Why aid the focus on citizens turning things off?

[Deleted User]

Surely, there is a fortune to be reallocated by turning off some of the street lights (and all those lights that shine all night in council and government offices and other public buildings). People might say there will be more accidents (and burglaries?) but when people are about to freeze to death and the economy is about to collapse, maybe it’s time to take a little risk elsewhere. People just need to take a little more care than usual.

ariarnia

why one or the other?

lots of places (including around here) have been reducing lights on public buildings and monuments and in some street areas turning off lights for part of the night (around here they go off at 1am I think?) and our local council was recently saying they might not do or cut back on christmas lights and the santa parade. 

so as councils are already doing that then the message has to be to citizens to do the same and look at where they can cut back and down. 

Section62

Most councils have already reduced the hours of operation of their street lights, converted to LED, and are now moving to dimming LED luminaires.

The amount of energy consumed by street lighting is not going to make that much difference to whether people are going to "freeze to death and the economy is about to collapse".

And if you know of a council building with "lights that shine all night", maybe you could write to that council and ask them why?

MattMattMattUK

Deleted_User said:

Surely, there is a fortune to be reallocated by turning off some of the street lights (and all those lights that shine all night in council and government offices and other public buildings). 

There would be some savings in electricity but probably not as much as you think as most of the efficiency savings in offices and public buildings have already been made. They are also different budgets, the council leaving a few external LED lights on is going to save a few pounds a month at most.

Deleted_User said:

People might say there will be more accidents (and burglaries?) but when people are about to freeze to death and the economy is about to collapse, maybe it’s time to take a little risk elsewhere. People just need to take a little more care than usual.

There likely would be more theft and accidents, the cost would probably exceed any savings by some way, people would also feel less safe in public spaces. People are not "about to freeze to death" and the economy is not going to collapse, you need to cut the hyperbole and be sensible and rational. Most people would rather turn the thermostat down than be burgled, they would rather feel safe walking or driving at night. All things are decided on balance and even with costs as they are the balance will be in favour of street lights.

[Deleted User]

Take a walk around town; there is a lot more to be saved. The NHS are very worried. The government themselves recognise how serious this is about to be. But, as I’m not sensible and rational, that’s me done; doubtless you’ll be better off without my hyperbole on your forum. 1st post and I quit. I’m not engaging with trolls. I think that some people will have very, very bad outcomes this winter and turn to an overstretched public purse to cover it. Good luck with it all.

dunstonh

I live in an area with no street lighting (which is a delight at night when looking up). Most people walk around with torches or lanterns at night.     Both the county council and area councils turn their lights off after midnight until 5.30am except at certain junctions or where there is sheltered accommodation.

MattMattMattUK

Deleted_User said:

Take a walk around town; there is a lot more to be saved. 

There is more to be saved, but a chunk if that is commercial, not councils and as has been said "saved" is relative, if it results in an increase in crime.

Deleted_User said:

The NHS are very worried.

They are rightly worried about costs because they are increasing by huge amounts, turning off a few LED lights is not going to make any appreciable difference though, hospitals use a lot of energy intensive kit. As an example an MRI machine uses around 30kWh an hour, with the associated computer kit and HVAC that increases to around 40kWh, so turning an LED light off for the possible two hours a day a hospital could, would mean that it would take nearly fourteen years to re-coop the cost of running the MRI for an hour. 

Deleted_User said:

The government themselves recognise how serious this is about to be. 

The government do not recognise their behind from their elbow most of the time, the only reason Truss will act is because MPs will force her to do something otherwise they know they will be slaughtered at the next election.

Deleted_User said:

But, as I’m not sensible and rational, that’s me done; doubtless you’ll be better off without my hyperbole on your forum.

Hyperbole never helps, things need to be looked at rationally and sensibly, talk of large groups of people "freezing to death" and "economic collapse" are hyperbole.

Deleted_User said:

I think that some people will have very, very bad outcomes this winter and turn to an overstretched public purse to cover it. Good luck with it all.

Some people have had had a very bad few years, the "public purse" has had an even worse few years, as a nation we cannot afford to bail the public out every time there is an issue, even more so with Truss cutting taxes as her first act of economic self harm. 

Alnat1

I doubt the NHS have that many LEDs to turn off, many buildings I've worked in still have old strip lighting which is often on 24/7. The heating is up full with the windows open because there's no way to control the temperature in individual rooms/corridors. The cost of improving energy efficiency would be billions that the NHS don't have to spare.

