Gas supply cutoff after Smart Meter installation

FindMyWayBack

When did you have a gas safety check prior to this installation? That would have found a leak...

hallmark

FindMyWayBack said:

When did you have a gas safety check prior to this installation? That would have found a leak...

I'd have to check.  We've had work done on the boiler about a year ago which I presume would have involved standard checks (although not any kind of an expert).

Nearlyold

"What I'm questioning is whether the leak was there to begin with or whether it was caused by the work, as I find it very difficult to believe that a gas plumber would test a system, find it had a leak, then proceed with work anyway."

I would guess he thought that fitting the new Smart Meter while he was there would save making another trip and perhaps he thought there was a small chance the leak was related to the old meter so he might as well fit the new one as you (the customer) would be no worse off if that didn't fix the leak.

With regard to the work causing the leak, this would seem unlikely as the leak would then have to be in the immediate vicinity of the meter and thus traceable by the second engineer who couldn't find the source.

hallmark

Nearlyold said:

"What I'm questioning is whether the leak was there to begin with or whether it was caused by the work, as I find it very difficult to believe that a gas plumber would test a system, find it had a leak, then proceed with work anyway."

I would guess he thought that fitting the new Smart Meter while he was there would save making another trip and perhaps he thought there was a small chance the leak was related to the old meter so he might as well fit the new one as you (the customer) would be no worse off if that didn't fix the leak.

With regard to the work causing the leak, this would seem unlikely as the leak would then have to be in the immediate vicinity of the meter and thus traceable by the second engineer who couldn't find the source.

That's essentially what the engineer said, but as I've mentioned, there are two issues with that.  Firstly why would he not point out to me that there was an existing leak?  I was literally in the next room and he'd already asked us a few questions and explained certain things (one of which was "I can't begin work unless you demonstrate every appliance is working" which required me to turn every ring on the hob on in front of him, as well as the boiler (so he could see the pilot light) and the gas fire.  Having done all that, it seems highly unlikely he would then test, find a leak and carry on regardless without even mentioning it.

The second issue, again as I've said before, is I find it hard to believe that their procedures would permit him to begin worn on a known leaking system even if he wanted to.   I haven't asked Scottish Power this yet (I shall) but I'd be very surprised if it turns out to be the case.

Vegastare

As you say really think proving whether the leak existed  prior to fitting would be hard.  

But why would an engineer start the work if he found leak. Beggars belief. These fitters are contracted by Utility suppliers and after an incident years ago when some hair brain engineer came to mine via my home insurance emergency I vowed I would not have company in the house again. (they fitted smart meters for my previous supplier as name was mentioned on email ad -I declined)

I would be asking why fitter commenced work. 

Lorian

I have a lot of sympathy for hallmark here. I would not have expected them to proceed with the work if the saw the 5mb drop on the pre-installation test. I watched my meter swap recently and the first thing he did was the pre-swap pressure test. I would complain to the supplier. Ultimately now you need a local gas safe engineer to test it and try and resolve. If it was me I'd suggesting they isolate the gas fire and re-testing before ripping up any floor boards. 

macman

But the leak may not have been detected when he started the install. It seems logical to do the meter work and then test for leaks. It's quite possible that the leak could be on the meter inlet or outlet and so resolved by changing the meter. It wasn't, so he retested it and advised you of a leak. Correctly so.

nofoollikeold

1. Doing any gas work it is normal to test the installation before commencing work and again afterwards.  Otherwise you can be blamed for a leak which was already present. Standard process is:
2. "Let by" test to make sure the Emergency Control Valve (ECV) is not letting gas past when shut.
3. Tightness test.
4. Carry out work.
5. "Let by" test again.
6 Tightness test again.

As far as I can see no one is arguing about the presence of a leak.  The issue is whether or not it was present before the meter change.  Given that no pre-work testing appears to have been done, it will be very difficult to determine whether the leak was pre or post work, leaving the OP with the cost of rectification.  

hallmark

macman said:

But the leak may not have been detected when he started the install. It seems logical to do the meter work and then test for leaks. It's quite possible that the leak could be on the meter inlet or outlet and so resolved by changing the meter. It wasn't, so he retested it and advised you of a leak. Correctly so.

No, as I explained in the beginning in the 2nd paragraph the engineer said he DID test before starting and that the leak had been there.  This is literally the point I've been making since the start.

purple_rose

Hallmark you have my sympathy. We had a engineer come and change our smart metre. On leaving he said we had a small gas leak but it was within permissible limits. Little did he know I have a gas detection device. He said he thought it was the front room gas fire. I went around the whole house under floorboards with the detection device searching for a leak and where did I find it? Under connector he placed between the metre and the pipe in the house. So I called octopus they called cadent who sent round an emergency engineer. The emergency engineer said the leak is twice the legal permissible limit. A lot of gas engineers are skipping doing the test before they change the metre and then they are choosing what to put down on the form as a leek. Apparently this is rife and the operating companies like octopus are taking no responsibility. He could see the washers that should have been changed we're not changed and in our case had been disturbed during the installation of the smart metre and as they were degrading had caused the leak. Smart metre installation man had not followed gas safe procedures and so the Kayden engineer will be reporting into their health and safety executive and and using something called riddor to report him. He said he will probably get a slap on the wrist but that as people are under time pressure they are skipping a lot of the things that they should be doing. Interestingly when I contacted octopus they said as the issue was in the house they could do nothing to help. I know the gas man who installed the metre caused the problem because I had checked the whole house myself with my detector prior I'm quite conscious about these things because a friend actually died in a gas incident. Octopus are only concerned about their liability and they are saying that as the leak was in the house I have to pay for an engineer to fix it. Clearly I know he caused the leak clearly I know he didn't follow procedures of safety and put my family at risk clearly I have the evidence of the pipe that comes from the metre and the washer that is degraded both of which should have been replaced and delete could easily easily of been found. The meter engineers are not interested in anything that takes there time and there is little recourse for the consumer as far as I know. IAM disgusted.