Looking at Solar Panels - Updated-Now installed

Screwdriva

powerful_Rogue said:

I was dead against getting a battery to start with, however the more i've read the more i'm starting to look towards possibly getting one. However i've been advised a 3.3kwh would be pointless and to look at getting something bigger. We're in a forever home, so no plans on ever moving - will have to do some more reasearch. I did email earlier and asked how much a bigger battery would cost, so will wait to see what they come back with.

We don't seem to have any issues with birds, however would you still recommend getting the bird netting? Knowing my luck I don't get it and it will then be an issue after!

I would really suggest modeling the payback with and without a battery, using Octopus Agile rates at .20p, 30p, 40p, 50p increments, to understand if a battery makes financial sense. If you decide to go for a battery, I'd recommend LG or SolarEdge only, paired with the SE inverter. 

If you don't see pigeons around you, you likely won't need the netting. 

Alnat1

If it's your forever home, I wouldn't focus too much about how fast the payback will be. The figures given in quotes by installers rely on a lot of assumptions that are unlikely to happen in reality. While electricity prices remain high, payback will be faster anyway (but installation prices higher too due to demand)

It's good to listen to and take advice from people who have systems with and without a battery and also think of your future needs.  

Personally I'm really glad we decided to go with battery storage, although I wish we'd got a bit more. We went with 4.8kW and now think double that would have been better, enough to cover 24 hours use for us.

Pile_o_stone

QrizB said:

An east-west split array can work well. Lower total output but a better spread through the day.

Your main challenge might be finding an installer with capacity.

+1 with this comment. We have an East/West solar orientation and we start generating as soon as the sun rises in the East, until it sets in the West. We the maximum at noon, when the sun is on both sides of the roof, but not the max 5kw we could generate but to be honest most of that would go into the grid as we couldn't use it.

One thing to remember with East/West orientations is that you can put twice the number of panels on your roof than someone with a 'perfect' south facing roof. No one would put panels on a north facing roof. So instead of a standard 4kw array, you can install 8kw.

A piece of advice I always give to people is to forget the battery that the solar installers often push as it's debatable whether you can get your money back on those, and instead max out the panels on your roof. With the costs of scaffolding and other expenses involved in the installation, you'll only do it once, so do it right and do it to the max! 

If I were buying now, I'd have 16x400w panels on my garage roof and 6x400 panels on my shed roof for a total of 8800kw. If the DNO refuses more than 3600 then I'd get the installer to fit a device that limits export, and I'd enjoy more generation on shady days, the shoulder months and even in Winter.

QrizB

Screwdriva said:

If you don't see pigeons around you, you likely won't need the netting. 

Also, town pigeons (rock doves) are a cliff-dwelling species and like to live in buildings.

Wood pigeons like trees and don't seem to be a problem with solar panels.

2nd_time_buyer

Screwdriva said:

powerful_Rogue said:

I was dead against getting a battery to start with, however the more i've read the more i'm starting to look towards possibly getting one. However i've been advised a 3.3kwh would be pointless and to look at getting something bigger. We're in a forever home, so no plans on ever moving - will have to do some more reasearch. I did email earlier and asked how much a bigger battery would cost, so will wait to see what they come back with.

We don't seem to have any issues with birds, however would you still recommend getting the bird netting? Knowing my luck I don't get it and it will then be an issue after!

I would really suggest modeling the payback with and without a battery, using Octopus Agile rates at .20p, 30p, 40p, 50p increments, to understand if a battery makes financial sense. If you decide to go for a battery, I'd recommend LG or SolarEdge only, paired with the SE inverter. 

If you don't see pigeons around you, you likely won't need the netting. 

I would get the quote for pigeon netting, it could be worth considering for peace of mind. I didn't think we had pigeons near us but we installed the netting anyway. Nevertheless, a couple of "rock doves" found their way in. The cooing all day long drove me bananas. It was very rewarding, looking up with the roofer, after he had sealed the gaps, watching the pigeons walking around the panels looking confused, trying to get under. They have since migrated to perching on a bit of a pipe coming out of next door's wall and are making a right mess on their wheelie bin lid. 

