Advice re electric heating system

Astria

adindas said:

Is adding another 3X2KW of electric heater, at home will not require rewiring and request for additional power increase from utility company ??

Well, 2kW = 8 amps, so you are talking 25A, if it's possible for all those heaters to be on at the same time, it would depend on the current load on the system, what kind of wiring is going to those heaters, and so on. It would definitely require an electrician to check for you. Some properties only have 60A fuses, where as some have 100A.

travisonline

My consumer unit in the flat has supply of 100A  with no electric shower. So hopefully having 2KW heater should not be an issue.

Is the consensus on this form that Dimplex Quantum G type strorage heater can be wired via single supply? From quick search on this forum it seems like even the manual for dimplex heater supports that. the only drawback to that is that you need to make sure you adjust the swtich on/off control to match the E7 tarriff.

Scot_39

macman said:

If you have a smart meter then the switch to E7 can be done remotely. if not, then you will need a new E7 meter at cost. So, the trick is to switch to smart meters first, then once you have installed the new NSH's, get the tariff switched to E7. that way, no cost involved.

It may not be that simple.

Tariffs are one thing - device and home wiring another.

As @Gerry1 suggested - there are different meter wiring configurations.

My E10 smart meter - doesn't actually do it's own switching (the digital E10 one I had before it did) - so it actually needs an external contactor - driven from the meter - to make the switch.

There may even be legacy NSH wiring in the house but even that - might not be to current regs - which would have to be met by any new install.

And even if want to run off of 24/7 supply - relying on device timing matching meter - my NSH are all on individual spurs back to the consumer unit - each with their own MCB (fuse box / fuse in old speak).  And own isolator switch - for that switched power feed.

It's not the sort of job most would or even possibly legally could now do themselves.

So would be well worth OP thinking about talking to an actual panel / NSH fitter / or an idependent electrician - to get an actual install price - for the different options. 

Scot_39

steph_87 said:

I've been reading some of the forums on here and looking for some advice on electrical heating. 

I currently have 3 x 2kwh electric panel radiators (homesure) in my property but having difficulty heating it sufficiently with dampness and very cold.  

...

Any advice would be great. 

Dampness

I use a basic condensing dehumidifier (cost c£150) in winter (ok for most heated indoor spaces not recommeded e.g. for unheated basements) - mainly in upstairs hall / spare room - when airing "heavy" washing loads - towels, brushed cotton sheets etc. - and it pulls 2-3 cupfulls out of the air sometimes - in just a couple of hours.

My guess - it uses less c1/3rd the energy of my tumble dryer for a similar load on high (based on web typical numbers) - and to me helps speed up drying process - cf just airing inside.

If I dont - my single glazed panels on door - end up heavy with condensation - so I guess that moisture getting into everythings (walls, carpets, soft furnishings etc)

And when it's wet or windy or cold outside - I am loathed to open windows - the vents jsut not enough - too frequently to air naturally - then reheat the space after at current prices.

I don't tend to bother other days - but know others who run 1-2 hours min every day - or after showering or baths for kids etc. - as used to get heavy condensation on windows - even DG ones - over winter.

EssexHebridean

travisonline said:

Is this actually true? I have a smart meter and I called E.On to switch to E7 and they told me they will need to switch to E7 meter first before having E7 meter and remove my smart meter (£135 cost to me to have this privillege). Is it just E.on who are funny about it? It's good to know that Dimplex Quantum G can be on a single supply.

I'm guessing that perhaps for E7 Eon have a policy of requiring a 5-lead meter - that could explain it. 

Gerry1

travisonline said:

Is the consensus on this form that Dimplex Quantum G type storage heater can be wired via single supply? From quick search on this forum it seems like even the manual for Dimplex heater supports that. the only drawback to that is that you need to make sure you adjust the switch on/off control to match the E7 tariff.

@travisonline Yes, the internal wiring of Quantums can be set so that it can operate from a 24h single mains supply.  View the range, select your preferred model, click 'More information' then 'Manuals & Guides'.  Scroll down to Fig. 9b which shows the wiring configuration.

Bear in mind that you'll need to become fully familiar with programming the Quantum's controller: the installer is unlikely to be present around midnight or 7am at the start and end of the E7 cheap rate period ! It's a good idea to have an E7 circuit with a neon indicator on one of the fused spurs, e.g. the immersion heater.  It will then be obvious exactly when your meter switches over: get the E7 times wrong when you program a Quantum and it could turn out to be a very expensive mistake.

Similarly, make sure that it's not quietly topping up at expensive day rates, the maximum top-up period is configurable.

adindas

Astria said:

adindas said:

Is adding another 3X2KW of electric heater, at home will not require rewiring and request for additional power increase from utility company ??

Well, 2kW = 8 amps, so you are talking 25A, if it's possible for all those heaters to be on at the same time, it would depend on the current load on the system, what kind of wiring is going to those heaters, and so on. It would definitely require an electrician to check for you. Some properties only have 60A fuses, where as some have 100A.

Qyburn said:

Not really possible to answer without knowing details of your existing installation, and supply characteristics. Direct heat, or storage?  That makes a difference because direct heaters may benefit from diversity, cycling on and off at different times. Whereas storage heaters are likely to come on all at once.

Sorry for confusion I am fully aware that 2kW will require 2000/230 = 8.7A . I am also aware of the concept of  diversity in electrical load.

My previous comment is related to what  I have seen a few times. A few people think that they could easily replace the existing non electric radiators with electric radiators just by plugging it in the existing socket, no need rewiring, and or request for additional power. This is very dangerous.

Electric radiator power is normally 2kW, 3kW. So imagine if there are additional 3X2kW (or worse 3X3kW). It is worse if by coincidence, they are all connected to the same circuit. Keep in in mind these electric radiators are very highly likely to be on at the same time during winter, so diversity shall be 100% that will be 26A. Let alone if by coincidence they are connected to the kitchen circuit which also normally have kitchen electrical appliances such as toasters, mini oven, small microwave drawing signifiant amount of currents that could be in use at the same time.

travisonline

I am not intending to replace non-electric radiataor with electric. I already have 1kw electric radiator. So I was planning to replace 1kw standard electric radiator with 1.5-2kw storage heater. And I was hoping that it should be doable.

adindas

travisonline said:

I am not intending to replace non-electric radiataor with electric. I already have 1kw electric radiator. So I was planning to replace 1kw standard electric radiator with 1.5-2kw storage heater. And I was hoping that it should be doable.

If it is just one of them, there will be additional 1000/230 = 4.35A. With this value, it is highly like doable if there is no other power hungry load connected to that circuit. If there is  and you want to be 100% sure, a good practice is to remove other loads that could possibly be connected to that circuit.

Qyburn

I'm losing the context of that question, or maybe never got it in the first place. My post quoted above "Not really possible to answer ..." was in response to adindas asking if he could fit three 2kW heaters without rewiring or upgrading his incoming supply.