Bad employer would you suck it up or look another job?

n1guy

Maybe I am just too fussy as an employee. I've had about 7 jobs in my life.  6 of them have been like the following, constantly hounded, when I say hounded I mean watched on Teamviewer, watched on camera, spend too long in toilet get called to office, that kind of hounding, but wages were decent, holidays etc all above board but there is just a constant pressure on you.

My current employer, want to stand all day and look around you fine, fancy a coffee and a chat fine, he is the polar opposite, but there is a fly in the ointment, he only pays minimum wage with zero chance of a payrise.  Holidays last year, for example, I had 5 days left I couldn't take, I was given the option, pay for them or carry them over but I couldn't take them, Illegal yes but my coworkers like this, bit of extra money for Christmas, this year is going a similar route, there little things that just tells me this is a bad employer, We're not an essential business, we a small manufacturing company, worked through Covid, working on Monday even though we've all plenty of holidays left (I literally don't know anyone else working Monday?), One thing I'll always remember, few years back Storm Orphelia, the worst storm to hit Ireland in 50 years, schools all shut, no public transport, 99% of businesses closed, we weren't, had to work the full day and I had to walk home in a storm as no public transport.

Is it possible to actually find a balance between these two scenarios?  I go from one extreme to the next.  The only brightside is he's selling up and I will be made redundant if someone actually buys the premises which doesn't look likely at the moment.

Dakta

How about sucking it up whilst looking for another job?

Always best to have some money coming in but good to be looking. Also thought about jumping industry? The way people work and are managed can be very different.

I.e a few years ago I worked in a steel factory - mandated lunchtimes, and breaktimes, fingerprint recognition, no personal electronics, minimum wage and no hope of much more. It wasn't actually a horrid job but it was very inflexible. Ended up in IT and the transition was something, get a coffee when you want, go for a smoke, No expectation to use AL for health appointments, lunch at the pub (pre COVID anyway) once a week and the whole atmosphere was more we trust you to do your job were not gunna track or try and stand over your shoulders.

 That said I do think you can go too far this way, and you lose accountability etc. Work should be enjoyable but it should always retain a feel of work and WFH is going to harm that so as good as it can be there's going to be a lot of blurred lines infused mh issues in the future imo. 

This of course can ge ruined by bad individual managers or toxic teams but I still can't get over the difference so I'd still say try moving into a completely new field  

MovingForwards

If you don't like it, find another job or expand skills to enable moving into a better company. We all spend too much time at work not to be happy.

Not many people work well being micromanaged and constantly watched, but that's a management issue and won't change if it's happening to all employees.

In part, work is about tolerance levels and whether the wages are enough to balance it.

A statement popped up once along the lines of "by handing in your notice, you're effectively divorcing your boss as not many people leave due to the actual work". Which for me was true when I looked back at why I had moved on from most of my previous roles.

n1guy

Yeah that’s true, the work itself has always been fine, always been the boss.  Yeah all about tolerance is true, I think that’s why I’ve stays so long in this current job after being micromanaged constantly this was a breath of fresh air, I think now it’s just the leave situation annoying me and just the general attitude that work comes before anything else holidays included. 

n1guy

Dakta said:

How about sucking it up whilst looking for another job?

Always best to have some money coming in but good to be looking. Also thought about jumping industry? The way people work and are managed can be very different.

I.e a few years ago I worked in a steel factory - mandated lunchtimes, and breaktimes, fingerprint recognition, no personal electronics, minimum wage and no hope of much more. It wasn't actually a horrid job but it was very inflexible. Ended up in IT and the transition was something, get a coffee when you want, go for a smoke, No expectation to use AL for health appointments, lunch at the pub (pre COVID anyway) once a week and the whole atmosphere was more we trust you to do your job were not gunna track or try and stand over your shoulders.

 That said I do think you can go too far this way, and you lose accountability etc. Work should be enjoyable but it should always retain a feel of work and WFH is going to harm that so as good as it can be there's going to be a lot of blurred lines infused mh issues in the future imo. 

This of course can ge ruined by bad individual managers or toxic teams but I still can't get over the difference so I'd still say try moving into a completely new field  

Yeah what you described is what has kept me at my current job, you are trusted to get the work done, it’s a totally different system than previously, in previous jobs staff turn over was high, it felt like every week someone was leaving and someone new starting, no one could stick it, in contrast to my current job, I’m the last employee to start and that’s going on 10 years, it really is a shock to the system,  I almost had it all but the holiday thing or lack of has always ate away at me. I’m gonna be made redundant anyway I guess, don’t want to miss out my redundancy either 

74jax

n1guy said:

Maybe I am just too fussy as an employee. I've had about 7 jobs in my life.  6 of them have been like the following, constantly hounded, when I say hounded I mean watched on Teamviewer, watched on camera, spend too long in toilet get called to office, that kind of hounding, but wages were decent, holidays etc all above board but there is just a constant pressure on you.
I do think the more pressure the higher the wage, but maybe that's the corporate sector I'm used too

My current employer, want to stand all day and look around you fine, fancy a coffee and a chat fine, he is the polar opposite, but there is a fly in the ointment, he only pays minimum wage with zero chance of a payrise.
Tbf that sounds a nmw job, I wouldn't expect to be paid any higher if you were able to stand around and chat

