NHS Pension Remedy Period Confusion

Rheumatoid

GrubbyGirl_2 said:

jeelz said:

If (God forbid!) we end up in September with another double-digit inflation figure she may be better waiting till April 24 when the inflationary uplift is applied, to take her 95 pension. Because the 95 scheme has a lump sum of 3 times the annual pension. 

This year, for example,the increase in the lump sum due to inflation will be worth more than three and a half months worth of pension. And it’s tax free.

That's not correct for the 1995 section.  You don't get any uplift to your pension until you've taken it. so if your retire in April you will get your final salary divided by 80 and multiplied by the number of years membership.  The lump sum is 3 times the annual pension.  You do not get an uplift until April 2024.  If you retired at the end of February, the pension is the same but you will get a slight uplift for the month you will be taking the pension before the new financial year so for 2023/24 it will be 10.1% divided by 12 (0.84%)..

The only way to get an increase to your 1995 scheme pension is to carry on working and see if your get a decent pay rise

I'll suggest she carries on working and see how it goes down

Pat38493

GrubbyGirl_2 said:

jeelz said:

If (God forbid!) we end up in September with another double-digit inflation figure she may be better waiting till April 24 when the inflationary uplift is applied, to take her 95 pension. Because the 95 scheme has a lump sum of 3 times the annual pension. 

This year, for example,the increase in the lump sum due to inflation will be worth more than three and a half months worth of pension. And it’s tax free.

That's not correct for the 1995 section.  You don't get any uplift to your pension until you've taken it. so if your retire in April you will get your final salary divided by 80 and multiplied by the number of years membership.  The lump sum is 3 times the annual pension.  You do not get an uplift until April 2024.  If you retired at the end of February, the pension is the same but you will get a slight uplift for the month you will be taking the pension before the new financial year so for 2023/24 it will be 10.1% divided by 12 (0.84%)..

The only way to get an increase to your 1995 scheme pension is to carry on working and see if your get a decent pay rise

My wife retired recently under the 1995 scheme and she seems to think that she will somehow benefit from the next NHS pay increase in the year following retirement, plus the pension inflation increase  - I'm not sure how as I didn't get all the details.

Also be careful if you have any periods of part time working on the record, especially if you have any special statuses like MHO status.  The way the NHS pension admins account for periods of part time working is quite bizarre and is designed to mathematically ensure that you cannot accrue a full pension before NRA no matter how many years you worked, even if you only ever worked 1 week part time at 95% or suchlike.  We were actually planning to write to them and ask them how this calculation method makes any sense in the real world but didn't get around to it yet.

GrubbyGirl_2

Pat38493 said:

My wife retired recently under the 1995 scheme and she seems to think that she will somehow benefit from the next NHS pay increase in the year following retirement, plus the pension inflation increase  - I'm not sure how as I didn't get all the details.

She won't get anything but the inflationary uplift, she might have an argument to get an increase if they backdate any pay rise but I wouldn't hold my breath.  If she only recently retired she will only get a proportion of the inflationary uplift.  Oh and just to warn you they may try not to give you that too.  I retired in January 2020, they didn't give me any uplift in April 2020 or 2021.  I didn't notice the 2020 one as it was going to be miniscule anyway but when I didn't get one in 2021 I contacted them to ask why and they simply didn't respond.  I ended up making a formal complaint and it took them almost to the 2022 uplift to admit they were wrong.  You really have to keep on top of them.

jeelz

GrubbyGirl_2 said:

jeelz said:

If (God forbid!) we end up in September with another double-digit inflation figure she may be better waiting till April 24 when the inflationary uplift is applied, to take her 95 pension. Because the 95 scheme has a lump sum of 3 times the annual pension. 

This year, for example,the increase in the lump sum due to inflation will be worth more than three and a half months worth of pension. And it’s tax free.

