PIP telephone assessment failed

Dion91

*long post sorry*

I had a PIP assessment over the phone at the start of the month and got a letter today to say I only got 2 points! I have had PIP for years they are trying to say my conditions have changed they haven’t! I have heart and lung disease and get out of breath they say I can walk more than 200 meters that’s not true I also have bad anxiety and depression I don’t leave my house often if I do I need someone with me. If that wasn’t enough I didn’t get my ESA payment today now I’m stressing out! Does anyone have any advice about appealing thanks 

Rubyroobs

Esa shouldn't stop because PIP has stopped although if you received the severe disability premium then that part of it would stop.
If you don't agree with the decision you will need to ask for a mandatory reconsideration ( MR ) , stating the reasons why the decision is wrong and try to provide extra medical evidence to show why you meet the criteria. CAB may be able to help you with this.
You will need at least 8 points to score an award for each component so think about where the extra points have bene missed. It may be hard to go from 2 points to 8 but can be done.
I really think sometimes these telephone assessments are not doing anyone any favours !

Dion91

Rubyroobs said:

Esa shouldn't stop because PIP has stopped although if you received the severe disability premium then that part of it would stop.
If you don't agree with the decision you will need to ask for a mandatory reconsideration ( MR ) , stating the reasons why the decision is wrong and try to provide extra medical evidence to show why you meet the criteria. CAB may be able to help you with this.
You will need at least 8 points to score an award for each component so think about where the extra points have bene missed. It may be hard to go from 2 points to 8 but can be done.

Thank you I’ve had the same amount of points for years how can it go down to 2 when nothing has changed? I don’t think telephone assessments are very good 

tifo

Rubyroobs said:

I really think sometimes these telephone assessments are not doing anyone any favours !

The in person appointments are no better. It's just how they assess most people.

Rubyroobs

tifo said:

Rubyroobs said:

I really think sometimes these telephone assessments are not doing anyone any favours !

The in person appointments are no better. It's just how they assess most people.

It is since covid but prior to lockdown most assessments in the area I live in were face to face in people's homes.

tifo

They've been doing face to face appointments since last year.

Alice_Holt

Rubyroobs said:

You will need at least 8 points to score an award for each component so think about where the extra points have bene missed. It may be hard to go from 2 points to 8 but can be done.

      But remember that the OP had a previous PIP award that has now been taken away by this telephone assessment, and says that their condition and abilities haven't changed.

    At tribunal the DWP evidence will include past awards and assessments. If the OP's latest PIP form was consistent with previous awards / applications, and they can produce evidence (medical if possible) showing no improvement in their health conditions -  then any tribunal would find it very difficult to justify a decision agreeing with this seemingly flawed telephone assessment. The balance of the evidence in front of the tribunal, and the OP's verbal evidence, are likely to indicate that this assessment is inaccurate. 


OP - here is a good guide to the MR / appeal process:
 https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-pip-appeal

At tribunal over 70% of PIP appeals succeed.

See if your local advice charity has capacity to help you
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/appeals/mandatory-reconsideration-pip/

If they can't, and you need more detailed guidance, then benefits and work have very comprehensive PIP appeal guides - but you do need to join as a member to access these guides (c.£20 pa)
  https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip

You can get your medical records from your surgery (free of charge) by a GDPR subject access request. Ask for a paper copy, and select an appropriate starting date.
A letter from family members / carers / health professionals could confirm that your health conditions / needs have not improved.

Here is the form you need to start the appeal:
 https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/683380/if-you-disagree-with-a-decision-made-by-dwp.PDF      

You can also request a copy of the PIP assessment report:
https://www.mypipassessment.co.uk/your-assessment/after-your-pip-consultation/#:~:text=Getting a copy of your,face-to-face consultation.


If I were involved with your appeal, I would tend to make the written MR as detailed and strong as possible, fully explaining how and why you should retain a PIP award & demonstrating (with examples) how the PIP activities / descriptors apply.
Including any medical evidence to hand, and letters from family members etc.  
I would do this in an attempt to be in the low % of MR's where the second DWP decision maker does change the decision.
You have a month from the decision letter to submit the MR, however later requests will be accepted if reasons are given. Getting evidence, getting help from Citizens Advice, Postal delays, etc are all valid reasons.
However, realistically, you are likely to need to go the independent tribunal to get the decision overturned. Be sure to participate in the tribunal, so the panel can hear your evidence.

Dion91

Alice_Holt said:

Rubyroobs said:

You will need at least 8 points to score an award for each component so think about where the extra points have bene missed. It may be hard to go from 2 points to 8 but can be done.

      But remember that the OP had a previous PIP award that has now been taken away by this telephone assessment, and says that their condition and abilities haven't changed.

    At tribunal the DWP evidence will include past awards and assessments. If the OP's latest PIP form was consistent with previous awards / applications, and they can produce evidence (medical if possible) showing no improvement in their health conditions -  then any tribunal would find it very difficult to justify a decision agreeing with this seemingly flawed telephone assessment. The balance of the evidence in front of the tribunal, and the OP's verbal evidence, are likely to indicate that this assessment is inaccurate. 


