Santander - onerous security checks

Band7

happybagger said:

To be honest it's not just on the payments front Santander have become a PITA with.

As my parents have got into the habit of using contactless, when my mother came to pay in a cafe it was an occasion she required a PIN to be entered. She'd forgotten it. The process to get a replacement PIN sent was very distressing for her.

I went and asked at the branch, they didn't need to bring up any details, I simply passed on her account number and asked them to send that person a PIN. They point blank refused. She would have to come in. Despite the fact that she can only walk about 50 steps. My dad went in, a joint account holder (!) but no, "Then she'll have to phone them"

She did. It failed due to her hearing. She tried again, with me writing down the answers so she could say them. The bloke at the other end implied that she was being forced into asking for her pin number and went off for 20 minutes. She got very stressed at all this.

It has led me to go down the general power of attorney route. We'll see how they do with that.

I understand why Santander did not act on the say-so of people who don't have authority to act on behalf of the account holder. Getting POA is the right way forward.

Does your mum use the Santander app, btw? As account holders can view their PIN in the app.

happybagger

Asking them to send a PIN (reminder or new) should cause no problem as it would only go to the registered address anyway
And how it could be an issue when her husband as joint account holder could not request the same would appear even more bizarre.

No she doesn't use the app. She doesn't have a mobile phone. She is 85 and would find using any mobile difficult. Personally I wish she'd have stuck to cash for all purchases. That way she'd remember her pin (as she'd be drawing the cash out, regularly requiring it)

The POA is going to take a while as well since they have a nice system online but it requires a scan, which I can't do or upload. We'll see how good their branch staff are when I can get to an open branch

PosterBoy77

I have banked with Santander for many years and have also experienced more problems with them than many other banks. The one thing I find very irritating is that now most banks have Confirmation of Payee systems in place, they don't actually seem to use it to guide their security checks. Almost all the times I have had transactions blocked in the last two years has been to do with sending payments to my own accounts. The Confirmation of Payee has already confirmed the account to match my name which is not that common and yet they still often block asking to reconfirm various things about not lying and being coerced to make a transaction. I can understand this if the bank could not verify the Payee, but once they can they should use a bit more sensible.

The most extreme case was when I transferred some money to my son's junior ISA held with Halifax from a current account of mine also held at Halifax which they blocked for security reasons. They should most certainly have been able to see it was not a fraudsters account.

Band7

happybagger said:

Asking them to send a PIN (reminder or new) should cause no problem as it would only go to the registered address anyway
And how it could be an issue when her husband as joint account holder could not request the same would appear even more bizarre.

I am afraid - and pleased for you - you wouldn't make a good fraudster 

Somebody could have posed as the son of an 85 year-old lady, popped into a Santander Branch and asked for her PIN to be sent to her address. He'd then intercept the post of the old lady, and would just need to get hold of her card, which he'd probably have a plan for, too. Or the lady could have a mean, controlling or demented husband who wants to stop her using her debit card etc etc etc. Santander couldn't possibly know that you are both honest, caring people - - and would have been in dire straits if your mum had been defrauded. IMO, they did absolutely do the right thing on this occasion.

Getting the POA organised also seems the right thing to do. Whilst this is in progress, have you considered getting Third Party Access in the meantime? You should be able to sort this much faster than a POA.

happybagger

Yes, all what you said could have been true, except I have ALSO been a customer of Santander for 20 years and had ID with me.

However it is dressed up, the branch staff were not willing to even consider. It was an abrupt "No, she'll have to come in".

As for the POA that's easy, it's only the 'General' one as she still has her mind I did look at TPA but don't need (or want) a card
It also requires her to visit the branch! Whereas an OPOA doesn't.

TadleyBaggie

kinger101 said:

If that was the case, shouldn't they have queried a much larger amount entering the account a few days earlier?

Probably the algorithm has spotted two transfers in a short period which triggered it.

herebeme

LPOA just gives you (the attorney) a card on the account in your own name. At least with NatWest that’s what happen with me for my parents. I asked for the PINs for my Dad’s cards and they said no - you get your own card and own PIN on the account. 

Joint account holders have their own PINs on the joint account and can’t request for the other person. I agree it’s odd! 

My Dad also doesn’t have a smart phone. So I put the banking app on my phone. That way I could show him his balances when I visited (he’s too far gone now to ask anymore though). 

Overall LPOA is a godsend for so many things. You may want to change the primary phone number on the accounts to your mobile if you’re going to be making payments when not in the presence of the original account holder. So you can get the authorisation codes easily. You’ll need their permission for that if they are still competent. 

hoc

Santander are probably the worst when it comes to blocking and having the most over the top security prompts.

SAC2334

Rollinghome said:

kinger101 said:

Just had my account blocked and then wasted 20 mins of the phone...

I sympathise.  Santander is in a class of its own for annoying customers with their security checks.  They used to be fine until a year or two ago.  Then it started.

It’s not the checks that are the problem, we all understand the reasons, but the ineptitude of their systems and the unusually charmless staff they seem to prefer for the task.  Their mindset appears to be you’ve stopped being a customer and become just another potential fraudster.

When I tried to move a large sum in tranches from NS&I to Santander, the nominated bank, then onto another account I’d moved money to for years, every payment was stopped, including four times in two weeks. It was quite a lot of money, but nothing they shouldn't be able to get their heads round.

Each time, when I did the transaction I got the text, entered the code, and was told the transaction had completed. But when I checked, the money hadn’t arrived so I checked Santander’s ‘Pending Payments’.  Nothing there.

Then I got an automated call asking for my DOB and to confirm that I’d made the withdrawal.  That was accepted and was told a note had been made, but I would need to do the transaction again.  So I logged back in, did the transaction again as instructed with the usual 2 factor authentication... and immediately found my account blocked.  That was followed by phoning them, queuing for a lifetime, being passed on and put in another queue, followed by the inane interrogation.  This happened not once, but same nonsense every time.

My remedy was to move my banking elsewhere and only use them when I have to. They did pay a measly £30 compensation when I complained, and they do seem a lot better of late, but my nerves wouldn’t stand using them as my main bank again.

And yes, there are more competent banks around, all the other banks I use are normally fine.

Not just Santander , HSBC  (First Direct ) did exactly the same thing when I was transferring payments from Santanders E saver to Zopa . Every payment of over £5000 was blocked .

I had many conversations with the security staff one of which was virtually impossible to understand with a fast robotic accent which resulted in me ending the conversation to try another one a few minutes later.

All of these conversations had to be conducted in my back garden because the line was too intermittent for some reason. It has always been OK on every other conversation indoors so I think it was more likely their line which was nt up to it
I agree that a security check is important but surely after several blocks on a transfer to Zopa they can accept future ones and not interrogate every transaction .

sheffieldeagle

herebeme said:

LPOA just gives you (the attorney) a card on the account in your own name. At least with NatWest that’s what happen with me for my parents. I asked for the PINs for my Dad’s cards and they said no - you get your own card and own PIN on the account. 

Joint account holders have their own PINs on the joint account and can’t request for the other person. I agree it’s odd! 

My Dad also doesn’t have a smart phone. So I put the banking app on my phone. That way I could show him his balances when I visited (he’s too far gone now to ask anymore though). 

Overall LPOA is a godsend for so many things. You may want to change the primary phone number on the accounts to your mobile if you’re going to be making payments when not in the presence of the original account holder. So you can get the authorisation codes easily. You’ll need their permission for that if they are still competent. 

Hi

I'm looking to register an LPA for my parents joint account but just for my mum. Was your parents a joint account and did you have an LPA for both? I'm not sure how it works.

Cheers