Do I have to register a grandchild's trust fund

BareTrusts

I paid £10,000 cash into a HL account  for a Grandchild's 18th Birthday which was described as a bare trust.
HL will not help and now no longer allow you to open these type of accounts for grandchildren.
This money has been used to purchase shares.
The Gov website says cash deposits in a bank or institution for a grandchild is exempt from registration.
It also states that shares deposited into an account should be registered.
How does the cash deposit being used to buy shares relate to these statements.
I am an 76 year old pensioner and cannot afford to pay  financial advisors and certainly do not understand the registration process.
I have spent many hours trying to sort out what to do about this
Please help 

bungleberg

The law has changed with regards trusts, HMRC now require trusts to be registered with them. This applies even if the trust may not be liable for tax.
I registered a will trust that I am a trustee of last week on their website, it was simple to do and took less than 20 minutes.
I had quotes from various firms in the region of £400 so it’s worth doing it yourself imo.

xylophone

https://www.weatherbys.bank/insights/new-trust-rules/#:~:text=Do bare trusts need to,relation to a bare trust.

This is a bare trust (not just a nominee account for a minor) so you should register.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/register-a-trust-as-a-trustee

Reaper

BareTrusts said:

I paid £10,000 cash into a HL account  for a Grandchild's 18th Birthday which was described as a bare trust.

This sounds odd. At age 18 the child becomes the owner of the trust. There's a bit of a grey area in that it is possible to continue as trustees if the child does not object, but it seems very strange to start the bare trust at age 18 just when they are normally ending.

Or do you mean the child is currently young and you intend to give them the money on their 18th birthday?

BareTrusts

I thank you for your comments. Problem is I have 5 grandchildren two have now reached 18 but others are quite young.
When I tried to register it would not accept me saying I had to register as an organisation or self employed. Both of which would be a lie as I am retired just with a pension.

Malthusian

Reaper said:

This sounds odd. At age 18 the child becomes the owner of the trust. There's a bit of a grey area in that it is possible to continue as trustees if the child does not object, but it seems very strange to start the bare trust at age 18 just when they are normally ending.

It is not very common and not very advisable, but it isn't unheard of. The child may be at uni and happy to let their grandparent look after their investments. Not a lot should go wrong as long as they don't try to claim means tested benefits and the amounts aren't large enough for tax to be an issue.
However, in this case, the grandparent is struggling to cope with being the responsibility of being a trustee, so they should transfer the money into the names of the adult grandchildren. (Or sell it and give them the cash if the grandchild doesn't want to keep the investments.) 
That isn't an option with the grandchildren who are still minors. A solicitor would be able to handle the trust registration but the fee would take quite a chunk out of the grandchildren's investments. In the OP's shoes I would consider asking the grandchildren's parents if they can unofficially assist with the registration. 

xylophone

Problem is I have 5 grandchildren two have now reached 18 but others are quite young.

I paid £10,000 cash into a HL account  for a Grandchild's 18th Birthday which was described as a bare trust.

Is one of the eighteen year olds the beneficiary of the bare trust?

https://www.taxinsider.co.uk/the-bare-essentials-bare-trusts-ta

Or are they all named beneficiaries?

xylophone

If all are named beneficiaries, the practical option might be to sell the investments, transfer the cash to the eighteen year olds and gift the balance to the minors' Junior ISAs (assuming that they have them and they are not fully subscribed for the current tax year).
If JISAs not yet open, have the parents open them.

BareTrusts

They were all opened separately all individually named. I wondered about the Junior ISAS but one has already more than doubled in value to £21,000 so would take some time to transfer. As I read it anyway even if I closed the accounts and bough premium bonds they would still expect them to be registered.

Re Dunstonh comment, the problem is registering on the Gov Gateway first which you have to do before trying to register a trust. Please advise if there is someway around this.

xylophone

The two eighteen year olds may take control of their accounts.

You could consider selling the investments in the other  trust accounts and  transferring each child's entitlement to a savings account in his /her name held in trust. See

https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/trust-registration-service-manual/trsm23160

The parents could then open a stocks and shares JISA for each child and £9000  contributed to each and used to buy the desired investments.

From April 6 2023, further contributions could be made until the cash was used up.

If not, regarding registering as a Trustee,  https://www.gov.uk/guidance/register-a-trust-as-a-trustee

does indeed say

How to register

Before you can register a trust as a trustee, you need to have an Organisation Government Gateway user ID and password. If you do not have one, you can create one the first time you register. You’ll need a Government Gateway user ID for each trust you want to register.

You’ll need:

• an email address (this will be linked to the trust’s Government Gateway account)
• your full name

Now see this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SzovuDshCzA

Have you tried ringing HMRC for guidance as to how to register?

I am wondering whether you would register as an "organisation" the name of which is eg Trustee of the John Simpson Bare Trust?

Malthusian

Dumping the younger grandchildren's money in cash because the trustee cannot cope with the Government Gateway would be an extremely sub-optimal solution.
I won't go so far as to say that it breaches the duties of a trustee, because this is after all money that the OP could have kept in their own name, buried in a hole in the ground and given the children a treasure map to at 18 if they had liked. (If it was a Will Trust or similar it would be a different matter.) But there has to be a better way. Like taking some technical support from a younger relative.
(With the adult grandchildren's money they can just hand it over - there is no reason on earth someone should look after the money of a grown adult for free if it causes them stress.)
If the markets went up between encashment and until the money was in Junior ISAs and back in the markets, it would almost certainly cost more than simply paying a solicitor £400 to handle the registration. That's hardly unrealistic given the current doom and gloom. 4% missed growth on an account of £10,000 would cost more than a solicitor, 1.9% missed growth would do it for the account with £21,000 in. 
Xylophone is correct - you need to register the bare trust as an "organisation". Bare trusts do not officially have names in the way that more formal trusts with trust deeds do, so something like "The John Smith Bare Trust" would do.
You will need the date the trust was established (when you made the first gift), the names of the trustees (just you), the settlor (you again), the beneficiary (the grandchild) and details of the assets in the trust (which you can get from HL). This needs to be done separately for each bare trust / grandchild.