Self employed UC - investigation

seatbeltnoob

I'm not under investigation or anything.

I'm just a bit fed up with the assessor who doesn't have a clue about business and expenses constantly quizzing me on my expenses. Because I have 3500+ incomes and some 2000+ expenses on an ecommerce business.

I'm still on my startup period and had to stunt my growth and take up a delivery job so I can have income above MIF just so I can avoids their derisory remarks about my business.

Delivery job has taken most of all my time and I find it very hard to switch between manual labour work (delivery) to come home and do analytical, creative work on the website.

The assesor at the job centre nitpicks on things like she;'s skimming through my expenses saying the expenses are too high. then quizzes me on "what's BBL interest?". I said it's bouneback loan intererst [a mere £8.82 a month]. She replies "you're not allowed to claim interest". I am adamanat that I am because I have read the UC guide and know for a fact that we're allowed up to £41 in interest each month. Then she back peddles "Ok you dont have to answer to me, I'm just an observer, I'm just warning you that I'm sure interest isn't allowed and you need to keep your proof and receipts for any potential investigation".

I have a feeling she thinks I'm making up my expenses and fraudulent claiming them. I have run ltd company for 10 years. I've had to rebuilt a new business from scratch after financial difficulty. I have also been VAT registered so I have a lot of experience on record keeping and book keeping. But I am fed up of these ignorant remarks. And this is supposed to be a self employed specialist. 

I'm expencting her to report my business as suspicipous for further ivnestigation and I'm fully prepared for this.

Just wondering if anyone has been investigated and what is the procedure. I am completely prepared as I have all the receipts and use digital bookkeeping where all the scans of receipts are attached to all the entries so everything is well organised.

seatbeltnoob

sole trader or ltd is just an administrative thing of UC. It wont matter, if you're not eligible for UC now, you wont be eligible for UC through a ltd. Because your income will still be too high.

We would not be entitled to universal credit (as a couple) had it not been for our sky high private rent. If we were in a council house paying £650 rent a month we would not be entitled to anything. But our rent is £1550 a month.

You have to declare all your income, not just your ltd co income. But any earnings you make.

UC dont just look at the money through PAYE, but work out your personal and company profits via receipts and payments on your bank.

E.g.

receipts: £4000
expenses: £2000

PAYE to director: £800
profit: £1200

e.g2.

receiprs £4000

expenses £2000

PAYE to director: £0

profit £2000

UC will add the business profit and PAYE amount so in both cases it will record [correctly] that your earnings were £2000.

tightauldgit

seatbeltnoob said:

I'm not under investigation or anything.

I'm just a bit fed up with the assessor who doesn't have a clue about business and expenses constantly quizzing me on my expenses. Because I have 3500+ incomes and some 2000+ expenses on an ecommerce business.

I'm still on my startup period and had to stunt my growth and take up a delivery job so I can have income above MIF just so I can avoids their derisory remarks about my business.

Delivery job has taken most of all my time and I find it very hard to switch between manual labour work (delivery) to come home and do analytical, creative work on the website.

The assesor at the job centre nitpicks on things like she;'s skimming through my expenses saying the expenses are too high. then quizzes me on "what's BBL interest?". I said it's bouneback loan intererst [a mere £8.82 a month]. She replies "you're not allowed to claim interest". I am adamanat that I am because I have read the UC guide and know for a fact that we're allowed up to £41 in interest each month. Then she back peddles "Ok you dont have to answer to me, I'm just an observer, I'm just warning you that I'm sure interest isn't allowed and you need to keep your proof and receipts for any potential investigation".

I have a feeling she thinks I'm making up my expenses and fraudulent claiming them. I have run ltd company for 10 years. I've had to rebuilt a new business from scratch after financial difficulty. I have also been VAT registered so I have a lot of experience on record keeping and book keeping. But I am fed up of these ignorant remarks. And this is supposed to be a self employed specialist. 

I'm expencting her to report my business as suspicipous for further ivnestigation and I'm fully prepared for this.

Just wondering if anyone has been investigated and what is the procedure. I am completely prepared as I have all the receipts and use digital bookkeeping where all the scans of receipts are attached to all the entries so everything is well organised.

I claimed UC as self-employed during the pandemic and never really had any issues but at that point  they weren't really checking much. I suppose the people looking at the claims have to do something to earn their money and looking for potential fraud is one of those things. 

If you're happy that you're in the right and have good records then you don't have anything to worry about. 

marcia_

Jacob_Jones said:

The assesor at the job centre nitpicks on things like she;'s skimming through my expenses saying the expenses are too high. then quizzes me on "what's BBL interest?". I said it's bouneback loan intererst [a mere £8.82 a month]. She replies "you're not allowed to claim interest". I am adamanat that I am because I have read the UC guide and know for a fact that we're allowed up to £41 in interest each month. Then she back peddles "Ok you dont have to answer to me, I'm just an observer, I'm just warning you that I'm sure interest isn't allowed and you need to keep your proof and receipts for any potential investigation".

