Desperate to fix / delays / dilemma!

thriftypatos

We are moving house and need to secure a 5 year fix on new debt around £475k (majority of our debt is fixed til 2027 at 1.23%, phew).

Went to broker today, rates available to him are higher than online deals! E.g. Natwest 5y fix @ 4.24% vs 3.8% online. Crazy. He told me to go home and apply for the online deal asap, which I did, but the earliest available application appointment with Natwest is 12 October.... by which time I am sure rates will have jumped significantly.

Dilemma - do we:

1. Secure the broker's rate of 4.24% on Monday morning; or
2. Gamble and hold out until mid-October in the hope that 3.8% is still available?

The difference between the rates would equate to about £10k over 5 years, which we could afford (but bitterly).

Any advice appreciated. Panic and fear everywhere.

Thanks

K_S

@thriftypatos I've no idea how NatWest direct works but is there no way to at least reserve/secure the rate online, even if the appointment is only later?

Could the broker put in the application for the intermediary product (with how slow NatWest is currently, it's not likely to offer before 12th) as a backup?

thriftypatos said:

We are moving house and need to secure a 5 year fix on new debt around £475k (majority of our debt is fixed til 2027 at 1.23%, phew).

Went to broker today, rates available to him are higher than online deals! E.g. Natwest 5y fix @ 4.24% vs 3.8% online. Crazy. He told me to go home and apply for the online deal asap, which I did, but the earliest available application appointment with Natwest is 12 October.... by which time I am sure rates will have jumped significantly.

Dilemma - do we:

1. Secure the broker's rate of 4.24% on Monday morning; or
2. Gamble and hold out until mid-October in the hope that 3.8% is still available?

The difference between the rates would equate to about £10k over 5 years, which we could afford (but bitterly).

Any advice appreciated. Panic and fear everywhere.

Thanks

thriftypatos

Thanks, yes these were my immediate thoughts too.

They won't let you lock in a rate until you've gone through the formal application - which incidentally is TWO telephone meetings, one for 30 mins and the second for 90 mins. So realistically we are looking at late October to secure whatever online rate may still be available - it's a big gamble, particularly as we're tied to Natwest because we're porting two sub-tranches of existing mortgage debt with us.

And yes, good idea about applying via the broker as a back-up. When I asked the Natwest guy on the phone if this was an option, he literally couldn't get his head around it. Just kept asking if I wanted to keep the appointment he was making. So extremely infuriating. In the end he did understand what I ask trying to achieve and just said "well if you do that, your appointment will get automatically cancelled because the Natwest advisor will assume you have already applied". To which I responded "please can you put a note on the system asking them NOT to cancel the appointment and to call me anyway?", and he said there was no way of doing that. It's just a joke really, a proper case of computer says no. It's not like I'm looking to go to another bank. I just don't want to make a £10k 50/50 gamble on the spot. 

In the end, I think I am going to secure the higher rate with the broker on Monday morning, as galling as it is. If the Natwest advisor does still call later in the month and the rate available is still lower than the broker's rate, we'll cancel the broker deal and go with the direct deal. However the broker wants a compensation fee of £500 if we pull out of his.... can't win either way!

K_S

@thriftypatos That is a shockingly inept process, 2 appointments to secure a rate?!

I feel like I'm betraying a peer but from a moneysaving point of view, you could use a free broker to get the application in.

The MSE guide here can help you find one
https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/mortgages/best-mortgages-cashback/#step3

thriftypatos said:

Thanks, yes these were my immediate thoughts too.

They won't let you lock in a rate until you've gone through the formal application - which incidentally is TWO telephone meetings, one for 30 mins and the second for 90 mins. So realistically we are looking at late October to secure whatever online rate may still be available - it's a big gamble, particularly as we're tied to Natwest because we're porting two sub-tranches of existing mortgage debt with us.

