Energy Price Guarantee and fixed rates

[Deleted User]

964_targa said:

As a ‘newbie’ please forgive me if this is not the right forum……..
My query is about when the energy company I am with adds VAT to the bill.

What they have done is calculate my energy usage (£261.66) add the VAT (£13.08) giving a total of £274.74. Then deducting the energy support £66. Total paid by me of £208.74.

Normally VAT is added to the end of the bill so total energy usage £261.66) deduct the energy support £66 making £195.66, then add the VAT (£9.78) making total £205.44.

The difference being £3.30 - not a lot, but better in my pocket!

The supplier is correct. The EBSS rebate is after VAT - just like you being given cash.

jbuchanangb

Hello @Grahmb65. You are on the Next Flex tariff. Without the EPG the unit rate would have gone to 48.45p/kWh exc. VAT. (the OFGEM price cap rate) The EPG rate is 31.45p/kWh exc. VAT. E.ON handle this by listing the units used at the full rate, and then applying 17p/kWh exc. VAT discount.

Grahmb65

Thank you all for explaining the e-on bill. It is actually my son's bill and he asked me to explain it, but I couldn't fathom it out so that's why I asked on here. He's not on a fixed tariff and yes there is another section to the bill for electric, just for 2 days before 1st October and the bill is for electric only. The gas part came separate later, perhaps because he has a smart meter for electric and he has to do gas reading manually. I still think e-on makes the bill as complicated as possible. I am with Shell Energy and my bill is a lot simpler. They just issue my bill as normal then deducts £66 at the end. Dead simple.

Grahmb65

I am just comparing my Shell Energy bill with my son's e-on Energy bill after the 1st October price increase
the Shell Energy electric is 33.03p and gas is 10.24p including vat
the E-on Energy electric is 50.87p and gas is 14.67p including vat
all standing charges are about the same.
I thought the energy price guarantee meant that all tariffs are capped at the same rate for all energy companies, so why is E-on a lot dearer than shell. Am I being undercharged or is my son being overcharged? Am I missing something? Please help.

ariarnia

Grahmb65 said:

I am just comparing my Shell Energy bill with my son's e-on Energy bill after the 1st October price increase
the Shell Energy electric is 33.03p and gas is 10.24p including vat
the E-on Energy electric is 50.87p and gas is 14.67p including vat
all standing charges are about the same.
I thought the energy price guarantee meant that all tariffs are capped at the same rate for all energy companies, so why is E-on a lot dearer than shell. Am I being undercharged or is my son being overcharged? Am I missing something? Please help.

hi graham your rates are the cap on the variable. 

about your sons rate it's already been explained after your earlier post

eon are putting the 'full' price on the bill then adding a separate line giving a 17p discount for electric and 4p discount for gas (which brings it to the cap rate). 

50 minus 17 is 33 
14 minus 4 is 10 

so your son is paying exactly the same rates as you

Grahmb65

ok I've got it thank you. I might have posted my question a bit hastily before checking the figures. I now completely understand both bills and the calculations. Maybe it would be simpler if all energy companies used the same format on bills.

ariarnia

Grahmb65 said:

ok I've got it thank you. I might have posted my question a bit hastily before checking the figures. I now completely understand both bills and the calculations. Maybe it would be simpler if all energy companies used the same format on bills.

yes it can be confusing. i think if it was a longer term thing they would but all the companies had differnt systems before this was introduced with not much notice so there just fitting it in where there system lets them.

vanveen37

There is something odd in the calculations  for energy price guarantees.

My latest standard variable Sainsburys energy bill for instance. Let us take gas on it:

22nd Nov. 2022 8522.0  Data collector reading 22nd Dec. 2022 8542.0

Consumption 20.0 Units (m3 )

Energy Used* 222.1 kWh @ 13.966p/kWh £31.02

Energy Price Guarantee 222.1 kWh @ 4.22p/kWh -£9.37

Standing Charge 30 days @ 27.128p/day £8.14

Subtotal of charges before VAT £29.79 VAT @ 5% £1.49 Total Gas Charges £31.28

My arithmetic  makes it:

Energy Guarantee 4.22p KWh of Gas so 222.1 kWh is 4.22p X 222.1 =£9.38

Standing Charge 30 days at 27.128p a day = £8.14  + £9.38  = £17.52 + 5% VAT which is £0.88

Grand total £18.40

For my kWh usage I was charged  £31.02- £9.37 (guarantee) = £21.65 which makes the actual cost per KWh 9.8p which is considerably more than 4.22p.

Smoke and mirrors  here I feel!

jbuchanangb

Sainsburys are run by E.ON and you have misunderstood the billing.

First line is 222.1 kWh @ 13.966 which is the full price chargeable without the EPG reduction.

Next line is 222.1 kWh @ minus 4.22 which is the EPG reduction.

So you are being charged (before VAT) 13.966-4.22 p/kWh which is 9.746p/kWh. This is 10.233p/kWh including VAT. Spot on the EPG tariff.