My polite response would be:

'Thank you very much for mentioning your concerns to me verbally. For the avoidance of any misunderstanding, please confirm your exact concerns to me in writing. Kind Regards.' 

 You have strange ideas about how the DWP works and what they will and won't provide. 

marcia_

Jacob_Jones said:

marcia_ said:

Jacob_Jones said:

The assesor at the job centre nitpicks on things like she;'s skimming through my expenses saying the expenses are too high. then quizzes me on "what's BBL interest?". I said it's bouneback loan intererst [a mere £8.82 a month]. She replies "you're not allowed to claim interest". I am adamanat that I am because I have read the UC guide and know for a fact that we're allowed up to £41 in interest each month. Then she back peddles "Ok you dont have to answer to me, I'm just an observer, I'm just warning you that I'm sure interest isn't allowed and you need to keep your proof and receipts for any potential investigation".

My polite response would be:

'Thank you very much for mentioning your concerns to me verbally. For the avoidance of any misunderstanding, please confirm your exact concerns to me in writing. Kind Regards.' 

 You have strange ideas about how the DWP works and what they will and won't provide. 

I don't know about the DWP, but when other people have made dubious comments to me, they often shrink away when asked to put those problems in writing... 

 They'll definitely put a note in your journal informing you of your responsibilities and obligations but anything else is laughable 

huckster

As long as you are following the UC self-employment guide when completing the income and expenses reporting, there is nothing to worry about.

In regard to a high amount of expenses, it is reasonable to ask questions. Always up to you to keep records, so that if anyone audits what you have reported, you have evidence available.

seatbeltnoob

marcia_ said:

Jacob_Jones said:

marcia_ said:

Jacob_Jones said:

The assesor at the job centre nitpicks on things like she;'s skimming through my expenses saying the expenses are too high. then quizzes me on "what's BBL interest?". I said it's bouneback loan intererst [a mere £8.82 a month]. She replies "you're not allowed to claim interest". I am adamanat that I am because I have read the UC guide and know for a fact that we're allowed up to £41 in interest each month. Then she back peddles "Ok you dont have to answer to me, I'm just an observer, I'm just warning you that I'm sure interest isn't allowed and you need to keep your proof and receipts for any potential investigation".

My polite response would be:

'Thank you very much for mentioning your concerns to me verbally. For the avoidance of any misunderstanding, please confirm your exact concerns to me in writing. Kind Regards.' 

 You have strange ideas about how the DWP works and what they will and won't provide. 

I don't know about the DWP, but when other people have made dubious comments to me, they often shrink away when asked to put those problems in writing... 

 They'll definitely put a note in your journal informing you of your responsibilities and obligations but anything else is laughable 

That has been my experience. I had issues in the past where I was paying myself paye of £900 and the profit from self employment was £400.

They were making derisory remarks that the profit was only £400 and this isn't a viable business. I said to them that you need to add in the £900 because that is also my earnings. We went back and forth on this issue and they kept going back to their hlaf baked idea that PAYE is an expense and not earnings or income. "You write of PAYE as expense - it is not an income it is an expense". It was so difficult to get them to understand that it is an expense of the business, but it is my personal income, that £900 was transferred from the business into my personal account. It was so frustrating. So I asked them to put that in writing in the journal. Basically say that all in writing. Or confirm what they've told me in person. But they just refused and avoided the question.

I had a long back and forth with them, they jobcentre person got their senior manager and other coworkers standing behind the glass. All disagreeing with me parroting "PAYE is an expense not income".

I wanted it in writing so I could complain to DWP about the poor training and lack of understanding. 

They did not admit to me they were wrong, but in subsequent reviews they just added PAYE onto the self employed profits. On my last review I'm going to give them a heart attack. I'll put £1500 through PAYE and get the profits to show as £0.

Spoonie_Turtle

seatbeltnoob said:

I'm still on my startup period and had to stunt my growth and take up a delivery job so I can have income above MIF just so I can avoids their derisory remarks about my business.

I don't understand what you mean by this.  In your startup period the MIF doesn't apply, precisely because you're still growing the business, it's not expected to be producing a livable income until 12 months later.

[It does sound like you've had a lot of frustrating appointments at the Jobcentre though, so I do sympathise there.]

seatbeltnoob

they just made remarks about not hitting MIF and I need to be earning MIF, so I just got a delivery driving job and made MIF after the first quarterly review and have been hitting in consistently since.