Implications Of Family Wipeout

MickeyTheBoy

My wife and I have two married sons each with two children of their own. We have mirror wills which on the 1st death leaves everything to the remaining spouse. On the death of the 2nd the estate is to be shared equally between our two sons, with provision for the event that the sons are already deceased with the estate going to be shared amongst the grandchildren. So fairly standard stuff I assume ?

The 10 of us are going on a foreign holiday together later in the year. In the (hopefully) unlikely event that the entire family is wiped out by some catastrophe or other does anyone have any idea as to what would then happen to our estate given that no-one defined in our will would be alive to benefit ?

user1977

Assuming you've got some remoter relatives, it would go to them following the rules of intestacy. If you don't want it to end up in the hands of remote cousins etc, you should specify some sort of default beneficiary (e.g. a charity) in your Wills.

Boat_to_Bolivia

As said above, it will go to the next in line. So if you don't want that, state your wishes in your will.

Mojisola

MickeyTheBoy said:

The 10 of us are going on a foreign holiday together later in the year. In the (hopefully) unlikely event that the entire family is wiped out by some catastrophe or other does anyone have any idea as to what would then happen to our estate given that no-one defined in our will would be alive to benefit ?

We have a 'disaster clause' in our wills which says who the estate should go to if everyone previously mentioned is dead.

We have also named alternative executors to manage the estate if the clause comes into effect.  In some ways, that was more important to us than where the money went if we were all dead - are there any family members who you wouldn't want becoming administrators and sorting through all your possessions and/or that you wouldn't trust to share the estate out equally?

MickeyTheBoy

user1977 said:

Assuming you've got some remoter relatives, it would go to them following the rules of intestacy. If you don't want it to end up in the hands of remote cousins etc, you should specify some sort of default beneficiary (e.g. a charity) in your Wills.

But is it as simple as that ? If the entire family is killed at the same time do we get into the debate of who died first. If it was determined by age (eldest first) then our youngest son would potentially inherit our entire estate but given his death then who inherited could be determined by who are the beneficiaries of his will ?

MickeyTheBoy

Mojisola said:

MickeyTheBoy said:

The 10 of us are going on a foreign holiday together later in the year. In the (hopefully) unlikely event that the entire family is wiped out by some catastrophe or other does anyone have any idea as to what would then happen to our estate given that no-one defined in our will would be alive to benefit ?

We have a 'disaster clause' in our wills which says who the estate should go to if everyone previously mentioned is dead.

We have also named alternative executors to manage the estate if the clause comes into effect.  In some ways, that was more important to us than where the money went if we were all dead - are there any family members who you wouldn't want becoming administrators and sorting through all your possessions and/or that you wouldn't trust to share the estate out equally?

Thanks for that response. I'll follow up on that idea with our solicitor.

GrumpyDil

MickeyTheBoy said:

user1977 said:

Assuming you've got some remoter relatives, it would go to them following the rules of intestacy. If you don't want it to end up in the hands of remote cousins etc, you should specify some sort of default beneficiary (e.g. a charity) in your Wills.

But is it as simple as that ? If the entire family is killed at the same time do we get into the debate of who died first. If it was determined by age (eldest first) then our youngest son would potentially inherit our entire estate but given his death then who inherited could be determined by who are the beneficiaries of his will ?

Presumably you have survivorship clauses in your will along the lines of any beneficiary who dies with 28 days of my death shall be deemed to have pre-deceased me.

Saves worrying about the order of death in cases where multiple people are killed at the same time. 

Savvy_Sue

I think in your sons' position I'd worry more about appointing guardians for the offspring in my own will than what would happen to in the event of a complete wipeout ... Have you encouraged them to do that? 

Marcon

MickeyTheBoy said:

user1977 said:

Assuming you've got some remoter relatives, it would go to them following the rules of intestacy. If you don't want it to end up in the hands of remote cousins etc, you should specify some sort of default beneficiary (e.g. a charity) in your Wills.

But is it as simple as that ? If the entire family is killed at the same time do we get into the debate of who died first. If it was determined by age (eldest first) then our youngest son would potentially inherit our entire estate but given his death then who inherited could be determined by who are the beneficiaries of his will ?

In the eyes of the law, that can't happen (because it makes it impossible to administer the estate). It isn't an issue where a married couple have mirror wills, but otherwise there is an 'order of death' known as the Commorientes Rule. Unless proved otherwise, death is deemed to have occurred in order of seniority i.e. the oldest person dies first. It doesn't apply where the parties die intestate, nor does it apply for IHT purposes.