That's not correct for the 1995 section.  You don't get any uplift to your pension until you've taken it. so if your retire in April you will get your final salary divided by 80 and multiplied by the number of years membership.  The lump sum is 3 times the annual pension.  You do not get an uplift until April 2024.  If you retired at the end of February, the pension is the same but you will get a slight uplift for the month you will be taking the pension before the new financial year so for 2023/24 it will be 10.1% divided by 12 (0.84%)..

The only way to get an increase to your 1995 scheme pension is to carry on working and see if your get a decent pay rise

Apologies for any misinformation. I was mistakenly relating this to my own situation in the 95 section where my pension is a CARE scheme. (Practitioner’s pension).

Sim_2

To only slightly hijack... like the OPs wife I am a transition member and was moved to 2015 in December 2019. I am retiring in May but cannot get help from NHS pensions and there is no longer any local Trust support. I have been told that I will be informed how much my pension is sometime in June, ie. after I retire. TRS is wrong because of the transition date, and I had increment to top of band last year so I am left to guess how much my pension will be in the short term. Question - I am being naïve in assuming my transition 2015 will be moved to April 2022 before I retire?  

GrubbyGirl_2

Sim_2 said:

To only slightly hijack... like the OPs wife I am a transition member and was moved to 2015 in December 2019. I am retiring in May but cannot get help from NHS pensions and there is no longer any local Trust support. I have been told that I will be informed how much my pension is sometime in June, ie. after I retire. TRS is wrong because of the transition date, and I had increment to top of band last year so I am left to guess how much my pension will be in the short term. Question - I am being naïve in assuming my transition 2015 will be moved to April 2022 before I retire?  

Have you tried ringing them?  They should be offering you a choice to leave the money you transferred into the 2015 scheme or take the amount up to 2022 as the 1995 scheme - so they need advise you before they pay out your lump sum which will arrive in your account the day you retire.  

GrubbyGirl_2

Sim_2 said:

To only slightly hijack... like the OPs wife I am a transition member and was moved to 2015 in December 2019. I am retiring in May but cannot get help from NHS pensions and there is no longer any local Trust support. I have been told that I will be informed how much my pension is sometime in June, ie. after I retire. TRS is wrong because of the transition date, and I had increment to top of band last year so I am left to guess how much my pension will be in the short term. Question - I am being naïve in assuming my transition 2015 will be moved to April 2022 before I retire?  

Just looked at the retirement guide and it says you will be notified what and when your payments will be after they receive your application.

"How will my pension be paid? When we receive your application form we will work out your pension benefits and tell you how much they are and when your pension will be paid into your account. We may need to write to tell you that your pension benefits have been changed. This could happen if your former employer notifies us of amended pay or membership details for you, or because you have retired from the NHS again after a further period of membership. If your NHS pension benefits change, we will pay you the new amounts."

Your TRS will never be right because there is a huge time lag anyway, but it does give you an idea.  I'm pretty sure they notified me what my payments would be before I retired  

Sim_2

GrubbyGirl_2 said:

Sim_2 said:

To only slightly hijack... like the OPs wife I am a transition member and was moved to 2015 in December 2019. I am retiring in May but cannot get help from NHS pensions and there is no longer any local Trust support. I have been told that I will be informed how much my pension is sometime in June, ie. after I retire. TRS is wrong because of the transition date, and I had increment to top of band last year so I am left to guess how much my pension will be in the short term. Question - I am being naïve in assuming my transition 2015 will be moved to April 2022 before I retire?  

Just looked at the retirement guide and it says you will be notified what and when your payments will be after they receive your application.

"How will my pension be paid? When we receive your application form we will work out your pension benefits and tell you how much they are and when your pension will be paid into your account. We may need to write to tell you that your pension benefits have been changed. This could happen if your former employer notifies us of amended pay or membership details for you, or because you have retired from the NHS again after a further period of membership. If your NHS pension benefits change, we will pay you the new amounts."

