Unpaid over time over Christmas

R.j.Belcher

Hi my wife has a decient job, quite well paid, been there for 4 years. Her office closes from 23/12-3/1 yet she is expected to keep on top of things working from home. This massivley frustrates me. It is New Years day and she will have done about 4 hours today, probably 15-18 hours over the period. She says she has to do it so they can invoice customers and month end is ready to do on the 3/1. They are just one of those companies that expects this sort of thing. Even when we go away on holiday it is diffucult because everybody is working at 110% so nobody has any slack to do some of my wifes work. I am sure this is not unuasuall but legally if she refused to work over Christmas what could they do from an employment law point of view.

thanks
Rob

JReacher1

Doesn’t sound like your wife is bothered by this. 

In my experience salaried jobs that don’t pay by the hour do tend to make you occasionally work overtime without being paid for it. I am off work now but expected to keep an eye on things in case of an issue. I won’t get paid for it. 

General_Grant

R.j.Belcher said:

Hi my wife has a decient job, quite well paid, been there for 4 years. Her office closes from 23/12-3/1 yet she is expected to keep on top of things working from home. This massivley frustrates me. It is New Years day and she will have done about 4 hours today, probably 15-18 hours over the period. She says she has to do it so they can invoice customers and month end is ready to do on the 3/1. They are just one of those companies that expects this sort of thing. Even when we go away on holiday it is diffucult because everybody is working at 110% so nobody has any slack to do some of my wifes work. I am sure this is not unuasuall but legally if she refused to work over Christmas what could they do from an employment law point of view.

thanks
Rob

Given that an employer can say when you must take holiday or cannot take holiday, as long as she is not prevented from taking her full statutory annual entitlement, they can say that she has to work over the Christmas period.

So, if she refused to work when required to do so by her employer, they could decide to dismiss.

Undervalued

R.j.Belcher said:

Hi my wife has a decient job, quite well paid, been there for 4 years. Her office closes from 23/12-3/1 yet she is expected to keep on top of things working from home. This massivley frustrates me. It is New Years day and she will have done about 4 hours today, probably 15-18 hours over the period. She says she has to do it so they can invoice customers and month end is ready to do on the 3/1. They are just one of those companies that expects this sort of thing. Even when we go away on holiday it is diffucult because everybody is working at 110% so nobody has any slack to do some of my wifes work. I am sure this is not unuasuall but legally if she refused to work over Christmas what could they do from an employment law point of view.

thanks
Rob

In many more senior / responsible jobs there is an expectation, quite often completely unwritten, that staff who want to "get somewhere" work far more than their minimum contracted hours. Try being a junior hospital doctor or a solicitor or accountant in one of the large firms for example!

So, employees have to look at the overall picture. Are they happy to put the hours in, for a combination of the salary on offer at the moment and what it may lead to in the future, or would they prefer to have a lower pressure and lower paid job elsewhere?

As has been said regarding holidays, subject to fairly minimal notice an employer can totally dictate when annual leave can and cannot be taken.

SiliconChip

General_Grant said:

R.j.Belcher said:

Hi my wife has a decient job, quite well paid, been there for 4 years. Her office closes from 23/12-3/1 yet she is expected to keep on top of things working from home. This massivley frustrates me. It is New Years day and she will have done about 4 hours today, probably 15-18 hours over the period. She says she has to do it so they can invoice customers and month end is ready to do on the 3/1. They are just one of those companies that expects this sort of thing. Even when we go away on holiday it is diffucult because everybody is working at 110% so nobody has any slack to do some of my wifes work. I am sure this is not unuasuall but legally if she refused to work over Christmas what could they do from an employment law point of view.

thanks
Rob

Given that an employer can say when you must take holiday or cannot take holiday, as long as she is not prevented from taking her full statutory annual entitlement, they can say that she has to work over the Christmas period.

So, if she refused to work when required to do so by her employer, they could decide to dismiss.

I think you've missed the point made in the thread title that the work being done is unpaid overtime, i.e. she is not actually being allowed to take the holiday that she is supposed to have on these days.

Sounds to me like the employer is taking advantage and she'd be better to look for a job elsewhere, assuming that she could get the same pay without needing to do more than contracted hours.

Wyndham

What does your wife think about it? Surely her opinion on this counts for more than yours? If she's OK with it, why not be happy for her?

And if she's not OK with it, I suggest she comes on here and asks her own question. I'd be really annoyed if my husband was asking questions about my work situation on a forum.

cmthephoenix

R.j.Belcher said:

Hi my wife has a decient job, quite well paid, been there for 4 years. Her office closes from 23/12-3/1 yet she is expected to keep on top of things working from home. This massivley frustrates me. It is New Years day and she will have done about 4 hours today, probably 15-18 hours over the period. She says she has to do it so they can invoice customers and month end is ready to do on the 3/1. They are just one of those companies that expects this sort of thing. Even when we go away on holiday it is diffucult because everybody is working at 110% so nobody has any slack to do some of my wifes work. I am sure this is not unuasuall but legally if she refused to work over Christmas what could they do from an employment law point of view.

thanks
Rob

I think first you need to be clear about whether any of this is upsetting your wife and if so what is upsetting her - that she is working or that she is working unpaid.
It may be that the firm have the money to pay her for the work and simply don't realise (yes there can be expectation in many companies when you reach relatively well paid positions that you are expected to be 'on' every week - it's not right but it's life).
If it's not upsetting your wife but it is upsetting you then that's a conversation you need to have with your wife.

gwynlas

You are classing it as unpaid overtime because it is happening over the Christmas period but does your wife have to take part of her leave entitlment to be off or is this considered to be a bonus on top of statutory minimum holidays? I am sure she would prefer to do the hours at home rather than spend an extra three days in the office beteween Christmas and New Year

TELLIT01

Undervalued said:

In many more senior / responsible jobs there is an expectation, quite often completely unwritten, that staff who want to "get somewhere" work far more than their minimum contracted hours.

I worked for a major bank for several years.  Following restructuring I was one of 8 regional managers of IT support teams.  One of those managers used to take his phone and laptop on holiday with him, would work 10 or 12 hours a day etc.  At one meeting, this person was held up by our boss as a shining example of a good manager, and there was a pointed comment about me only generally working the basic hours.  My response was to ask our boss what was not being achieved either by myself or my team?  He couldn't come up with a single thing.  I then suggested that maybe it would be more productive to look into why 'golden balls' was having to put in so many hours, and why he hadn't trained his deputy to a level where he could take over his manager's duties in his absence.

The point I am making is that simply being in the office or available for "far more than their minimum contracted hours" doesn't always, or even often, mean they are doing a better job.  If there was a business need for me to work additional hours I would do it, but not for any other reason.

lanternsfour

It isn’t that people who do unpaid overtime are necessarily doing a “better job” than anyone else, but that in some roles, rightly or wrongly, it simply is the expectation as part of the actual job, that a person will put in extra work or effectively be “on call” outside working hours in case something comes up. 

Normally those roles are better-paid or have better benefits of other kinds than most, and if they’re not, then by all means it makes sense to look at jobs that more readily respect the 9-5, but whether the tradeoff is worth it is a question for the employee themselves to best answer rather than us here. OP, is your wife happy with this arrangement, does she get a high salary / bonus / other perks, and have you discussed this with her as to whether the job is worth it versus effect on family life? If I couldn’t spend a few hours on the weekend with my partner but it was necessary for our bills to be paid, then that’s life. 

DCFC79

Whats in her contract ?