Which boiler system is best?

BUFF

Obviously, it is his decision to make & his money & I fully agree that it should be a considered one.
Unless it is absolutely on the point of failure then I think that it would be worth waiting for the new Chancellor's mini-budget next week (23rd) to make any decisions but it is at least worth starting down the road of gathering info/quotes/lead times.

Natural Gas is going to be with us in at least some form (even if mixed with hydrogen) until 2035 & probably considerably after that.

My condensing boiler is 14 years old & has been faultless (actually more reliable than the balanced flue, non-condensing boiler that preceded it).

At current rates he could quite possibly be looking at break even in 5 years - if rates climb again then that comes down even further (& I would not put money on rates coming down from ~10p/kWh for many years).
I said "may well pay" because we don't know what boiler he has & therefore potential efficiency, what controls nor the annual consumption - all of which are important in working out how much potentially could be saved & therefore how long for break even. If he is only using 5kWh/year then obviously the result is a lot different  than if he is using 30,000kWh/year.

The government is spending a fortune on the Energy Price Guarantee, they aren't going to have spare cash for energy saving schemes (even though you & I may think they would be a better use of those funds).

 

Rodders53

housebuyer143 said:

Turns out my father in law who is an ex gas engineer is going to come up for a few days and take the tank apart and check it as he is convinced these tanks should last longer than this one has and thinks the leak could be a washer or something loose inside. Fingers crossed as that will save us so much money!

Where is this tank leaking?

Megaflos sometimes have an air bubble above a floating baffle plate in the tank that needs regular attention / refill with air to allow for HW expansion when heated up.  Others use a white (potable water) pressure vessel that has a bladder in;  that also needs regular attention and pumping up to a set pressure.
Either being mis-set or faulty could cause a "leak" into the tundish via the HW tank pressure relief valve.

My Oso HW tank developed a real leak from the Multibloc Water Inlet Control Set that needed replacing.  That was spotted via a water stain in the ceiling of the room below it!

On our last home I'd heard of two HW tanks that leaked and needed replacing by neighbours.  Ours was fine (apart from needing a new pressure vessel) in the 10 years we lived there from new.

housebuyer143

Rodders53 said:

housebuyer143 said:

Turns out my father in law who is an ex gas engineer is going to come up for a few days and take the tank apart and check it as he is convinced these tanks should last longer than this one has and thinks the leak could be a washer or something loose inside. Fingers crossed as that will save us so much money!

Where is this tank leaking?

Megaflos sometimes have an air bubble above a floating baffle plate in the tank that needs regular attention / refill with air to allow for HW expansion when heated up.  Others use a white (potable water) pressure vessel that has a bladder in;  that also needs regular attention and pumping up to a set pressure.
Either being mis-set or faulty could cause a "leak" into the tundish via the HW tank pressure relief valve.

My Oso HW tank developed a real leak from the Multibloc Water Inlet Control Set that needed replacing.  That was spotted via a water stain in the ceiling of the room below it!

On our last home I'd heard of two HW tanks that leaked and needed replacing by neighbours.  Ours was fine (apart from needing a new pressure vessel) in the 10 years we lived there from new.

Thank you. It's leaking from the seams of the outside casing, but as he explained to me, that's a casing - it can't leak from there but it could be releasing the water that is leaking from somewhere else. 

Judging by the amount of stains on the ceiling in this house and lack of maintenance in general, it's safe to say they have done no checking of the tank or refilling of air to it. I can see it's leaked before due to staining on the floor and staining on the ceiling and calcium build up on the outer side of the casing. 

These are some photos. 

housebuyer143

Photos attached

Bendy_House

That whole setup doesn't look at all old, and that model - afaIk - was discontinued only 2 years ago.

Almost certainly the leak will be a simple issue to resolve, most likely a leaking fitting seeping down the insulation layer.

I would certainly have that checked over and fully serviced by a good G3, but I think you'd have to be unlucky if it actually needs replacing.

If your heat-only boiler is really kaput, then it should only cost around £1.5-£2k to replace, assuming no complications like awkward flues, etc.

What make and model is it? Again, chances are it can be kept going for a few more years - they are pretty basic devices.

