Parking Ticket: Ticket Machine out of order

gwernybwch

Hope someone can give me a bit of advice on the first steps, but I have received a parking ticket where the ticket machine when the ticket machine was out of order. I intend to fully fight this and have seen the sticky appeal template, but my main question is whether I just stick to the template or do I add additional information at this stage?

 The background is -

I arrived in the car park at the start of the day and both coin meters were out of order. There is a sign there saying that I can pay by app or call a number, I didn't have my phone on me and had to go to work. There was no Attendant there at the time to seek guidance from or attempt to pay.

I came back at the end of the day and had got a ticket and then took photos of the pay machines still showing out-of-order signs. Studying the main sign in detail it doesn't state not to park there is the payment machine is out-of-order.

The parking attendant must have set my dashcam off and the annoying thing is that it is recording what looks like other parkers telling the Attendant that the machine isn't working and him continuing to issue tickets! What is worse, the boss / land owner is sat in his X5 watching this all going on and doesn't intervene. Grr!

 The ticket was issue by Corporate Services (Hereford) Ltd if that makes any difference.

 Thanks in advance for any replies.

Fruitcake

Plan A is always to complain to the landowner and your MP.

If that fails then send the appeal template unaltered from the keeper. Save everything else for PoPLA.

Corporate Services don't come up on this forum very often, if at all. I certainly don't remember them ever starting a court case.
Get pics of the site and signage to compliment your other photos ready for PoPLA.

KeithP

Do you really want to tell the parking company who was driving?

For example, the first paragraph of your 'background' would probably be better written as...

We arrived in the car park at the start of the day and both coin meters were out of order. There is a sign there saying that the driver can pay by app or call a number. The driver didn't have a phone with them and had to go to work. There was no Attendant there at the time to seek guidance from or attempt to pay.

The parking companies read this forum just waiting for people to trip themselves up.

Why not just send the blue text template appeal easily found in the opening post of the NEWBIES thread.

Send it unchanged, from the keeper.

Snakes_Belly

Did you leave a note on the windscreen?

patient_dream

Do you know if it's actually Corporate Services (Hereford)

The reason is that Corporate Services (Hereford) offer a franchise
https://www.cspmparking.co.uk/franchise/

A franchise must be listed as a BPA member in a T/A name and not bounce off the name Corporate Services (Hereford) 

How do you know that the guy in the X5 is the owner or landowner

gwernybwch

patient_dream said:

Do you know if it's actually Corporate Services (Hereford)

The reason is that Corporate Services (Hereford) offer a franchise
https://www.cspmparking.co.uk/franchise/

A franchise must be listed as a BPA member in a T/A name and not bounce off the name Corporate Services (Hereford) 

How do you know that the guy in the X5 is the owner or landowner

Thanks for the replies. I will send the template letter from the keeper and see what that gets me.


The ticket was issued by Corporate Services (Parking Management). The website is one that you have already quoted :-)

I'm not sure what exactly he is, but I am pretty sure that he is associated with the operation of the car park in some way. Although he isn't the one issuing the tickets. The X5 is parked in the park first thing in the morning (usually in a position which gives a 360 degree view of the park), sometimes he is sat in there, other times not. It never has a parking ticket in the window. It seems that that the vehicle comes and goes multiple times a time. I've seen him in the X5 is such a way which makes me think that he isn't just waiting to pick someone up.

Johnersh

Playing devil's advocate, because it pays to prepare:

What's your answer to any suggestion by  the ppc that you could've phoned pay by phone when you got to work? 

gwernybwch

Just as an update on this, I submitted a POPLA appeal which was successful.

I used the MSE forum template which declined to name the driver of the vehicle.

The appeal outcome contained:

"In this case, the appellant has stated that they are the keeper of the vehicle and believes that the PCN amount is excessive, disproportionate and not a genuine pre-estimate of loss. I am satisfied this is a reference paragraph 19.4 of the BPA code as follows: “If you intend to use the keeper liability provisions in Schedule 4 of POFA 2012, your signs must give ’adequate notice’......This includes:…bringing the charges to the attention of drivers, and following any applicable government signage regulations”. No driver has been identified in this case and the operator is seeking to hold the registered keeper as liable for this PCN. I reviewed the signs in this case and must note the reference stating: ‘’Parking contraventions will be dealt with by the issue of a parking charge notice of £100.00’’ is written in a much smaller font than the conditions and tariffs that precede it....... I am going to consider the charge amount in the appellant’s case, as well as the signage. On this, I conclude the charge is not sufficiently brought to the attention of motorists on the signs and therefore it does not meet the expectations of ParkingEye v Beavis.

Thanks all for the advice and support.

Coupon-mad

Very good outcome!  Can you show us this sign so we know how bad it is?

gwernybwch

This is the sign that was on site -

Umkomaas

What an awful sign, with such tiny font and purporting to form a contract, especially with just 5 minutes to read, understand and decide whether to accept (or reject: and leave). Designed for the motorist to fail. 

I've commented on your post in the POPLA Decisions sticky, but for completeness, I've reproduced below:

Well done @gwernybwch and well done POPLA Assessor Rachel Hankinson who seems to have a better understanding of PoFA and Beavis than most of the others.