Smart meter

Silverbird65

Views on smart meters. Considering but still not sure. I am with shell who are keen for me to have one installed. I am happy to give my readings monthly. What is the panic ?
Thanks

Keep_pedalling

There is no panic, but we don’t need yet another thread on this subject it has been done to death.

Silverbird65

Sorry I will have to search through.
Thanks

The_Green_Hornet

Smart meters are either a) the spawn of the devil or b) the best thing since sliced bread.

Representatives of both camps will be along very shortly.

EssexHebridean

Silverbird65 said:

Views on smart meters. Considering but still not sure. I am with shell who are keen for me to have one installed. I am happy to give my readings monthly. What is the panic ?
Thanks

I guess the best way of dealing with this is probably to ask what your reservations are? Often we see people here who are unsure about smart meters because of things they have read for example - there is a huge amount of misinformation out there often being pedalled by people who have their own agendas against the smart metering rollout for various reasons, or indeed by those who have been influenced by them and developed intransigent ideas of their own based on opinion rather than fact. Sadly we even see that on here, although you will usually find it's pretty swiftly challenged by someone with a more impartial mind! 

Some of the common fallacies - 
- "they will let the energy company "spy" on me by knowing exactly what I'm doing at any given time" - No, they don't - and even if they did, would it be a particular issue if Eon knew that you quite enjoyed a slice of toast with your 11am cuppa? Or that little Jonny always has to have an extra splash of hot water put in after he's been in the bath for 10 minutes? 
- "they can be hacked and then people can see when you are in and out - it will lead to me being burgled!" - the chances of a SM being hacked in this way is beyond slim - it would be easier and far more likely for your local neighbourhood burglar to just lurk about and watch your movements for a few days!
- "As soon as I change supplier, it will stop being smart and I'll be worse off!" - the stopping being smart thing related to SMETS1 meters - and those aren't installed any more. In fact, the majority of those have now returned to their "smart"ness now due to efforts to "upgrade" them being made. In any event - a smart meter that is not sending readings is pretty much exactly the same as your existing dumb meter. 
- "Once I'm on a smart meter my supplier will start charging me more for my energy because they will know when I need to use it" - at the moment, this doesn't happen. The technology is there so that it could happen in the future, but if things reached that point, it seems almost certain that whatever your smart meter "peak rate" was would be the rate that those who refuse them pay 24/7. In fact, the flip side is that right now smart meters give you access to Time of Use tariffs that might even save you money - have a look for threads on Octopus Agile on the forum for an idea. 
- "The supplier will just be able to switch me over to prepayment whenever they want!" - nope, not true. Even if you DID fall into debt, engaging with the supplier and being willing to work with them to set up a payment plan makes this an incredibly unlikely scenario. Oh, and for balance, a supplier with a non-paying and non-engaging customer can already force a switch to prepay in normal circumstances - without permission from the homeowner - admission in those cases to physically change the meter involves either a locksmith or more likely what the police refer to as "the big red key" - a remote switch is far less costly! 

Advantages of a smart meter can include:
- saving people scrambling around in dark cupboards to get readings monthly - it would be good practise to continue to check your readings periodically to ensure that the meter ties up with what you are being billed,  but that's all you need to do.
- for a lot of people the "In Home Display" can help them to spot "energy hogs" in the home and reduce costs - this works on the "knowledge is power" basis.
- The IHD can also help to prevent things being accidentally left on - an immersion heater switched on for example would flag up immediately, and this can save a fortune!
- Avoiding estimated bills when you are away on holiday at the date when you'd usually send a meter read. We've seen on here a lot quite how traumatic inaccurate estimated bills can be for people! 

Let us know what you are unsure about if not covered here and hopefully we can set your mind at rest! There still won't be a "panic" but at least you'll be better armed with the right information. 

diystarter7

Silverbird65 said:

Sorry I will have to search through.
Thanks

Hi

No worries, you are entitled to start a thread if you want a personal response

I posted a link from Which magazine yesterday and I'm not good at finding posts but will try and post if you cant find it.

The article inn the magazine talks about what you may get and what to do if you encounter problems etc, therefore a good read in helping you decide and be prepared if things do not go to plan as they dont sometimes with anyhtig and everything

The reason there seems to be a "panic" is the suppliers have to install and certain amount of these meters by a certain date

Thnaks

Mstty

diystarter7 said:

Silverbird65 said:

Sorry I will have to search through.
Thanks

Hi

No worries, you are entitled to start a thread if you want a personal response

I posted a link from Which magazine yesterday and I'm not good at finding posts but will try and post if you cant find it.