Clive_Woody

We’ve got an unvented water tank and had solar panels fitted start of the summer. We’ve barely used more than a couple of units of gas since (only used gas when my dear daughter emptied the tank with one of her “epic” showers and someone else wanted a shower urgently). As output decreases through the darker months we will be using some gas to heat the water, but very glad we’ve got a tank to use “spare electricity” as the feed in tariff is rubbish. We also have a battery, and we haven’t been quite off grid over the summer, but our bills have been trivial - 4 bedroom house, me WFH and wife at home all day, kids with far too many electrical gadgets….

As other said, I would get someone in to see if the tank can be sorted and the boiler kept ticking over. Might cost a couple of hundred, but a lot cheaper than a total refit, if not needed.

housebuyer143

Bendy_House said:

That whole setup doesn't look at all old, and that model - afaIk - was discontinued only 2 years ago.

Almost certainly the leak will be a simple issue to resolve, most likely a leaking fitting seeping down the insulation layer.

I would certainly have that checked over and fully serviced by a good G3, but I think you'd have to be unlucky if it actually needs replacing.

If your heat-only boiler is really kaput, then it should only cost around £1.5-£2k to replace, assuming no complications like awkward flues, etc.

What make and model is it? Again, chances are it can be kept going for a few more years - they are pretty basic devices.

Thank you. It's 19 years old the tank as far as I know and they come with a 25yr guarantee so it seems strange if it was corroded or anything. I have an engineer coming on Tuesday, so I'll ask if he thinks he can diagnose the leak and if not just keep the towels down until my father in law turns up 👍

This is the boiler, again 19 years old. Apart from the occasional fault code it seems okay, I am just concerned it will go down in the winter. I am sure it was an F4 fault it was showing.

BUFF

SAP rating of 76.8 % efficient when new, probably a bit less now.
What sort of controls do you have? Programmer, room 'stat, TRVs?

Bendy_House

Clive_Woody said:

We’ve got an unvented water tank and had solar panels fitted start of the summer. We’ve barely used more than a couple of units of gas since (only used gas when my dear daughter emptied the tank with one of her “epic” showers and someone else wanted a shower urgently). As output decreases through the darker months we will be using some gas to heat the water, but very glad we’ve got a tank to use “spare electricity” as the feed in tariff is rubbish. We also have a battery, and we haven’t been quite off grid over the summer, but our bills have been trivial - 4 bedroom house, me WFH and wife at home all day, kids with far too many electrical gadgets….

As other said, I would get someone in to see if the tank can be sorted and the boiler kept ticking over. Might cost a couple of hundred, but a lot cheaper than a total refit, if not needed.

That's really interesting, Clive - I've been hoping to hear about a real-world setup where surplus PV is used to top up a tank. Which control unit are you using to send the surplus to the immersion?

Bendy_House

housebuyer143 said:

Bendy_House said:

That whole setup doesn't look at all old, and that model - afaIk - was discontinued only 2 years ago.

Almost certainly the leak will be a simple issue to resolve, most likely a leaking fitting seeping down the insulation layer.

I would certainly have that checked over and fully serviced by a good G3, but I think you'd have to be unlucky if it actually needs replacing.

If your heat-only boiler is really kaput, then it should only cost around £1.5-£2k to replace, assuming no complications like awkward flues, etc.

What make and model is it? Again, chances are it can be kept going for a few more years - they are pretty basic devices.

Thank you. It's 19 years old the tank as far as I know and they come with a 25yr guarantee so it seems strange if it was corroded or anything. I have an engineer coming on Tuesday, so I'll ask if he thinks he can diagnose the leak and if not just keep the towels down until my father in law turns up 👍

This is the boiler, again 19 years old. Apart from the occasional fault code it seems okay, I am just concerned it will go down in the winter. I am sure it was an F4 fault it was showing.

It's extremely unlikely that the tank itself is leaking.

And that GlowWorm - although not the more efficient condensing type - has very little serious stuff to go wrong with it. As said before, F4 is an 'ignition' fault, but that could range from very cheap ignition electrodes (£25-ish new), to a gas valve (£30 refurb) or fan (£30 refurb). And in between are PCBs (only ~£35 for a repaired item) and stuff! Ie, these are all available, and very affordable. You just need a half-competent GasSafe to diagnose the actual fault, and be willing to fit a refurbished part.

And refurbished parts should last many years - I've replaced PCBs and fans, and the quality of the refurb was superb. All from very well established companies on eBay.