S&S ISA

SavingStudent1

wmb194 said:

SavingStudent1 said:

Hi guys,

I was just wondering what is the difference between Vanguard and Trading212 platforms for S&S ISA?

I know that Vanguard only do funds and ETFs. Although I know nothing about how stocks and shares work, I would like to invest in them in the future on an individual basis. So, can I invest in all the funds/ETFs that are available through Vanguard, on Trading212? I sort of want to invest in individual stocks and shares, and possibly some of the Vanguard products. It'd be nice if I was able to do both.

If I open an account with Vanguard and I've invested for 2 years and I now want to move to Trading212 for the above reasons, do I have to sell my funds/ETFs or can I transfer the value of my S&S ISA onto Trading212 and keep all the products in there?

E.g. if I have 500 units of X and 250 units of Y, do I have to sell them and re-buy on Trading212 or can they be transferred?

Thanks!

Why T212 and not, say, Freetrade? I haven't been impressed with T212 e.g., its janky UI, slow execution and slow payment of dividends. Anyway, T212 isn't opening new accounts at the moment, perhaps in a year...

If you invest in the Vanguard ETFs that T212, Freetrade or another broker offers then you should be able to transfer them in specie. T212 and Freetrade don't offer OEICS at the moment so you wouldn't be able to transfer these in specie, you'd need to sell them and transfer the Isa in cash. On the other hand, you could just use multiple brokers.

I haven't used either yet. But, it seems like Trading212 is cheaper and has a wider range of options to invest in several countries, whilst Freetrade is just restricted to shares in the UK/US. The currency fee is existent in both platforms and is probably the major fee when it comes to individual share dealing.

Oh okay, that makes sense. I've seen most Vanguard ETFs/UCITs on T212 website, including the readymade portfolios like LifeStrategy funds.

I'd prefer to stick with one broker, but if there is too much hassle like selling, transferring for a range of products that I'd like to try, then I'd probably use multiple brokers.

wmb194

SavingStudent1 said:

wmb194 said:

SavingStudent1 said:

Hi guys,

I was just wondering what is the difference between Vanguard and Trading212 platforms for S&S ISA?

I know that Vanguard only do funds and ETFs. Although I know nothing about how stocks and shares work, I would like to invest in them in the future on an individual basis. So, can I invest in all the funds/ETFs that are available through Vanguard, on Trading212? I sort of want to invest in individual stocks and shares, and possibly some of the Vanguard products. It'd be nice if I was able to do both.

If I open an account with Vanguard and I've invested for 2 years and I now want to move to Trading212 for the above reasons, do I have to sell my funds/ETFs or can I transfer the value of my S&S ISA onto Trading212 and keep all the products in there?

E.g. if I have 500 units of X and 250 units of Y, do I have to sell them and re-buy on Trading212 or can they be transferred?

Thanks!

Why T212 and not, say, Freetrade? I haven't been impressed with T212 e.g., its janky UI, slow execution and slow payment of dividends. Anyway, T212 isn't opening new accounts at the moment, perhaps in a year...

If you invest in the Vanguard ETFs that T212, Freetrade or another broker offers then you should be able to transfer them in specie. T212 and Freetrade don't offer OEICS at the moment so you wouldn't be able to transfer these in specie, you'd need to sell them and transfer the Isa in cash. On the other hand, you could just use multiple brokers.

I haven't used either yet. But, it seems like Trading212 is cheaper and has a wider range of options to invest in several countries, whilst Freetrade is just restricted to shares in the UK/US. The currency fee is existent in both platforms and is probably the major fee when it comes to individual share dealing.

Oh okay, that makes sense. I've seen most Vanguard ETFs/UCITs on T212 website, including the readymade portfolios like LifeStrategy funds.

I'd prefer to stick with one broker, but if there is too much hassle like selling, transferring for a range of products that I'd like to try, then I'd probably use multiple brokers.

T212 offers a wider range at the moment but no, Freetrade has expanded its universe to include the Netherlands, Germany, Belgium and other continental markets and is regularly adding more. All I'm saying is that I've found T212 to be second rate but YMMV and it'll depend on what you're ultimately looking to invest in - Freetrade's free, basic account could be enough.

SavingStudent1

grumiofoundation said:

SavingStudent1 said:

MX5huggy said:

Vanguard only offer Vanguard funds and ETF’s 

Vanguard charge 0.15% T212 0.7% once you have £2000 or more. Because of this I see no reason to transfer VG funds to T212 although you should be able to it’s call an in specie transfer. 

Forget investing in individual stocks unless you enjoy it as a hobby. Make regular investments in mainstream funds, Vanguard index funds being all you really need. 

Thanks, yes, I noticed this charge is on top of the ongoing charge of maintaining the actual fund. Although, I always wondered how hard it is to beat inflation if you invest in only funds?

Simply because the rate of returns may be 10% for some funds, but that is on a yearly basis. If I bought in Aug 2021, the price has gone up by 10%, but I'll have probably bought quarterly in the year, making 4 payments. So, the first one will get a 10% return, but depending on the prices at the other times, they may get more/less return. It is tricky to sort of win in all ways, but I hope you get my point.

That’s not how investment returns work. 