Holidays last year, for example, I had 5 days left I couldn't take, I was given the option, pay for them or carry them over but I couldn't take them, Illegal yes (what is your entitlement in the year?) but my coworkers like this, bit of extra money for Christmas, this year is going a similar route, there little things that just tells me this is a bad employer, We're not an essential business, we a small manufacturing company, worked through Covid, working on Monday even though we've all plenty of holidays left (I literally don't know anyone else working Monday?), I know more working Monday than not, but might be the people I know (NHS /prison and retail, plus a friend who could use a days holiday to be off but would rather work)
One thing I'll always remember, few years back Storm Orphelia, the worst storm to hit Ireland in 50 years, schools all shut, no public transport, 99% of businesses closed, we weren't, had to work the full day and I had to walk home in a storm as no public transport.

Is it possible to actually find a balance between these two scenarios?  I go from one extreme to the next.  The only brightside is he's selling up and I will be made redundant if someone actually buys the premises which doesn't look likely at the moment.

Contents in bold above.

You can completely find a balance, and you should keep looking. Bring in a wage, keep a look out and move when it's right. If you're waiting for redundancy, do you know how long that will be, can you wait? 

theoretica

Have you calculated how much the statutory redundancy would be?  To take into account against higher paid jobs you see advertised.

I think it is always worth keeping an eye on what is available, and when you are in employment you can afford to be a bit more fussy, ask a few more questions about the work environment and amount of overtime or whatever.  You don't want to miss a great job because you failed to notice it, and it is great to be able to hold out for a job you really want rather than whatever is available at one particular time.

n1guy

theoretica said:

Have you calculated how much the statutory redundancy would be?  To take into account against higher paid jobs you see advertised.

I think it is always worth keeping an eye on what is available, and when you are in employment you can afford to be a bit more fussy, ask a few more questions about the work environment and amount of overtime or whatever.  You don't want to miss a great job because you failed to notice it, and it is great to be able to hold out for a job you really want rather than whatever is available at one particular time.

Yeah very true, does no harm to keep an eye.

n1guy

74jax said:

n1guy said:

Maybe I am just too fussy as an employee. I've had about 7 jobs in my life.  6 of them have been like the following, constantly hounded, when I say hounded I mean watched on Teamviewer, watched on camera, spend too long in toilet get called to office, that kind of hounding, but wages were decent, holidays etc all above board but there is just a constant pressure on you.
I do think the more pressure the higher the wage, but maybe that's the corporate sector I'm used too

My current employer, want to stand all day and look around you fine, fancy a coffee and a chat fine, he is the polar opposite, but there is a fly in the ointment, he only pays minimum wage with zero chance of a payrise.
Tbf that sounds a nmw job, I wouldn't expect to be paid any higher if you were able to stand around and chat

Holidays last year, for example, I had 5 days left I couldn't take, I was given the option, pay for them or carry them over but I couldn't take them, Illegal yes (what is your entitlement in the year?) but my coworkers like this, bit of extra money for Christmas, this year is going a similar route, there little things that just tells me this is a bad employer, We're not an essential business, we a small manufacturing company, worked through Covid, working on Monday even though we've all plenty of holidays left (I literally don't know anyone else working Monday?), I know more working Monday than not, but might be the people I know (NHS /prison and retail, plus a friend who could use a days holiday to be off but would rather work)
One thing I'll always remember, few years back Storm Orphelia, the worst storm to hit Ireland in 50 years, schools all shut, no public transport, 99% of businesses closed, we weren't, had to work the full day and I had to walk home in a storm as no public transport.

Is it possible to actually find a balance between these two scenarios?  I go from one extreme to the next.  The only brightside is he's selling up and I will be made redundant if someone actually buys the premises which doesn't look likely at the moment.

Contents in bold above.

You can completely find a balance, and you should keep looking. Bring in a wage, keep a look out and move when it's right. If you're waiting for redundancy, do you know how long that will be, can you wait? 

I wish a did know, it’s just when someone buys the site, there has been zero interest in the past 6/7 months, I don’t think developers are keen at the moment with the way the economy is and a crash due anytime. 

Dakta

Would it be fair to say then that redundancy isn't an immediate certainty? 

If times on your side definitely worth holding fire and having a look about, might even be time to look in courses  upskilling if you do decide a change or want to jump somewhere else thats new

Brie

I've had the full range of bosses.  Those that are lovely, supportive and those that I still think of as needing to burn in hxxx for all eternity.  I've had idiots too ("no you can't be off sick, it's not convenient, can't you be sick next week instead?") so have had to manage them instead of the other way around.  I take what I can for as long as I can and then I find a way to move on.  Mostly that means leaving for another company but sometimes it's going for a promotion or demotion depending on what was going to get me somewhere else.  

The one thing that sticks with me though is the idea that interviews go better when you're not desperate for the job.  And nothing makes you more desperate than being unemployed.  So always better to look around when you're employed.  And it sounds like you've got good answers to one of the standard questions "why do you want to leave your current role?"  Minimum wage is a very good reason as well as not being allowed to take all your hols.