Pick Primary School based on Secondary?

GedlingRed

You need to check the admissions criteria for the secondary school, being in a feeder school doesn't guarantee you'll get a place at the secondary school.  I work at a primary school which feeds into an outstanding oversubscribed secondary however based on the secondary admissions criteria being at a feeder school is 5th on the list of criteria behind LAC children, 10% performing arts, siblings attending secondary, living in catchment and then feeder school.  Based on this many of our children do not get into the secondary as the places are filled by 1-4.

Savvy_Sue

GedlingRed said:

You need to check the admissions criteria for the secondary school, being in a feeder school doesn't guarantee you'll get a place at the secondary school.  I work at a primary school which feeds into an outstanding oversubscribed secondary however based on the secondary admissions criteria being at a feeder school is 5th on the list of criteria behind LAC children, 10% performing arts, siblings attending secondary, living in catchment and then feeder school.  Based on this many of our children do not get into the secondary as the places are filled by 1-4.

Not only that, and apologies to the OP if I'm banging on about this, but admissions criteria can change! So even if right now your child would stand a good chance of moving smoothly from the primary to the secondary school, that is no guarantee they'll be able to do so in 6 years time! 

BTW, it may be particularly important to understand the criteria of faith schools. When I wanted to move one of mine to a Roman Catholic school, I found that "the unbaptised" came at the bottom of a very long list of criteria. As our Christian tradition does not practice infant baptism, this seemed problematic, although we had followed the normal process - for us - of holding a service of Thanksgiving, Naming and Blessing (and we had a certificate to prove it). Fortunately the Head took a pragmatic view and I think the criteria were re-worded to allow for this diversity. 

Then we moved, and the CofE secondary school we wanted to use required both child and parent to be in church pretty much every Sunday for two years. However, by the time our youngest went there, two years had gone up to four. Not a problem for us: we were going to be in church anyway. But I do wonder if some parents were caught out by the increase. 

silvercar

Savvy_Sue said:

GedlingRed said:

You need to check the admissions criteria for the secondary school, being in a feeder school doesn't guarantee you'll get a place at the secondary school.  I work at a primary school which feeds into an outstanding oversubscribed secondary however based on the secondary admissions criteria being at a feeder school is 5th on the list of criteria behind LAC children, 10% performing arts, siblings attending secondary, living in catchment and then feeder school.  Based on this many of our children do not get into the secondary as the places are filled by 1-4.

Not only that, and apologies to the OP if I'm banging on about this, but admissions criteria can change! So even if right now your child would stand a good chance of moving smoothly from the primary to the secondary school, that is no guarantee they'll be able to do so in 6 years time! 

BTW, it may be particularly important to understand the criteria of faith schools. When I wanted to move one of mine to a Roman Catholic school, I found that "the unbaptised" came at the bottom of a very long list of criteria. As our Christian tradition does not practice infant baptism, this seemed problematic, although we had followed the normal process - for us - of holding a service of Thanksgiving, Naming and Blessing (and we had a certificate to prove it). Fortunately the Head took a pragmatic view and I think the criteria were re-worded to allow for this diversity. 

Then we moved, and the CofE secondary school we wanted to use required both child and parent to be in church pretty much every Sunday for two years. However, by the time our youngest went there, two years had gone up to four. Not a problem for us: we were going to be in church anyway. But I do wonder if some parents were caught out by the increase. 

More than likely the increase to 4 years was deliberate to catch out those who were trying to game the system. It’s fine if there are enough places for all you want to attract, you can then be relaxed about those attending in order to get a place, in fact you may find some enjoy it so much they never leave. Not so fine when your faithful followers are denied places by those who have found religion in order to gain a place.

pickledonionspaceraider

I think, why not look at having happy kids, rather than future potential results

The nearest school is definitely the best option.  Having them at a school further away will mean they have less local friends and will impact their social life - which is equally important.  Happy kids are far more important

Just to add, I am slightly biased, as I moved from a state school to a faith school - part way through my senior years - at age 12, and it was a massive shock to the system. Bullying and misbehaviour was rife and the pastoral support was abysmal.  Teachers didn't teach, they screamed and threatened  until the children until they became submissive. Petty rule following more important than actual learning.  Lessons that had the most emphasis were religion based and religious studies and school mass, took up a huge amount of time where we could be learning something else.  Racism from the teachers towards non English students, was shocking. Spent a good proportion of the time standing outside due to some rebels setting off the fire alarms, at least once per day, every day. Often every hour. 
Teachers were actively cruel and looked for ways to embarrass students and would scream and shout for very little reason
The misbehaviour was on levels I had never come across - I think it was rebellion due to how strictly the rules were imposed and how out of date the teachings were - we were bored and micromanaged.  Drug taking instead of smoking was normal, and I am not just talking about smoking the herb
Parents were actively encouraged to put their children into local authority care system, I know, it happened to my family, and two other families that I knew of , in my  year group -  and it wasn't that long ago.  I would steer clear of faith schools for my children. There was a sixth form, and only three of my year group stayed on to it.  The rest of us left as soon as we were eligible or sooner

This is my opinion though from my own experiences, but I wouldn't judge a book by it's cover, just because they get good grades - are the kids happy? spending their time in relevant ways? 

