Is it worth getting an EV?

DrEskimo

Flight3287462 said:

DrEskimo said:

Based on what?

The laws of battery physics, Lithium batteries degrade from first use.  The only way they kid you on they are not degrading is having more batteries that can be switched as the battery degrades.

There are plenty of scientific papers you can peruse.

I’m perfectly aware that batteries do degrade. I meant where did the concern of real life battery degradation on current used EVs come from. 

According to you and others we should have 3 very expensive paper weights on our driveway with 6yr old EVs with mileages as high as 90k miles. 

In reality we have 3 perfectly functioning vehicles that have no noticeable reduction in range from when we got them over 4 years ago (all bought used with low mileages).

So I agree with the OP. A used 2-3yr old EV with average mileage should hit the sweet spot. But you could go older with lower mileage as age itself doesn’t seem to have much effect from what I’ve seen. 

Ditzy_Mitzy

Ectophile said:

Petrol and diesel engines wear over time, losing power and becoming less efficient. But people tend not to mention that.

You tend not to notice if a tank of fuel doesn't give you as many miles as it used to.

That's not always true.  Piston rings, valve guides, cylinder bores and the like do wear, but on lots of engines they will wear into a state of familiarity with each other.  An engine with a few miles on it can be 'looser' than a brand new one and produce more power than standard.  We have to assume proper maintenance, of course, and things like spark plugs being serviceable and carburettors and injection systems in proper tune.  

thegentleway

Ditzy_Mitzy said:

Ectophile said:

Petrol and diesel engines wear over time, losing power and becoming less efficient. But people tend not to mention that.

You tend not to notice if a tank of fuel doesn't give you as many miles as it used to.

That's not always true.  Piston rings, valve guides, cylinder bores and the like do wear, but on lots of engines they will wear into a state of familiarity with each other.  An engine with a few miles on it can be 'looser' than a brand new one and produce more power than standard.  We have to assume proper maintenance, of course, and things like spark plugs being serviceable and carburettors and injection systems in proper tune.  

It is indeed fairly common to get a small increase in power as the engine wears in but this wears continues and will reduce the efficiency. On modern engines, not by much and will hardly be noticeable. Carburettors were phased out in the 80s, in Europe at least, so not many about in the U.K. prob quite a few in places like Cuba. 

Petriix

Potentially the savings from running an EV purchase through a limited company are enormous. You could offset the entire purchase price against pre-tax profits then just pay the BIK. Definitely speak to an accountant to understand the options. 

Steve182

NI drops to 2% at £50,270 I think, so no you would not save 52% tax/NI

Would be 42% (20+20+2)

Dandytf

My experience going from ICE to EV late 2021.
Very good driving experience, maybe some features don't seem to be quite as powerful as Petrol cars such as heating.
Very almost silent sounds, No fumes other than a very rare smell similar to electric gadget's burning odour-which I found funny 1st time, nicer than petrol/diesel fuels.

Points to remember, very few pedestrians can hear the EV driving.
EV's Do take much more time to re charge, unlike re filling traditional fuels.(hours rather than minutes)
Winter re charging isn't always guaranteed, which I found from recent winter blast chill, lasting a few days- where EV charging socket latch was frozen solid, and when eventually opened, and when cable connected to this bonnet socket and charging point, on dash errors appeared.
Had to take car home untill freeze days passed to successfully re charge.

I'll always recommend going EV or possibly Hybrid.
Watching costs reduce I suspect substantially towards next 3 or more years.
Service and MOT's cost similar maybe with some maintenance every few years.  

Try Speakev.com
as recommended via mser forum users last year. 

macman

EV batteries reduce in capacity, but not in efficiency. The range reduces, but the cost per mile does not increase.
The ICE equivalent would be the petrol tank magically shrinking-you'd still get the same mpg.

thegentleway

Steve182 said:

NI drops to 2% at £50,270 I think, so no you would not save 52% tax/NI

Would be 42% (20+20+2)

Indeed, however my situation is that I earn less than £50k via PAYE. I then do a tax return for my other income, which takes me into higher rate. I don't pay NI on this. So if I were to salary sacrifice EV I think I would save 52%?

thegentleway

macman said:

EV batteries reduce in capacity, but not in efficiency. The range reduces, but the cost per mile does not increase.
The ICE equivalent would be the petrol tank magically shrinking-you'd still get the same mpg.

Batteries do reduce in efficiency. One of the main ageing mechanism is the solid electrolyte interphase layer growth, which increases the internal resistance, and therefore reduces the efficiency.

fred990

thegentleway said:

macman said:

EV batteries reduce in capacity, but not in efficiency. The range reduces, but the cost per mile does not increase.
The ICE equivalent would be the petrol tank magically shrinking-you'd still get the same mpg.

Batteries do reduce in efficiency. One of the main ageing mechanism is the solid electrolyte interphase layer growth, which increases the internal resistance, and therefore reduces the efficiency.

Indeed....laughable that EVangelists believe in loss of capacity but not efficiency! Not a direct swipe at macman btw.

So....how do you measure IR in a car pack? 

If I can't check a used ev battery pack IR it's non starter.