P.S. Tigo optimisers work with any inverter (and battery). You might be put off Soalredge batteries once you get a quote. Also, keep in mind that the Agile export rates are based on the current energy prices, whereas the energy cap is set retrospective on the last 6 months prices (soon to be 3 months). So if there is a fall in spot energy prices, this will be reflected straight away in the Agile rate but there will be a lag in the energy price cap. 

Screwdriva

2nd_time_buyer said:

 It was very rewarding, looking up with the roofer, after he had sealed the gaps, watching the pigeons walking around the panels looking confused, trying to get under. They have since migrated to perching on a bit of a pipe coming out of next door's wall and are making a right mess on their wheelie bin lid. 

I hate those damn birds!

2nd_time_buyer said:

P.S. Tigo optimisers work with any inverter (and battery). You might be put off Soalredge batteries once you get a quote. Also, keep in mind that the Agile export rates are based on the current energy prices, whereas the energy cap is set retrospective on the last 6 months prices (soon to be 3 months). So if there is a fall in spot energy prices, this will be reflected straight away in the Agile rate but there will be a lag in the energy price cap. 

I don't believe the SolarEdge inverter works with Tigo optimizers but I could be wrong. I would like prefer LG Chem batteries over SolarEdge regardless of price but supply issues are a factor for some. 

I'm fully aware of the volatile nature of the Agile tariff. That said, what does your gut tell you on the likelihood of prices falling anytime in the foreseeable?

2nd_time_buyer

Screwdriva said:

I'm fully aware of the volatile nature of the Agile tariff. That said, what does your gut tell you on the likelihood of prices falling anytime in the foreseeable?

My gut says, that something is going to have to change pretty drastically in the next few months. One scenario is that the government freezes (or partially freezes) the cap, which could lead to export price been substantially higher than import prices. Deepening on how that is worked out, it may not be sustainable for Octopus to carry on offering Agile export. So I think there is a possibility that it will be pulled, at least for new customers. In which case, having a battery installed (VAT free) would be a reasonable hedge.

Screwdriva

2nd_time_buyer said:

Screwdriva said:

I'm fully aware of the volatile nature of the Agile tariff. That said, what does your gut tell you on the likelihood of prices falling anytime in the foreseeable?

My gut says, that something is going to have to change pretty drastically in the next few months. One scenario is that the government freezes (or partially freezes) the cap, which could lead to export price been substantially higher than import prices. Deepening on how that is worked out, it may not be sustainable for Octopus to carry on offering Agile export. So I think there is a possibility that it will be pulled, at least for new customers. In which case, having a battery installed (VAT free) would be a reasonable hedge.

That's a pretty extreme roundabout way to justify a battery but sure, I suppose anything is possible. 

2nd_time_buyer

Screwdriva said:

2nd_time_buyer said:

Screwdriva said:

I'm fully aware of the volatile nature of the Agile tariff. That said, what does your gut tell you on the likelihood of prices falling anytime in the foreseeable?

My gut says, that something is going to have to change pretty drastically in the next few months. One scenario is that the government freezes (or partially freezes) the cap, which could lead to export price been substantially higher than import prices. Deepening on how that is worked out, it may not be sustainable for Octopus to carry on offering Agile export. So I think there is a possibility that it will be pulled, at least for new customers. In which case, having a battery installed (VAT free) would be a reasonable hedge.

That's a pretty extreme roundabout way to justify a battery but sure, I suppose anything is possible. 

Put another way. How certain are you that the only variable export tariff on the market, that is currently offering rates more than 5 times the best fixed rate, will still be there in 12 months? 

Screwdriva

2nd_time_buyer said:

Put another way. How certain are you that the only variable export tariff on the market, that is currently offering rates more than 5 times the best fixed rate, will still be there in 12 months? 

I'm relatively certain that the tariff will still be there because the future of residential energy retail is dynamic (agile) pricing for import/ export (according to them). 

Current prices reflect current all time high natural gas prices (which is what 50% of the UK's electricity is generated from). That said, the Agile Tariff was designed to be risk free for a retailer as they pay the solar exporter (us) what they would pay any supplier, less costs. That's the theory anyway.