Rise in energy firms remotely switching homes to prepay meters (BBC)

QrizB

I thought the BBC article would cause some debate here, and it seems I was right

The numbers involved are interesting:

Citizens Advice predicts that 450,000 people could be forced onto a prepayment plan this winter and of those, it expects 180,000 to be made as automatic remote switches via a smart meter.

450k households sounds like a lot, but there are around 25M households in the UK so it's less than 2%.

I think their estimate of 180k smart meter switches (40% of 450k) is just aplying the statistic that ~40% of energy accounts currently have "smart" smart meters.

mr_stripey

Deleted_User said:

mr_stripey said:

Thanks for the individual responses to my question about whether pre pay was more expensive. 

I thought it would be very unjust if pre pay customers were having to pay more per "unit" or whatever than the standard tariff, but it seems that isn't the case.

According to the BBC it IS the case for people that are having their smart meters switched remotely. 

Yes I get that, but the point I was seeking to clarify is that the individual price of the energy is not more expensive on pre pay

Astria

Deleted_User said:

mr_stripey said:

Deleted_User said:

mr_stripey said:

Thanks for the individual responses to my question about whether pre pay was more expensive. 

I thought it would be very unjust if pre pay customers were having to pay more per "unit" or whatever than the standard tariff, but it seems that isn't the case.

According to the BBC it IS the case for people that are having their smart meters switched remotely. 

Yes I get that, but the point I was seeking to clarify is that the individual price of the energy is not more expensive on pre pay

I think the individual price of the energy IS more expensive. 

EDF seem to argue with you on that point - they say PAYG is CHEAPER:

So if you use more than 5 kWh/day to pay for the higher standing charge, you are bettter off on pre-pay than DD.

EssexHebridean

mr_stripey said:

Deleted_User said:

mr_stripey said:

Thanks for the individual responses to my question about whether pre pay was more expensive. 

I thought it would be very unjust if pre pay customers were having to pay more per "unit" or whatever than the standard tariff, but it seems that isn't the case.

According to the BBC it IS the case for people that are having their smart meters switched remotely. 

Yes I get that, but the point I was seeking to clarify is that the individual price of the energy is not more expensive on pre pay

The poster you are replying to here has an axe to grind and is deliberately stating misinformation to try to add validity to their point. The "regulars" on here have already clarified the situation regarding the pre-pay rates - and those rates are standard, for avoidance of doubt there isn't a separate rate card being used for people who've been switched to PP meters in the circumstances quoted. So no - regardless of what the BBC are claiming, it will be untrue that "Kelly" has been switched to anything other than a standard PP tariff, as that is the only option for them to have been switched to! 

It would be massively helpful at this point in time if the media would report honestly and factually - but "the truth often doesn't sell papers" sadly - or in this case doesn't get clicks on the internet - and so we have the sensationalism that the article this thread is about is riddled with. 

On the case of "Kelly" there is clearly a lot more going on that meets the eye - at the monthly amounts stated they are clearly a high user - that could be because they are in a poorly insulated property, it could be because they are all-electric with inappropriate heating installed, or it could be quite simply that they have never really engaged with what things cost, have every light in the house on 24/7, heating running while they all sit around in shorts and t-shirts, and take 30-minute showers twice a day using an electric shower. The BBC have chosen not to give us the facts, so it's impossible to take an informed view on Kelly's situation. What we do know from what is presented is that they have managed to run up a £1000 debt over an unspecified period of time - it sounds as though the increase to the DD was perhaps made in a bid to claw back some of the debt but those payments then bounced - perhaps leading to nothing being paid. The process to switch a meter to PP is not - as has been explained by others - an overnight one, notice WOULD have been given, and in fact Kelly might now actually be paying LESS for electricity than they were paying before - which of course will actually be a help to them going forwards. 

It seems that some people here (not you Mr_Stripey!) fail to understand that the media doesn't always tell the truth - and indeed doesn't always even tell the full story, and so should be viewed with an objective eye. 

The_Green_Hornet

Sadly the journalistic standards at the BBC aren't what they used to be and articles with headlines such as the one highlighted by the OP are little more than click-bait.

GingerTim

Deleted_User said:

Astria said:

Deleted_User said:

mr_stripey said:

Deleted_User said:

mr_stripey said:

Thanks for the individual responses to my question about whether pre pay was more expensive. 

I thought it would be very unjust if pre pay customers were having to pay more per "unit" or whatever than the standard tariff, but it seems that isn't the case.

According to the BBC it IS the case for people that are having their smart meters switched remotely. 

Yes I get that, but the point I was seeking to clarify is that the individual price of the energy is not more expensive on pre pay

I think the individual price of the energy IS more expensive. 

EDF seem to argue with you on that point - they say PAYG is CHEAPER:

So if you use more than 5 kWh/day to pay for the higher standing charge, you are bettter off on pre-pay than DD.

Thank you for that. I had been looking at standing charge.

So, why are people on smart meters being switched to pre-paid meters that result in higher charges? (That's what the BBC article claims).

And why aren't the media (and MSE) updating people - they did a big push to get everyone onto DD by telling them it was cheaper. It has been SO successful that the regulars on here (who seem to stay up to date with info) were insisting to me that I should stay on DD because it was the cheapest way to pay?

Wouldn't it make sense to guide people towards the cheapest way to pay BEFORE they get into debt?

https://www.thesun.co.uk/money/19661930/martin-lewis-cheapest-way-pay-your-energy-bills/

They aren't, the article is incorrect. As @EssexHebridean notes above, individuals in this situation can only be switched to the standard pre-payment tariff. 

GingerTim

It changed when the Energy Price Guarantee came in - there are several threads on the board from surprised members who were contacted by their supplier to point out that they could save a little money by switching to a pre-payment tariff.

My neighbours recently moved to a pre-payment tariff with EDF as they will save approximately £200/year - and because they were on a smart meter it was an instantaneous switch, no need to pay more while waiting for a replacement PAYG meter.

EssexHebridean

We did consider going for a switch to pre-pay when we were also trying to switch the electricity to EDF as for us it would have worked out a fair chunk cheaper - decided on a "one step at a time" approach and allowing for the fiasco EDF made of failing to activate our switch, I'm certainly glad we didn't also put in for a change of meter at the same time as goodness knows what a mess they'd have made of that! 

GingerTim

EssexHebridean said:

We did consider going for a switch to pre-pay when we were also trying to switch the electricity to EDF as for us it would have worked out a fair chunk cheaper - decided on a "one step at a time" approach and allowing for the fiasco EDF made of failing to activate our switch, I'm certainly glad we didn't also put in for a change of meter at the same time as goodness knows what a mess they'd have made of that! 

I can quite believe it! Fortunately my neighbours were already with EDF, else I'd have warned them off it...

pochase

Because everything is different depending on the supplier, the region and the usage.

Yes, the electricity rates are cheaper, but gas is about 0.3p more expensive on prepaid. This is still cheaper than cash/cheque payment on receipt of a bill.

If you check the E7 tariffs on EDF you will find that the night rates are for some regions much cheaper, with high day rates. So it depends on your usage what will be cheaper.

You are the one who say the suppliers have no idea about the future usage, Now suddenly you say the supplier needs to tell the user what they will use in future and what based on their estimate is the best for them?