The article inn the magazine talks about what you may get and what to do if you encounter problems etc, therefore a good read in helping you decide and be prepared if things do not go to plan as they dont sometimes with anyhtig and everything

The reason there seems to be a "panic" is the suppliers have to install and certain amount of these meters by a certain date

Thnaks

Just look at your own profile and replies, sometimes easier to find there👍

diystarter7

The_Green_Hornet said:

Smart meters are either a) the spawn of the devil or b) the best thing since sliced bread.

Representatives of both camps will be along very shortly.

Hi

Good post and this applies to almost everything in life.

Personally, I would not go for something brand new and generation one smart meter have their problems but the new generation seemed to ironed them out, mostly.

Thanks

Mstty

The_Green_Hornet said:

Smart meters are either a) the spawn of the devil or b) the best thing since sliced bread.

Representatives of both camps will be along very shortly.

Live and let live I say.

Happy with our smart meter but if someone doesn't want one and their current meter is working and in certification then let them be.

drt1710

Silverbird65 said:

Views on smart meters. Considering but still not sure. I am with shell who are keen for me to have one installed. I am happy to give my readings monthly. What is the panic ?
Thanks

You'll find views for and against.  It really is worth searching the forum if you have the time as you will get a lot more views on them.
EssexHebridean is an excellent reasonably balanced view, the only thing I'd add is about suppliers switching a smart meter to a prepayment meter.  What he says is correct in theory, but in practice, it's not worked like that to date. 
However, the energy industry has agreed to no more forced prepayment meters until 31/3/23, what happens after that is anyone's guess! (https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2023/02/energy-suppliers-told-stop-prepay-forced-switch-regulator/)

Whilst a supplier "should" engage with a customer before switching you to prepayment, and prepayment should only be a last resort, and prepayment can't be used in certain circumstances, it's not always worked like that.  So if there is any chance that you "might" be in or fall into debt, I'd consider this. 
Having said that, if and when your meter comes due for replacement, chances are it will be replaced with a smart meter anyway.
There is also another advantage of smart meters, not sure if Shell is offering it, but "smart tariffs" whereby you pay a different price per unit at different times of day.  You're looking for something like Shell's version of Octopus Agile (a tariff which pays customers to use energy!!!!) (https://octopus.energy/agile/)
Basically, the future is coming to get us!
Hope this helps

EssexHebridean

drt1710 said:

Silverbird65 said:

Views on smart meters. Considering but still not sure. I am with shell who are keen for me to have one installed. I am happy to give my readings monthly. What is the panic ?
Thanks

You'll find views for and against.  It really is worth searching the forum if you have the time as you will get a lot more views on them.
EssexHebridean is an excellent reasonably balanced view, the only thing I'd add is about suppliers switching a smart meter to a prepayment meter.  What he says is correct in theory, but in practice, it's not worked like that to date. 
However, the energy industry has agreed to no more forced prepayment meters until 31/3/23, what happens after that is anyone's guess! (https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2023/02/energy-suppliers-told-stop-prepay-forced-switch-regulator/)

Whilst a supplier "should" engage with a customer before switching you to prepayment, and prepayment should only be a last resort, and prepayment can't be used in certain circumstances, it's not always worked like that.  So if there is any chance that you "might" be in or fall into debt, I'd consider this. 
Having said that, if and when your meter comes due for replacement, chances are it will be replaced with a smart meter anyway.
There is also another advantage of smart meters, not sure if Shell is offering it, but "smart tariffs" whereby you pay a different price per unit at different times of day.  You're looking for something like Shell's version of Octopus Agile (a tariff which pays customers to use energy!!!!) (https://octopus.energy/agile/)
Basically, the future is coming to get us!
Hope this helps

BiB: I think in the case of most suppliers, it probably has, in fairness - the current temporary ban was as a result of British Gas deciding to seemingly bypass the rulebook completely. It should also be added that the situation in the Times investigation didn't only affect those with smart meters - and for my money, far worse were those where people's homes were actually entered to physically change the meter where in fact they should have been protected from this by the PSR. The cases uncovered in the investigation though do seem to have been a very small number (still too many, in the circumstances, mind!) where the system was abused by a supplier.  (Oh - and it's she, by the way!) 

To underline though - the system relating to smart  meters and debt is ONLY different in terms of the fact that the switch can be made without needing to physically enter the property - the right to switch a customer to prepay has been in place for a very long time where certain criteria are met.

You are right about life-end meters now being almost certain to be replaced with smart ones - there have been cases where dumb meters have been installed instead but as a general rule this seems to be more when a meter has needed an emergency replacement and that was what was available.