Funds do not consistently go up by 10% a year and therefore the years return is not used up if the fund has gone up by 10% already and similarly if it has dropped 10% doesn’t guarantee a short term 20% gain. 

Funds are not all the same, and this will not all return the same - they encompass various investments from a passive app-world tracker to specialised investments in small sectors.

If investing for the long term (10+ years, ideally longer) and drip feeding money in (e.g. monthly) short term rises/falls will not have a noticeable impact on the final amount of money. 

Is your aim in investing in individual stocks to try and beat the return of a passive tracker? 

Yes, I do realise this. It was more of that case, the short term rises/falls have less impact the more regularly you drip feed in money.

My aim is just to get a healthy return and possibly beat the return of a passive tracker. Ideally, I want to average a return of 5-10% a year. Some years are good are returns are generally better in the whole market than other years e.g. in those years, I'd like 10%. On bad years, negative returns happen in the whole market too and that is fine.

I'd like to average 7% over the years and benefit from the good years, for example.

SavingStudent1

Albermarle said:

SavingStudent1 said:

MX5huggy said:

Vanguard only offer Vanguard funds and ETF’s 

Vanguard charge 0.15% T212 0.7% once you have £2000 or more. Because of this I see no reason to transfer VG funds to T212 although you should be able to it’s call an in specie transfer. 

Forget investing in individual stocks unless you enjoy it as a hobby. Make regular investments in mainstream funds, Vanguard index funds being all you really need. 

Thanks, yes, I noticed this charge is on top of the ongoing charge of maintaining the actual fund. Although, I always wondered how hard it is to beat inflation if you invest in only funds?

Simply because the rate of returns may be 10% for some funds, but that is on a yearly basis. If I bought in Aug 2021, the price has gone up by 10%, but I'll have probably bought quarterly in the year, making 4 payments. So, the first one will get a 10% return, but depending on the prices at the other times, they may get more/less return. It is tricky to sort of win in all ways, but I hope you get my point.

There are no guarantees with investing . It is quite possible that you could invest today and in 5 years time still be showing a loss.
The historical statistics show that the longer you leave an investment the lower the chance of loss, and the more the chance of a gain. However these are all averages and you could be lucky and hit a good period or unlucky and hit a bad period.
This is not to put you off investing but you have to be willing to accept some possibility of losing money in the short to medium term ( means < 10 years approx ) 
This graph shows the % chances of a loss over time, based on historical results  and based on investing in equities only.

Long-term investing: Increasing your chances of positive returns (nutmeg.com)

Yes, this is true. It is a difficult situation.

SavingStudent1

wmb194 said:

SavingStudent1 said:

wmb194 said:

SavingStudent1 said:

Hi guys,

I was just wondering what is the difference between Vanguard and Trading212 platforms for S&S ISA?

I know that Vanguard only do funds and ETFs. Although I know nothing about how stocks and shares work, I would like to invest in them in the future on an individual basis. So, can I invest in all the funds/ETFs that are available through Vanguard, on Trading212? I sort of want to invest in individual stocks and shares, and possibly some of the Vanguard products. It'd be nice if I was able to do both.

If I open an account with Vanguard and I've invested for 2 years and I now want to move to Trading212 for the above reasons, do I have to sell my funds/ETFs or can I transfer the value of my S&S ISA onto Trading212 and keep all the products in there?

E.g. if I have 500 units of X and 250 units of Y, do I have to sell them and re-buy on Trading212 or can they be transferred?

Thanks!

Why T212 and not, say, Freetrade? I haven't been impressed with T212 e.g., its janky UI, slow execution and slow payment of dividends. Anyway, T212 isn't opening new accounts at the moment, perhaps in a year...

If you invest in the Vanguard ETFs that T212, Freetrade or another broker offers then you should be able to transfer them in specie. T212 and Freetrade don't offer OEICS at the moment so you wouldn't be able to transfer these in specie, you'd need to sell them and transfer the Isa in cash. On the other hand, you could just use multiple brokers.

I haven't used either yet. But, it seems like Trading212 is cheaper and has a wider range of options to invest in several countries, whilst Freetrade is just restricted to shares in the UK/US. The currency fee is existent in both platforms and is probably the major fee when it comes to individual share dealing.

Oh okay, that makes sense. I've seen most Vanguard ETFs/UCITs on T212 website, including the readymade portfolios like LifeStrategy funds.

I'd prefer to stick with one broker, but if there is too much hassle like selling, transferring for a range of products that I'd like to try, then I'd probably use multiple brokers.

T212 offers a wider range at the moment but no, Freetrade has expanded its universe to include the Netherlands, Germany, Belgium and other continental markets and is regularly adding more. All I'm saying is that I've found T212 to be second rate but YMMV and it'll depend on what you're ultimately looking to invest in - Freetrade's free, basic account could be enough.

Thanks, that does help a lot. That's fine - I'll be using the ISA account though, so will be paying the monthly fee of £5.

eastmidsaver

just think carefully, as you can only contribute to one S&S ISA a year.
and as others have pointed out above,  be aware of the risks.  this year has been painful viewings for investments as big losses have happened for many, so be prepared to accept this could happen.
for me i am now with VG  (i switched this tax year from HL),  and am happy with it as it just keeps it simpler and with lower costs.