Heating a summerhouse..

ChilliBob

Guys, we have a large summerhouse, built before we got here, from breeze block and brock, tiled roof and rendered, from the outside it looks the part

Inside its a different matter, and a sort of work in progress. We have some tiles from a previous patio which we may add to, enabling us to tile the floor. 20mm porcelain. 

The area is 36sqm. Essentially 7m by 5m roughly.

Our bathroom installers and tilers suggested underfloor heating, however, from experience in the kitchen, 10mm tiles, this takes a few hours to heat up. 

The key is how the room will be used, which is three fold, probably, 
* Shed
* Gym
* Play room type thing

So, as you can see, extended prolonged or planned use is unlikely. Which doesn't tally with heating that takes three hours to kick in and will keep the room warm for hours after.. 

Obviously it doesn't have a boiler fitted, so usual has radiators don't work. What else are my options here?

The bathroom fitters mentioned plasterboard with insulation on the back would likely deal with any damp more or less. 

Liverpool85

We have a converted garage which is brick outer skin, proper roof and framed within insulation then plasterboard inside. Sheet vinyl floor with a big rug which feels warm. 
It’s 5x3m. Lots of glazing and some to building regs for habitable accommodation.

It’s often a few degrees warmer than outside but in cold weather will get very cold. It keeps heat quite well when in use but cools overnight. We havnt had damp but it’s well insulated. 

we have got a wifi ceramic radiator that we can use to keep on low frost mode (cheaply keeps it at 5-7c), or can be remotely turned on ahead of needing it. It gives a gentle heat but takes time to heat up (however also takes time to cool down) 
if you have electronics or plumbing in their then consider what will be cost effective to add low level heating on a thermostat. 

for quick use when it’s cold we just also have a electric fan heater (a fan stove) and this gives the quick blast needed to top up heating.

Another option we had was one of the joint AC/heating units but I didn’t like the look of them. And it doesn’t get too hot in summer as it’s mainly shaded but also has great ventilation. But some neighbours have them and like them. 

DullGreyGuy

Given this is a single skin "summer" house... how many months of the year are you hoping to use it? How are windows?

How tolerant are you to temps? Shed/Gym doesn't sound so much of a worry but playroom in northern Scotland winter could point at other solutions.

ChilliBob

Well we're in London, so it's not like it's frequent super cold. 

It has two windows on the front and a single door. All double glazed upvc. Windows I'd gusss are sbout 1m heigh 1.5 wide perhaps? Not massive. 

Yeah, for how I have used it so far, basically a workshop for woodwork etc, I've never been cold, even going in there when it was snowing outside. But I'm not too fit so some sanding, lifting etc and I'm warm lol. 

ChilliBob

Liverpool85 said:

We have a converted garage which is brick outer skin, proper roof and framed within insulation then plasterboard inside. Sheet vinyl floor with a big rug which feels warm. 
It’s 5x3m. Lots of glazing and some to building regs for habitable accommodation.

It’s often a few degrees warmer than outside but in cold weather will get very cold. It keeps heat quite well when in use but cools overnight. We havnt had damp but it’s well insulated. 

we have got a wifi ceramic radiator that we can use to keep on low frost mode (cheaply keeps it at 5-7c), or can be remotely turned on ahead of needing it. It gives a gentle heat but takes time to heat up (however also takes time to cool down) 
if you have electronics or plumbing in their then consider what will be cost effective to add low level heating on a thermostat. 

for quick use when it’s cold we just also have a electric fan heater (a fan stove) and this gives the quick blast needed to top up heating.

Another option we had was one of the joint AC/heating units but I didn’t like the look of them. And it doesn’t get too hot in summer as it’s mainly shaded but also has great ventilation. But some neighbours have them and like them. 

The room has electrics, so this WiFi ceramic rad I assume this is electric? Yeah see something like that in the play area we could put on remotely would work well I think.

Fan heater, aren't those the things which cost a bomb to run? But I guess if its a blast for a few mins it's a bit different to keeping on for three hours!

Play room is hard to quantify at the minute, we have a five year old and a 8 month old. I was thinking air hockey or similar for now, not sure how that may change in a few years! 

I'd probably like to get some hifi equipment in there - I have a spare amp, speakers etc (I'm a bit oldskool like that lol!)..! 

danrv

You could try a convector type electric radiator that heats up quickly rather than oil filled. Better for random use .
If you find that you’re using it for longer periods, a single split AC unit would be cheaper to run. I don’t mind the wall mounted AC air handlers I have. 
They free up floor space too.

