Smart meter gone dumb due to fault in comms infrastructure

[Deleted User]

brewerdave said:

Dolor said:

ScottishBob said:

Thanks folks, I've just submitted a complaint to Shell Energy which I will let go to deadlock and take to OFGEM if they don't actually fix it.

I would be surprised if Shell accepts your complaint. It is only responsible for the meter assets not the smart meter infrastructure or the communications hub. Provided the supplier has provided you with meters that are certified and can be used for billing then the supplier has met its Standard Licence Conditions.

Personally I don't believe that Shell can refuse to accept the complaint. As far as the customer is concerned (without your in depth knowledge of the way the system works) their ONLY direct line of approach is via the supplier. Shell can try to answer the complaint by blaming others for the failure - but the customer can refuse to accept their explanation and elevate to the O.E as far as I can see. Whether that will achieve anything is debatable but .......
Aren't "smart" meters wonderful !!!

There is, for example, a known problem with some WNC1 communications hub that only WNC can fix with a firmware update. Last year, it took Kaifa 7 months to fix an issue with smart meter 30 minute usage data. Suppliers can only apply ‘pressure’ on the DCC, and meter and device manufacturers. 

Being Devil’s Advocate for a moment, it seems unfair that any supplier should be on the hook for a £500 Energy Ombudsman complaint referral fee that neither the supplier nor the Energy Ombudsman can actually fix.

brewerdave

Dolor said:

brewerdave said:

Dolor said:

ScottishBob said:

Thanks folks, I've just submitted a complaint to Shell Energy which I will let go to deadlock and take to OFGEM if they don't actually fix it.

I would be surprised if Shell accepts your complaint. It is only responsible for the meter assets not the smart meter infrastructure or the communications hub. Provided the supplier has provided you with meters that are certified and can be used for billing then the supplier has met its Standard Licence Conditions.

Personally I don't believe that Shell can refuse to accept the complaint. As far as the customer is concerned (without your in depth knowledge of the way the system works) their ONLY direct line of approach is via the supplier. Shell can try to answer the complaint by blaming others for the failure - but the customer can refuse to accept their explanation and elevate to the O.E as far as I can see. Whether that will achieve anything is debatable but .......
Aren't "smart" meters wonderful !!!

Being Devil’s Advocate for a moment, it seems unfair that any supplier should be on the hook for a £500 Energy Ombudsman complaint referral fee that neither the supplier nor the Energy Ombudsman can actually fix.

But shouldn't the O.E have the power to put pressure on the Company responsible for the failure ?  Seems to me that no-one is prepared to hold the intermediary Companies' feet to the fire as it were. They appear to be free to take as long as they like to problem solve or even walk away from the problem and allow the "system" to default to manual reads or estimations !

[Deleted User]

brewerdave said:

Dolor said:

brewerdave said:

Dolor said:

ScottishBob said:

Thanks folks, I've just submitted a complaint to Shell Energy which I will let go to deadlock and take to OFGEM if they don't actually fix it.

I would be surprised if Shell accepts your complaint. It is only responsible for the meter assets not the smart meter infrastructure or the communications hub. Provided the supplier has provided you with meters that are certified and can be used for billing then the supplier has met its Standard Licence Conditions.

Personally I don't believe that Shell can refuse to accept the complaint. As far as the customer is concerned (without your in depth knowledge of the way the system works) their ONLY direct line of approach is via the supplier. Shell can try to answer the complaint by blaming others for the failure - but the customer can refuse to accept their explanation and elevate to the O.E as far as I can see. Whether that will achieve anything is debatable but .......
Aren't "smart" meters wonderful !!!

Being Devil’s Advocate for a moment, it seems unfair that any supplier should be on the hook for a £500 Energy Ombudsman complaint referral fee that neither the supplier nor the Energy Ombudsman can actually fix.

But shouldn't the O.E have the power to put pressure on the Company responsible for the failure ?  Seems to me that no-one is prepared to hold the intermediary Companies' feet to the fire as it were. They appear to be free to take as long as they like to problem solve or even walk away from the problem and allow the "system" to default to manual reads or estimations !

