UKCPS - Driver Observed Leaving Site

Nobuyoshi

Hi everybody, I’m looking for some advice regarding an NTK I received with the reason “Driver - Observed leaving site”

The NTK was received via post. Unfortunately I followed some anecdotal advice and decided to ignore the NTK, and now the appeal deadline has lapsed. The discounted fine (£60) has also lapsed and now UKCPS are demanding £100 within 14 days.

I have now spent some time reading various posts on this forum, and know what I should have done: sent the unaltered blue appeal template in the Newbies sticky. Since I have missed this deadline, and therefore cannot follow up with an IAS appeal, what would you suggest my next move should be? 

The evidence given in the NTK was a photo of the rear of the vehicle. The driver did use the shop that the car park serves within the parking period, and evidence could be provided in the form of a bank statement. 

Should I send an SAR request for evidence of the driver leaving the site? 

Many thanks in advance

fisherjim

The leaving site scam is a little add on these scammers try on to extract as much money from victims as possible, they rarely go any further than threats since the amusing "toothbrush case" (you'll need to google it).

They won't have any evidence of of anyone leaving site it's just a parking weasel trying it on probably hiding in a hedge.

Yes send a SAR requesting all evidence but don't mention who was driving.

Umkomaas

Go to the UKCPS website, as if to pay the PCN (obviously don't), and you should be able to access all photos they hold about the incident. Chances are they don't have any clear photos of anyone 'leaving the site' (at what point does anyone 'leave the site'?), even if they do, you do not pay this!

'Leaving the site' would be the most difficult case ever to pursue through the courts; I've never seen one get that far, despite early huffing and puffing from PPCs. Add to this that UKCPS, even for the most winnable of parking charges, have not issued court proceedings for some three years.  I'd sleep easy!

For entertainment, here is the link for the 'toothbrush case', as highlighted by @fisherjim above.  Please note that the judgment is now 10 years old and some of the arguments put forward have been superseded by legislation changes - nothing that causes you any disadvantage. 

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=16231) 

Nobuyoshi

Thank you for your helpful replies!

Umkomaas said:

Go to the UKCPS website, as if to pay the PCN (obviously don't), and you should be able to access all photos they hold about the incident. Chances are they don't have any clear photos of anyone 'leaving the site' (at what point does anyone 'leave the site'?), even if they do, you do not pay this!

'Leaving the site' would be the most difficult case ever to pursue through the courts; I've never seen one get that far, despite early huffing and puffing from PPCs. Add to this that UKCPS, even for the most winnable of parking charges, have not issued court proceedings for some three years.  I'd sleep easy!

For entertainment, here is the link for the 'toothbrush case', as highlighted by @fisherjim above.  Please note that the judgment is now 10 years old and some of the arguments put forward have been superseded by legislation changes - nothing that causes you any disadvantage. 

Thanks for the info, I went to their site and they just have several photos of the vehicle plus a photo of one of the signs. The car park is almost completely empty, the only other car visible is the one the guy waits in to nab people!

fisherjim said:

The leaving site scam is a little add on these scammers try on to extract as much money from victims as possible, they rarely go any further than threats since the amusing "toothbrush case" (you'll need to google it).

They won't have any evidence of of anyone leaving site it's just a parking weasel trying it on probably hiding in a hedge.

Yes send a SAR requesting all evidence but don't mention who was driving.

Thanks, I will send a SAR. I understand that I should include a copy of VC5 as proof of vehicle keeper (with no reference to the driver) does this sound correct? 

Do I need to be specific about the types of evidence, or can I just request all evidence relating to the charge? 

Umkomaas

I went to their site and they just have several photos of the vehicle plus a photo of one of the signs.

In which case I'd be tempted tell them to FRO, no evidence, no proof, no case!  But let's see what they have when you drop the SAR demand on them.

Thanks, I will send a SAR. I understand that I should include a copy of VC5 as proof of vehicle keeper (with no reference to the driver) does this sound correct? 

Do I need to be specific about the types of evidence, or can I just request all evidence relating to the charge? 

A copy of the V5C, plus a copy of the notice they have sent you or a copy of a recent utility bill either of which will confirm your bonafides. No reference to 'the driver'. 

Request all evidence that pertains to you and to the VRM of your vehicle, plus, for the purpose of identification, all photographs of the driver 'leaving the site'.  Se how that grabs them!

Nobuyoshi

Umkomaas said:

I went to their site and they just have several photos of the vehicle plus a photo of one of the signs.

In which case I'd be tempted tell them to FRO, no evidence, no proof, no case!  But let's see what they have when you drop the SAR demand on them.

Thanks, I will send a SAR. I understand that I should include a copy of VC5 as proof of vehicle keeper (with no reference to the driver) does this sound correct? 

Do I need to be specific about the types of evidence, or can I just request all evidence relating to the charge? 

A copy of the V5C, plus a copy of the notice they have sent you or a copy of a recent utility bill either of which will confirm your bonafides. 

Request all evidence pertains to you and to the VRM of your vehicle, plus, for the purpose of identification, all photographs of the driver 'leaving the site'.  Se how that grabs them!

very helpful thanks, I will report back and let you know how it goes! 

Nobuyoshi

Umkomaas said:

I went to their site and they just have several photos of the vehicle plus a photo of one of the signs.

In which case I'd be tempted tell them to FRO, no evidence, no proof, no case!  But let's see what they have when you drop the SAR demand on them.

Thanks, I will send a SAR. I understand that I should include a copy of VC5 as proof of vehicle keeper (with no reference to the driver) does this sound correct? 

Do I need to be specific about the types of evidence, or can I just request all evidence relating to the charge? 

A copy of the V5C, plus a copy of the notice they have sent you or a copy of a recent utility bill either of which will confirm your bonafides. No reference to 'the driver'. 

Request all evidence that pertains to you and to the VRM of your vehicle, plus, for the purpose of identification, all photographs of the driver 'leaving the site'.  Se how that grabs them!

Just a quick update on this case. UKCPS responded to my SAR request, and as expected the only photographs included were those taken of the vehicle from several angles. They stated that they did not have photographs/CCTV footage of the driver leaving site, and instead had a written statement/description from the patrol officer. 

Grizebeck

These cases are a sinch to win at the IAS

Coupon-mad

Yep - appeal to IAS stating there is no evidence of any driver leaving the site.

prowla

...but you can trust their word on it, can't you?

Grizebeck

Coupon-mad said:

Yep - appeal to IAS stating there is no evidence of any driver leaving the site.

To late now. Ignore Ukcps and any debt recovery letters