Savvy_Sue

silvercar said:

Savvy_Sue said:

GedlingRed said:

You need to check the admissions criteria for the secondary school, being in a feeder school doesn't guarantee you'll get a place at the secondary school.  I work at a primary school which feeds into an outstanding oversubscribed secondary however based on the secondary admissions criteria being at a feeder school is 5th on the list of criteria behind LAC children, 10% performing arts, siblings attending secondary, living in catchment and then feeder school.  Based on this many of our children do not get into the secondary as the places are filled by 1-4.

Not only that, and apologies to the OP if I'm banging on about this, but admissions criteria can change! So even if right now your child would stand a good chance of moving smoothly from the primary to the secondary school, that is no guarantee they'll be able to do so in 6 years time! 

BTW, it may be particularly important to understand the criteria of faith schools. When I wanted to move one of mine to a Roman Catholic school, I found that "the unbaptised" came at the bottom of a very long list of criteria. As our Christian tradition does not practice infant baptism, this seemed problematic, although we had followed the normal process - for us - of holding a service of Thanksgiving, Naming and Blessing (and we had a certificate to prove it). Fortunately the Head took a pragmatic view and I think the criteria were re-worded to allow for this diversity. 

Then we moved, and the CofE secondary school we wanted to use required both child and parent to be in church pretty much every Sunday for two years. However, by the time our youngest went there, two years had gone up to four. Not a problem for us: we were going to be in church anyway. But I do wonder if some parents were caught out by the increase. 

More than likely the increase to 4 years was deliberate to catch out those who were trying to game the system. It’s fine if there are enough places for all you want to attract, you can then be relaxed about those attending in order to get a place, in fact you may find some enjoy it so much they never leave. Not so fine when your faithful followers are denied places by those who have found religion in order to gain a place.

A mix of parents trying to game the system, and not enough places for those who were applying under this category.

I vividly remember a colleague asking how they'd get their then pre-schooler into this school or its feeder primary. I suggested starting to attend church, every week, and getting involved enough that the church leaders would know who they were. They were shocked: "I couldn't do that!" And nor could I: the fact was we were already doing so from conviction, and I did not intend to choose church schools when the eldest started school.

Spendless

pickledonionspaceraider said:

I think, why not look at having happy kids, rather than future potential results

The nearest school is definitely the best option.  Having them at a school further away will mean they have less local friends and will impact their social life - which is equally important.  Happy kids are far more important

Just to add, I am slightly biased, as I moved from a state school to a faith school - part way through my senior years - at age 12, and it was a massive shock to the system. Bullying and misbehaviour was rife and the pastoral support was abysmal.  Teachers didn't teach, they screamed and threatened  until the children until they became submissive. Petty rule following more important than actual learning.  Lessons that had the most emphasis were religion based and religious studies and school mass, took up a huge amount of time where we could be learning something else.  Racism from the teachers towards non English students, was shocking. Spent a good proportion of the time standing outside due to some rebels setting off the fire alarms, at least once per day, every day. Often every hour. 
Teachers were actively cruel and looked for ways to embarrass students and would scream and shout for very little reason
The misbehaviour was on levels I had never come across - I think it was rebellion due to how strictly the rules were imposed and how out of date the teachings were - we were bored and micromanaged.  Drug taking instead of smoking was normal, and I am not just talking about smoking the herb
Parents were actively encouraged to put their children into local authority care system, I know, it happened to my family, and two other families that I knew of , in my  year group -  and it wasn't that long ago.  I would steer clear of faith schools for my children. There was a sixth form, and only three of my year group stayed on to it.  The rest of us left as soon as we were eligible or sooner

This is my opinion though from my own experiences, but I wouldn't judge a book by it's cover, just because they get good grades - are the kids happy? spending their time in relevant ways? 

We went though a very similar experience, in a non faith school with it's Outstanding Ofsted (under a different head) and my child sat GCSE's in 2019, so very little time ago.

Not the disruptive behaviour you're describing in that way but the verbal and psychological bullying was rife and school did little to nothing about it and if they did the punishment had become on a par with having the wrong shade of black school bag, because misdemeanours like these were now an isolation punishment.  The teacher s became exactly as you've described. 

I was to find out that when the new Head came in she had got rid of the pastoral system in place and put more resources into teaching maths and English, which was fine for the children in those subjects it wasn't fine for the kids who needed support for their well being.

OP - It is far too early to be basing your choices on what Secondary school your child will attend. 

JReacher1

You can't ignore the secondary school.  Although 7 years seems a long time away and things can change you do need to really plan ahead for what secondary school you want your child to be in.  I know parents who have decided the religion of their child (Anglican over Catholic) purely to get their kid into a decent secondary C of E school.

You really need to do whatever you can to ensure your kid gets an education at a decent secondary school