SSE - Is it possible to have a smart meter installed in so called "dumb mode"?

trust.no.1

Hi Everyone,

SSE are encouraging me to book an installation of a smart meter.

I've read that it is possible to have the meter installed in so called "dumb mode" where most of the "smart" features are disabled and it to all intents and purposes acts like the existing legacy meter it will replace? Opinion seems divided on this with some of the opinion that the only thing you can insist on during installation is that data is collected less frequently than the default 15 minute interval?

Has any one of the group "been there done it"with SSE?

Clarification appreciated.

[Deleted User]

trust.no.1 said:

Hi Everyone,

SSE are encouraging me to book an installation of a smart meter.

I've read that it is possible to have the meter installed in so called "dumb mode" where most of the "smart" features are disabled and it to all intents and purposes acts like the existing legacy meter it will replace? Opinion seems divided on this with some of the opinion that the only thing you can insist on during installation is that data is collected less frequently than the default 15 minute interval?

Has any one of the group "been there done it"with SSE?

Clarification appreciated.

Why do you want the smart functions disabled?

victor2

trust.no.1 said:

Hi Everyone,

SSE are encouraging me to book an installation of a smart meter.

I've read that it is possible to have the meter installed in so called "dumb mode" where most of the "smart" features are disabled and it to all intents and purposes acts like the existing legacy meter it will replace? Opinion seems divided on this with some of the opinion that the only thing you can insist on during installation is that data is collected less frequently than the default 15 minute interval?

Has any one of the group "been there done it"with SSE?

Clarification appreciated.

Why would you not want it in smart mode? You can ask for it to only send data daily when installed, but I'm not sure if you can request it never to send data. If you have a smart meter, you won't have to submit meter readings and won't get estimated bills, which can result in bill "shock" when a real reading is taken.

It's entirely up to you if you use the In House Display (IHD) smart meters come with. Many people end up chucking it in a drawer after the novelty wears off. It looks highly likely that future tariffs from suppliers will be more attractive if they're based on Time of Use, sort of like a glorified E7 tariff, but they will require smart meters.

At least modern smart meters allow you to switch supplier without losing their smartness - if ever the day returns when you can easily switch for a more competitive tariff!

macman

No, it's not. Just another urban myth. But, if you must, just wrap it in tinfoil after installation and it will become a dumb meter.

[Deleted User]

trust.no.1 said:

Hi Everyone,

SSE are encouraging me to book an installation of a smart meter.

I've read that it is possible to have the meter installed in so called "dumb mode" where most of the "smart" features are disabled and it to all intents and purposes acts like the existing legacy meter it will replace? Opinion seems divided on this with some of the opinion that the only thing you can insist on during installation is that data is collected less frequently than the default 15 minute interval?

Has any one of the group "been there done it"with SSE?

Clarification appreciated.

Just to put another myth to bed. No supplier collects data every 15 minutes. The frequency of usage recording is once every 30 minutes. Suppliers pull data from a smart meter once every 24 hours. The meter sends back between 1 to 4 index readings along with 30 minute usage data in an XML file. The meter is NOT in permanent contact with your supplier.

Dumb mode just means that your supplier will not pull meter readings for billing. The comms hub etc need to remain connected to  the DCC Network so that suppliers can send out firmware updates; DNOs can pull voltage data etc.

trust.no.1

macman said:

No, it's not. Just another urban myth. But, if you must, just wrap it in tinfoil after installation and it will become a dumb meter.

Thanks for clarifying - so in short you can only ask for the data collection to be limited to once per day rather than the default15 minutes.

Re the tin foil reference - I expected this at some point and while I'm really tempted - I won't bite  - I'm sure it has been done to death countless times.  I've read some of the research papers out there re the privacy implications (on both sides of the spectrum) and personally I prefer not to have one. But practically I appreciate this is not an option in today's connected world, particularly when my legacy meter eventually gives up the ghost. The digital display is neither here nor there - I have similar functionality with a "thingybob" attached to one of the cables going into my legacy meter.

[Deleted User]

trust.no.1 said:

macman said:

No, it's not. Just another urban myth. But, if you must, just wrap it in tinfoil after installation and it will become a dumb meter.

Thanks for clarifying - so in short you can only ask for the data collection to be limited to once per day rather than the default15 minutes.

Re the tin foil reference - I expected this at some point and while I'm really tempted - I won't bite  - I'm sure it has been done to death countless times.  I've read some of the research papers out there re the privacy implications (on both sides of the spectrum) and personally I prefer not to have one. But practically I appreciate this is not an option in today's connected world, particularly when my legacy meter eventually gives up the ghost. The digital display is neither here nor there - I have similar functionality with a "thingybob" attached to one of the cables going into my legacy meter.

The default profile is 30 minute usage profiling BUT the data is only retrieved by the supplier once per day. There are no privacy implications: even the DCC - the network operator - doesn’t have the right to access your smart meter usage data.

FWiW, if I look around my small estate, I can see that 5 families are away. I have no idea whether they have smart meters. The privacy issue is overstated.

When your analogue meter is deemed end-of-life, the supplier has a legal right to fit a smart meter. Resistance is futile.

sevenhills

trust.no.1 said:
 I've read some of the research papers out there re the privacy implications (on both sides of the spectrum) and personally I prefer not to have one.

It has crossed my mind not to accept cookies when online, but I always accept.
I didn't know there were any privacy issues with smart meters, what are they?
I have had mine since 2017, without any issues.

trust.no.1

sevenhills said:

trust.no.1 said:
 I've read some of the research papers out there re the privacy implications (on both sides of the spectrum) and personally I prefer not to have one.

It has crossed my mind not to accept cookies when online, but I always accept.
I didn't know there were any privacy issues with smart meters, what are they?
I have had mine since 2017, without any issues.

A good paper on the subject can be found at:

 https://skyvisionsolutions.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/utility-smart-meters-invade-privacy-22-aug-2014.pdf

It is around 8 years old but most of the concepts presented are still valid in the present age. The data collection concerns me the most.

One of the more extreme views on the topic can be found at  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zwd5Nc9DhWw

My views are nowhere as extreme as this by the way. The aim of my post was to get some clarity on what options are available as far as opt out of data collection is concerned. 

And yes -  I always opt out of accepting optional and legitimate interest cookies, opt out of location rellated settings on my mobile devices,.block Windoze telemetry on my firewall yada yada yada.  I'm not yet into tin foil but I do carry my mobile around in one of those signal blocking "faraday" bags .

Ryan_Holden

My meters may as well be dumb, they send data every 30 minutes but I never, ever get an automatically generated bill. I always have to go and submit my own reading.