TheGardener

Deleted_User said:

...But, as I’m not sensible and rational, that’s me done; doubtless you’ll be better off without my hyperbole on your forum. 1st post and I quit. I’m not engaging with trolls. I think that some people will have very, very bad outcomes this winter and turn to an overstretched public purse to cover it. Good luck with it all.

Your original post reflects the rising sense of panic and helplessness most of us feel and that's normal and ok. But @MattMattMattUK is not a 'troll'. If you'd spent a little more time on the forum you would have seen his/her/their hundreds of posts offering pragmatic and informed advice to help people with the same concerns as you.
 
We are not about to freeze to death - anyone over the age of 50 probably grew up in a house with no CH, no double glazing, no loft insulation, and no modern fabric technology (Goretex/fleece/polyester duvets) let alone USB heated blankets and microwaveable rice bags! And so far as I can make out - winters are not even that cold anymore!  I'm more concerned about people not eating enough than freezing to death. 

Of course there are more savings to be made - it will take all of us, including those that work in the public sector time to adjust to the changes we all have to make, (large organisations like the NHS & Councils have the reflexes of a supertanker)  - none of which are likely to be that comfortable. However, it is not the end of the world, and if you decide not to 'quit' then look through some of the threads for some excellent and practical advice. 

sienew

TheGardener said:

Deleted_User said:

...But, as I’m not sensible and rational, that’s me done; doubtless you’ll be better off without my hyperbole on your forum. 1st post and I quit. I’m not engaging with trolls. I think that some people will have very, very bad outcomes this winter and turn to an overstretched public purse to cover it. Good luck with it all.

Your original post reflects the rising sense of panic and helplessness most of us feel and that's normal and ok. But @MattMattMattUK is not a 'troll'. If you'd spent a little more time on the forum you would have seen his/her/their hundreds of posts offering pragmatic and informed advice to help people with the same concerns as you.
 
We are not about to freeze to death - anyone over the age of 50 probably grew up in a house with no CH, no double glazing, no loft insulation, and no modern fabric technology (Goretex/fleece/polyester duvets) let alone USB heated blankets and microwaveable rice bags! And so far as I can make out - winters are not even that cold anymore!  I'm more concerned about people not eating enough than freezing to death. 

Of course there are more savings to be made - it will take all of us, including those that work in the public sector time to adjust to the changes we all have to make, (large organisations like the NHS & Councils have the reflexes of a supertanker)  - none of which are likely to be that comfortable. However, it is not the end of the world, and if you decide not to 'quit' then look through some of the threads for some excellent and practical advice. 

Nobody should be sitting in the dark or freeing to death. The cost of running LED lights and electric blankets is very cheap and most people should be able to afford this very basic usage just using the govt grants we are all getting.

Of course living under an electric blanket all day (especially for the elderly) isn't fun and I'm sure everyone would much prefer everyone be able to heat to a comfortable temperature... this is still better than freezing to death though.

dunstonh

Take a walk around town; there is a lot more to be saved. The NHS are very worried. The government themselves recognise how serious this is about to be. But, as I’m not sensible and rational, that’s me done; doubtless you’ll be better off without my hyperbole on your forum. 1st post and I quit. I’m not engaging with trolls. I think that some people will have very, very bad outcomes this winter and turn to an overstretched public purse to cover it. Good luck with it all.

@MattMattMattUK is a good contributor who talks sense.  There is nothing in his response that even hints at trolling.      I disagree on the burglary and accident comment as that has not occurred in our area but then in rural areas, people are used to having no lighting.  In built-up areas, people are not used to it and some may not adapt as well as others.

If you feel there is public sector bodies wasting energy, then contact the appropriate public body.   

Some lighting is owned by borough, district, town or parish councils.  Highways England also owns some.  So, you contact the appropriate body and make them aware of your concerns.

You are panicking too much.  Nobody needs to freeze to death.   We may just to have to revert a little to common sense and old techniques that we used to use right upto the early 80s. 

i.e. heat your main rooms to normal temp but reduce your heating in unused rooms.  Wear heavier jumpers and not summer clothes.   Use draught preventions.  Visit your local pub, club, cafe or tea room during the day so you use their heating whilst yours is off and you support your local businesses who will suffer far more than you will.