Which Company? The DCC is responsible for the network. Individual comms hubs; smart meter and device manufacturers are responsible for their own meters and devices. Then there are the 2 communications providers. Some meter manufacturers have many SMETS1 and SMETS2 meter models on the network. For example, the L&G E470 SMETS2 meter comes in at least two sizes.

Sadly, we have added un-necessary complexity to our smart meter system. The French have a single smart meter design built by selected manufacturers ( the Nespresso solution) and it uses existing powerline technology to transmit data. From what I read, the French do not appear to having the issues that we are having. 

I would assume from my knowledge of contracts, that they will be penalty clauses. How these are invoked and who pays what and to whom, I haven’t a clue.

Finally, I suspect that one of the unintended consequences of Ofgem ‘fining’ suppliers for not meeting their rollout targets, is that supplier smart teams are focussed on deployment not fault fixing. The CTO of one of our bigger suppliers posted earlier this year that our smart meter system is a long way off maturity.

wwally

Interesting thread. My experience somewhat similar.

SMETS2 meter fitted July, worked fine until 27th September when it stopped reporting readings.  Endless queries and now an official complaint to get some attention. Today I have been informed that the meter/comms hub needs to be 'rebooted' by an engineer, who can attend in mid January 2023. All the comms lights are operating as they should.

Q1. Is a 'manual reboot' involving an electrician physically disconnecting the device really a thing for Smart Meters/Comms Hubs?  Are these devices fit for purpose?

Q2. Is my supplier or the DCC actually measured on responsiveness fixing SM faults? I can see no public metrics. This starts to matter when I can be charged / refunded depending upon my half-hourly usage. It will be 15 weeks from the fault (which could have been auto detected) before the electrician is due to arrive to 'reboot' it.

This is all very frustrating and I am collating a report to the Energy Ombudsman when this is all resolved. The whole industrial structure is crap.

[Deleted User]

wwally said:

Interesting thread. My experience somewhat similar.

SMETS2 meter fitted July, worked fine until 27th September when it stopped reporting readings.  Endless queries and now an official complaint to get some attention. Today I have been informed that the meter/comms hub needs to be 'rebooted' by an engineer, who can attend in mid January 2023. All the comms lights are operating as they should.

Q1. Is a 'manual reboot' involving an electrician physically disconnecting the device really a thing for Smart Meters/Comms Hubs?  Are these devices fit for purpose?

 Q2. Is my supplier or the DCC actually measured on responsiveness fixing SM faults? I can see no public metrics. This starts to matter when I can be charged / refunded depending upon my half-hourly usage. It will be 15 weeks from the fault (which could have been auto detected) before the electrician is due to arrive to 'reboot' it.

This is all very frustrating and I am collating a report to the Energy Ombudsman when this is all resolved. The whole industrial structure is crap.

Suppliers can make a request to the DCC for a remote comms hub reset which turns the comms hub off for 15 minutes. If an engineer visit is needed, the main fuse to your house will be pulled. Clearly, the possibility of having to reset comms hubs was envisaged - hence the ability to send out a remote reset command to the hub.

Your smart meter retains 30 minute usage data for 13 months. All data will be retrieved when your comms hub is working again.  Last year, my Kaifa meter - along with many others- stopping sending 30 minute usage data for 7 months after a firmware update: all data was eventually retrieved after another 3 meter firmware updates.

The DCC is a non customer-facing organisation and it is not subject to Energy Ombudsman oversight. Suppliers are responsible for your meter assets and for the IHD, and the DCC is solely responsible for all the secure communications hubs. Meter manufacturers are responsible for certifying their devices on the DCC network, and for certifying all meter firmware updates. It follows that I am not sure that suppliers can be held to account for issues that they have no control over.

If you want to make a fuss, I suggest that you email the Senior Responsible Officer for UK Smart Metering who sits within BEIS. His email details are available on the web. I am sure, by now, he must have a very large folder of complaints/concerns.

FWiW, we are where we are by virtue of Government decision making. Life would have been much simpler if the Government had gone for compulsory smart meters and a single meter design with the work carried out by DNOs not suppliers. Search for the French Linky smart meter system.