don't smoke!

This is the first i am hearing about it but it is from a local car park where these litter people lay in wait for smokers to drop a cigarette on a daily basis, i have contacted the company but no response over the phone or email.

The letter is demanding i pay the fine and i can only assume they got my details from the car number plate, i did not do this and don't smoke so i would like to see what proof they have if i can only speak to them.

Should i just wait for them to take it to court and not pay it or should i pay it and fight to prove my innocence later.
It angers me when we have real fly tippers dumping rubbish in the same area and yet these wardens are prowling the car park like scavengers waiting for quick cash even if your innocent.

user1977

I don't think "paying it and fighting to prove your innocence later" is an option. I would do nothing and see if they bother taking it further. I expect they have a sense check of whether they actually have enough evidence before going to the time/expense of going to court.

elsien

Are they not employed by the council? It may be worth coming contacting the council direct to find out how you get the information and what the appeals process is. 

diystarter7

user1977 said:

I don't think "paying it and fighting to prove your innocence later" is an option. I would do nothing and see if they bother taking it further. I expect they have a sense check of whether they actually have enough evidence before going to the time/expense of going to court.

Hi

If I may suggest that the OP ascertains who the outfit is first, IE were they privately employed, employed by the council and the car park who it belongs and seek inforamtion, any evidcne they have as you said and  to etc.

OP, if you got the above info, post it here and I'm sure so may be able to help

IMO, those that post frequently in the parking tickets section may have a better idea and a bigger audience for your thread. Though not directly related as you are well aware, the small group of posters are hot rules and regulations and who can issue what type of ticket etc. It's just an idea, not more, so your choice if this makes sense in not, not to worry

Good luck

diystarter7

BTW OP

Just to be 100% clear, Is it a fixed penalty notice or charge, please?

Thnaks

[Deleted User]

As it's a car park there may be CCTV footage available.

Manxman_in_exile

What offence are they alleging?  Is it one contrary to s87(1) Environmental Protection Act 1990 (legislation.gov.uk) ?

If so, this is a criminal offence, so you can't really "appeal" to the local authority like you could with a parking ticket.   Basically your only options are either (i) to pay up or (ii) to wait and see if they bring a prosecution against you in the magistrates' court.

Because it's a criminal offence the authority would have to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you had committed the offence in order to get a conviction in court.  The offence under s87(1) is:  "A person is guilty of an offence if he throws down, drops or otherwise deposits any litter in any place to which this section applies and leaves it."

If it were me - and I was 100% certain that I had not committed any offence and that therefore they could not have any evidence against me - I'd leave it and see if they prosecuted me.  Let them prove in court beyond resonable doubt that I'd committed the offence.  (But I'm not a lawyer and I'm not giving you legal advice!)

As it is a criminal offence you might not want just to rely on some random people (like me) from the interweb and you might want to try asking Citizens' Advice.

You might find the discussions on these threads helpful, and the guidance to councils;

Section 87 Environmental Act 1990 littering offence - FightBack Forums (pepipoo.com)

FPN for littering in the local area, 2 streets away — MoneySavingExpert Forum

Code of practice for litter and refuse: Part 1A - effective enforcement (publishing.service.gov.uk)



I suspect that if you don't pay the fixed penalty you'll get ever more letters threatening prosecution before they actually do anything - if they do anything at all.  I don't suppose there is anything to stop you from contacting them and making it clear that you are innocent of committing any offence, and that if they do prosecute you, that you will defend the charge vigorously.  (But again it might be worth asking Citizens' Advice first before entering into any correspondence.  I'm not a lawyer and this is an allegation of a criminal offence)

peter_the_piper

Does the OP know its a council ticket or is it just the PPC jumping on the bandwagon?