Your TRS will never be right because there is a huge time lag anyway, but it does give you an idea.  I'm pretty sure they notified me what my payments would be before I retired  

Thank you for returning your AW8 retirement application, together with the required documentation.

Once we have submitted your application to NHS Pensions, we will confirm to you in writing.

Please do not chase for an update on your application unless within a month of your retirement date.

NHS Pensions' statutory target is to pay pension benefits within one month of the retirement date or the date of receiving all required information if later. NHS Pensions will write to you approximately one week before the payable date providing details of your initial pension award.

This email account is not monitored, and any queries received to this email account will not be forwarded.

hugheskevi

Sim_2 said:

To only slightly hijack... like the OPs wife I am a transition member and was moved to 2015 in December 2019. I am retiring in May but cannot get help from NHS pensions and there is no longer any local Trust support. I have been told that I will be informed how much my pension is sometime in June, ie. after I retire. TRS is wrong because of the transition date, and I had increment to top of band last year so I am left to guess how much my pension will be in the short term. Question - I am being naïve in assuming my transition 2015 will be moved to April 2022 before I retire?  

You are retiring in May 2023, but the McCloud Remedy date is 1 October 2023. Hence you will retire with the pension built up under the current rules (ie moving to 2015 scheme in December 2019), and at some point within 18 months of 1 October 2023 you will be sent a choice to amend your pension to be based on either:

(a) Legacy scheme to 2015 and 2015 scheme to retirement, or;
(b) Legacy scheme to April 2022 and 2015 scheme to retirement.

Note that keeping the pension you will be drawing at that time will not be possible, as you are a transition member - you will need to choose one of the alternatives with consequential effect on lump sum and ongoing pension (so will owe or be owed pension and lump sum for the period from retirement until the date your pension changes, and ongoing pension will change).

Have you tried ringing them?  They should be offering you a choice to leave the money you transferred into the 2015 scheme or take the amount up to 2022 as the 1995 scheme - so they need advise you before they pay out your lump sum which will arrive in your account the day you retire.  

Given the poster will retire in May 2023, I do not believe the choice has to be offered until 1 October 2023 - indeed, there would be no statutory basis on which to offer a choice, as the rules of the scheme will not change until that date. See this article.

GrubbyGirl_2

Sim_2 said:

GrubbyGirl_2 said:

Sim_2 said:

To only slightly hijack... like the OPs wife I am a transition member and was moved to 2015 in December 2019. I am retiring in May but cannot get help from NHS pensions and there is no longer any local Trust support. I have been told that I will be informed how much my pension is sometime in June, ie. after I retire. TRS is wrong because of the transition date, and I had increment to top of band last year so I am left to guess how much my pension will be in the short term. Question - I am being naïve in assuming my transition 2015 will be moved to April 2022 before I retire?  

Just looked at the retirement guide and it says you will be notified what and when your payments will be after they receive your application.

"How will my pension be paid? When we receive your application form we will work out your pension benefits and tell you how much they are and when your pension will be paid into your account. We may need to write to tell you that your pension benefits have been changed. This could happen if your former employer notifies us of amended pay or membership details for you, or because you have retired from the NHS again after a further period of membership. If your NHS pension benefits change, we will pay you the new amounts."

Your TRS will never be right because there is a huge time lag anyway, but it does give you an idea.  I'm pretty sure they notified me what my payments would be before I retired  

Thank you for returning your AW8 retirement application, together with the required documentation.

Once we have submitted your application to NHS Pensions, we will confirm to you in writing.

Please do not chase for an update on your application unless within a month of your retirement date.

NHS Pensions' statutory target is to pay pension benefits within one month of the retirement date or the date of receiving all required information if later. NHS Pensions will write to you approximately one week before the payable date providing details of your initial pension award.

This email account is not monitored, and any queries received to this email account will not be forwarded.

You will get your lump sum on the day you retire, that's the one thing they are good at.  At least you'll be able to work out you starting pension as the lump sum is 3 x that amount.