And yes, good idea about applying via the broker as a back-up. When I asked the Natwest guy on the phone if this was an option, he literally couldn't get his head around it. Just kept asking if I wanted to keep the appointment he was making. So extremely infuriating. In the end he did understand what I ask trying to achieve and just said "well if you do that, your appointment will get automatically cancelled because the Natwest advisor will assume you have already applied". To which I responded "please can you put a note on the system asking them NOT to cancel the appointment and to call me anyway?", and he said there was no way of doing that. It's just a joke really, a proper case of computer says no. It's not like I'm looking to go to another bank. I just don't want to make a £10k 50/50 gamble on the spot. 

In the end, I think I am going to secure the higher rate with the broker on Monday morning, as galling as it is. If the Natwest advisor does still call later in the month and the rate available is still lower than the broker's rate, we'll cancel the broker deal and go with the direct deal. However the broker wants a compensation fee of £500 if we pull out of his.... can't win either way!

ElwoodBlues

That's odd because I spoke to my broker this afternoon as well, and he confirmed the same rates Natwest were offering me directly. That was for a remortgage though, so might make the difference. I'm sure Natwest are about to pull the pin on increasing their rates - they're the cheapest mainstream lender by .75% at the moment. Why wouldn't they increase them now, even if they don't need to?

Also, are you sure they said 12th October, because the earliest appointment they offered me was 12th November (again that was for a product transfer of an existing mortage, maybe they give new customers priority appointments)?

[Deleted User]

Agree with K_S that the process is shockingly inept. I was delighted to have secured a meeting with Barclays for Monday 26th Sept, only to find out it was a preliminary appointment and I would have to wait until 5th October for the actual application process. To see the rate you want to secure and know it is likely to go up substantially by the time you have an appointment seems especially cruel.

For the mortgage I was interested in, rates have increased from 4.24% to 5.65% in the last couple of days, if I am correct. Fortunately, I took the advice of someone on the forum and had an appointment with an excellent mortgage advisor who submitted an application to another lender yesterday. In your situation, I would secure a rate as soon as possible, as 12 days is a long time in current circumstances, and a month seems like a lifetime. The likelihood of one lender maintaining low rates when others are increasing theirs rapidly seems small. I completely understand your frustration.

thriftypatos

Thanks all.

@ElwoodBlues yes, have definitely been offered 12 October but I fear even that will be too late. We are an existing customer and already have 2 sub-accounts with them, so definitely no new customer perks there.

Got an appointment with the broker on Monday at 11am. Now I am crossing my fingers that we can still get the higher rate he was offering (i.e. Natwest won't change their rates by Monday morning)! - Can that happen? I thought rates are only updated at COB of each day.

To make matters worse, our buyers have just lowered their offer by £50k because they themselves are now screwed on rates. Unless we can negotiate them back up then this is all moot anyway and our move is off. 

I feel like in 20 years time, my situation will be a textbook case study on how the bubble burst and Kwarteng f****d it all up for everyone...

thriftypatos

Did Natwest change their rates at COB yesterday? Website still shows their previous rates but comparison sites all showing much higher rates. 

K_S

thriftypatos said:

Did Natwest change their rates at COB yesterday? Website still shows their previous rates but comparison sites all showing much higher rates. 

@thriftypatos If you're referring to intermediary rates, you can see the latest updates here. I don't see any very recent changes and haven't got any notification from NatWest either.
https://www.intermediary.natwest.com/intermediary-solutions/products.html

thriftypatos

K_S said:

thriftypatos said:

Did Natwest change their rates at COB yesterday? Website still shows their previous rates but comparison sites all showing much higher rates. 

@thriftypatos If you're referring to intermediary rates, you can see the latest updates here. I don't see any very recent changes and haven't got any notification from NatWest either.
https://www.intermediary.natwest.com/intermediary-solutions/products.html

Thanks so much. Got an appointment to apply at 11am Monday. What are the chances these will change before then?!

Fed

I spoke to a broker on Thursday, I asked if they knew when they changed rates and they indicated Natwest previously notified them at 4pm for a 5pm change if that helps.  I was a remortgaging and went with the deal Natwest had offered us @ 3.69 that afternoon as it was better than the broker could do.  Just checking price comparison website it looks like Natwest rates have gone up since I checked on Thurs if i'm not mistaken