OP - here is a good guide to the MR / appeal process:
 https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-pip-appeal

At tribunal over 70% of PIP appeals succeed.

See if your local advice charity has capacity to help you
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/appeals/mandatory-reconsideration-pip/

If they can't, and you need more detailed guidance, then benefits and work have very comprehensive PIP appeal guides - but you do need to join as a member to access these guides (c.£20 pa)
  https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip

You can get your medical records from your surgery (free of charge) by a GDPR request. Ask for a paper copy, and select an appropriate starting date.
A letter from family members / carers / health professionals could confirm that your health conditions / needs have not improved.

Here is the form you need to start the appeal:
 https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/683380/if-you-disagree-with-a-decision-made-by-dwp.PDF      

You can also request a copy of the PIP assessment report:
https://www.mypipassessment.co.uk/your-assessment/after-your-pip-consultation/#:~:text=Getting a copy of your,face-to-face consultation.


If I were involved with your appeal, I would tend to make the written MR as detailed and strong as possible, fully explaining how and why you should retain a PIP award & demonstrating (with examples) how the PIP activities / descriptors apply.
Including any medical evidence to hand, and letters from family members etc.  
I would do this in an attempt to be in the low % of MR's where the second DWP decision maker does change the decision. However, realistically, you are likely to need to go the independent tribunal to get the decision overturned.

Thanks great thank you so much! 

Alice_Holt

Dion91 said:

Alice_Holt said:

Rubyroobs said:

You will need at least 8 points to score an award for each component so think about where the extra points have bene missed. It may be hard to go from 2 points to 8 but can be done.

      But remember that the OP had a previous PIP award that has now been taken away by this telephone assessment, and says that their condition and abilities haven't changed.

    At tribunal the DWP evidence will include past awards and assessments. If the OP's latest PIP form was consistent with previous awards / applications, and they can produce evidence (medical if possible) showing no improvement in their health conditions -  then any tribunal would find it very difficult to justify a decision agreeing with this seemingly flawed telephone assessment. The balance of the evidence in front of the tribunal, and the OP's verbal evidence, are likely to indicate that this assessment is inaccurate. 


OP - here is a good guide to the MR / appeal process:
 https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-pip-appeal

At tribunal over 70% of PIP appeals succeed.

See if your local advice charity has capacity to help you
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/appeals/mandatory-reconsideration-pip/

If they can't, and you need more detailed guidance, then benefits and work have very comprehensive PIP appeal guides - but you do need to join as a member to access these guides (c.£20 pa)
  https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip

You can get your medical records from your surgery (free of charge) by a GDPR request. Ask for a paper copy, and select an appropriate starting date.
A letter from family members / carers / health professionals could confirm that your health conditions / needs have not improved.

Here is the form you need to start the appeal:
 https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/683380/if-you-disagree-with-a-decision-made-by-dwp.PDF      

You can also request a copy of the PIP assessment report:
https://www.mypipassessment.co.uk/your-assessment/after-your-pip-consultation/#:~:text=Getting a copy of your,face-to-face consultation.


If I were involved with your appeal, I would tend to make the written MR as detailed and strong as possible, fully explaining how and why you should retain a PIP award & demonstrating (with examples) how the PIP activities / descriptors apply.
Including any medical evidence to hand, and letters from family members etc.  
I would do this in an attempt to be in the low % of MR's where the second DWP decision maker does change the decision. However, realistically, you are likely to need to go the independent tribunal to get the decision overturned.

Thanks great thank you so much! 

         Just to add that I've made a couple of additions / edits to my post since this version.

Bigwheels1111

Not done a Pip tribunal, did ESA.
Was quite nice compared to assessment,
A judge, Doctor and a lady recording what was said.
They asked questions like, where did you park, did you walk from there etc.
In my case dropped my friend off out side the building in a wheelchair.
Drove round the corner and parked, then run back.
Then the doctor started asking questions, the good thing was he had medical records in front of him.
Looking at X-rays and MRI scan etc.
Asked a few more things like how does it effect your day to day life.
That was it basically.
Finished at 16.50pm on a Monday.
Tuesday morning received a letter, You are entitled to ESA support group and a backdated payment for 11 months.

Just remember you are at War, fight fight fight.
Never give up.
Good luck.

Alice_Holt

Bigwheels1111 said:

Then the doctor started asking questions, the good thing was he had medical records in front of him.
Looking at X-rays and MRI scan etc.
Asked a few more things like how does it effect your day to day life.

      It is important that supporting medical records are supplied as evidence to the tribunal by the claimant.

      The tribunal will not obtain these directly. 

      They may however ask the claimant to get their medical records from their surgery, and forward them to the tribunal. 
      Often this may be done when the tribunal panel feel they need further evidence to reach a decision, and sometimes they will adjourn the hearing to a later date to have this evidence.