gifting/deprivation of assets

samohtom_

Hi. My mum has dementia, and is highly likely to need to go into a care home imminently. I got a call from him the other day saying he would like to give me, my brother and my sister £3K each as a gift and I am wondering if this would fall foul of deprivation of assets - my Mum is being assessed next week (I am uncertain if by social services for social care, or for NHS continuing care - my Dad didn't know. I am guessing the former though). My mum's condition has very recently deteriorated to the point where Dad just can't cope, so a care home and possibly some kind of interim care seem to be the only solution. There is a pattern of him (or them) gifting £3K to each of us on two previous occasions over the past few years (I don't remember the exact dates, but I believe one of them would have been before my mum's condtion was diagnosed). My Dad has full power of attorney over mum (health/financial), but I don't know the value of her assets. I looked up the rules on gifting and see that each spouse can gift £3K per year, and if the allowance wasn't used the previous year you can backdate one year, so £12K total. This said I can see the timing of this particular round of gifting would look highly suspicious, i.e. just before my mum goes into a care home. Would the council likely view this as deprivation of assets? And would it mean no gift could be given at all? I don't especially need the money, though could certainly make use of it (who couldn't)...but I don't want him to feel bad if it turns out he's not allowed to. He said he would raise it with the people coming to assess mum next week...

Keep_pedalling

He can gift from his own assets, but he would be abusing his authority gifting any of hers. Is he the sole attorney or are you or any of your siblings also attorneys?

What sort of savings does she have? 

Mojisola

samohtom_ said:

I looked up the rules on gifting and see that each spouse can gift £3K per year, and if the allowance wasn't used the previous year you can backdate one year, so £12K total.

This is only relevant to inheritance tax rules, not deprivation assessments.

Savvy_Sue

Keep_pedalling said:

He can gift from his own assets, but he would be abusing his authority gifting any of hers. Is he the sole attorney or are you or any of your siblings also attorneys?

What sort of savings does she have? 

That's not necessarily true. If they EACH or JOINTLY have a history of giving away such amounts, AND what can be identified as MUM's assets appear to be sufficient to cover her anticipated lifespan (generously calculated) then dad can give some of Mum's money to each of their children from her identified or joint assets. 

However, it's definitely worth finding out what the assessment is for. If it's looking at Mum's assets, then giving money away now might cause a lot of aggravation, even if she does in fact have sufficient for her needs. And if it's for NHS continuing care, then her money needn't be assessed. 

Dad should, however, keep in mind what his own needs might be, and he should NOT give money away that he might need himself! 

Keep_pedalling

Savvy_Sue said:

Keep_pedalling said:

He can gift from his own assets, but he would be abusing his authority gifting any of hers. Is he the sole attorney or are you or any of your siblings also attorneys?

What sort of savings does she have? 

That's not necessarily true. If they EACH or JOINTLY have a history of giving away such amounts, AND what can be identified as MUM's assets appear to be sufficient to cover her anticipated lifespan (generously calculated) then dad can give some of Mum's money to each of their children from her identified or joint assets. 

However, it's definitely worth finding out what the assessment is for. If it's looking at Mum's assets, then giving money away now might cause a lot of aggravation, even if she does in fact have sufficient for her needs. And if it's for NHS continuing care, then her money needn't be assessed. 

Dad should, however, keep in mind what his own needs might be, and he should NOT give money away that he might need himself! 

The OP said that gifts have been made on two previous occasions, which is hardly a pattern of gifting so I stick to my view that such gifts now are not appropriate unless the she has sufficient assets that such gifts are unlikely to effect her ability to self fund some time in the near future.

mikejassss

When you’re looking towards your future and old age, one of the biggest issues you can face is having the money to pay for residential care or care and support at home. Whatever money you do have will be used towards these costs, but decreasing your collective assets and finances on purpose – a deprivation of assets – to avoid or reduce the amount you can contribute to your care will affect any help you might be entitled to from your local authority.

Keep_pedalling

mikejassss said:

When you’re looking towards your future and old age, one of the biggest issues you can face is having the money to pay for residential care or care and support at home. Whatever money you do have will be used towards these costs, but decreasing your collective assets and finances on purpose – a deprivation of assets – to avoid or reduce the amount you can contribute to your care will affect any help you might be entitled to from your local authority.

I would say that the biggest worry is not having the money to pay for care should you ever need it as it drastically reduces your choices. To get LA funded care you need to have the funding approved which based on my experience means obtaining residential care won’t be approved until your health  falls well past the level you should have qualified for residential care. Live in carers will not be an option as the LA will not fund them and your choice of care home will be restricted to those on the LA list.