Liverpool85

ChilliBob said:

Liverpool85 said:

We have a converted garage which is brick outer skin, proper roof and framed within insulation then plasterboard inside. Sheet vinyl floor with a big rug which feels warm. 
It’s 5x3m. Lots of glazing and some to building regs for habitable accommodation.

It’s often a few degrees warmer than outside but in cold weather will get very cold. It keeps heat quite well when in use but cools overnight. We havnt had damp but it’s well insulated. 

we have got a wifi ceramic radiator that we can use to keep on low frost mode (cheaply keeps it at 5-7c), or can be remotely turned on ahead of needing it. It gives a gentle heat but takes time to heat up (however also takes time to cool down) 
if you have electronics or plumbing in their then consider what will be cost effective to add low level heating on a thermostat. 

for quick use when it’s cold we just also have a electric fan heater (a fan stove) and this gives the quick blast needed to top up heating.

Another option we had was one of the joint AC/heating units but I didn’t like the look of them. And it doesn’t get too hot in summer as it’s mainly shaded but also has great ventilation. But some neighbours have them and like them. 

The room has electrics, so this WiFi ceramic rad I assume this is electric? Yeah see something like that in the play area we could put on remotely would work well I think.

Fan heater, aren't those the things which cost a bomb to run? But I guess if its a blast for a few mins it's a bit different to keeping on for three hours!

Play room is hard to quantify at the minute, we have a five year old and a 8 month old. I was thinking air hockey or similar for now, not sure how that may change in a few years! 

I'd probably like to get some hifi equipment in there - I have a spare amp, speakers etc (I'm a bit oldskool like that lol!)..! 

Yes it’s an electric ceramic heater. It works well with the insulation 2nd skin/roof/floor but does taken time to
Yes the blow fan heaters we just use for quick blasts. 

I agree the convector heaters would warm it up more quickly. I find them quite drying and wouldn’t want one left on when I’m not there, the ceramic one works well I the thermostat and I control it with my phone app
having an inner frame built with insulation, and insulating the floor and roof would make heating work better. 

We got the electrics upgraded with an armoured cable and it’s own fuse box so we can run as much as we need at once as the garage electrics were more limited. We had an Ethernet cable run too so it had a wireless access point but there are other options.

our kids wouldn’t have used it when you get but now at 7 & 10 love play dates in there and when they are older I’m sure will also love the space. 

Otherwise we use it sometimes to socialise in the evenings, and to exercise, and in the day it’s lovely to sit out in with the view of the garden 

Doozergirl

36 square metres is going to take some heating, especially if it's low on insulation.  Add as much insulation as you possibly can to it.  

I would say use infrared heating because it heats the person, rather than the air, so you'll feel some benefit quicker.  I've had these recommended to me by someone else with a garden room - you'll have to do some kind of heat loss calculator for the wattage you'll need. 

https://kiasa.co.uk/collections/heater-bar

Underfloor heating would be a total nonsense. No insulation in the floor, very little elsewhere - you'd lose the heat before it had a chance to build.  

I'd also maybe reconsider using ceramic tiles in a space that isn't well heated, if you're sitting in there it will feel like it's sapping the heat from you because they're so cold to the touch.  Infrared heating may help with that, but heaters using convection will see your tiles being the very last thing to warm up - they'll act like an anti-radiator, almost! 

markin

The only difference between a Ceramic and fan heater is the noise, they will both use the same energy to heat the space.

An inch of insulation on the floor topped with lamented flooring would be far warmer.

ChilliBob

The issue here is really the tiles... We've just had our patio, path etc done and we ordered more than we needed (but what we were told to order). Rather irritatingly we have 27sqm of tiles left over! - only half of these are, boxed and returnable (with a 10% deduction ). At £60 a sqm I didn't really want 34 800*400 tiles just sitting around (700 quids worth!).

Basically trying to evaluate whether we do the summerhouse nowish, using these tiles, or send them back, write off the 10% loss, and suck up we have £700 tiles just stored, probably down the side of the summerhouse out of sight!

A very mse problem lol

Doozergirl

At £60 a square metre, I should think you can take the loss on returning them and buy even decent laminate with an insulating underlay for less than you get back for it.   They'll also have a value on marketplace or a local selling site .  

I have a properly insulated floor and tiles in a much smaller garden room.   It's nice in the summer as the room is shaded, but I need a rug in the winter, an insulated sole to my shoes and I can still feel the floor working against the log burner, which throws out tonnes of heat.     In hindsight, continuing the patio indoors shouldn't have been the priority when you've entering an unheated room in winter.  

There's your other option for something faster acting.  My wood burner has been on for about an hour now, so I'd better get out there and do some work...