Employed Daughter - showing as not employed on the Government Tax website 26 July 2022 at 9:47AM in Employment, jobseeking & training 11 replies 486 views

Peter999_2

My daughter has a part-time job (she is 17, 18 early next year) in a cafe in our city.

She has worked there for about a year and really enjoys it, the owners are a bit hopeless but it is very profitable.    She has always waited ages for payslips (I know this is illegal and she is entitled to receive a payslip on or before her normal pay day) but has eventually got them.     My wife and I try to let her solve these sorts of problems herself to help her gain experience etc. and she is really good at sticking up for herself.

However, she now hasn't got a payslip since April (surprise surprise, just before tax year end).    She has had numerous excuses as to why they haven't been printed, but after three months of no payslips she has asked us for help.

I have emailed her employer but not had a response though she has spoken to my daughter and is not happy that we sent the email.   I have been trying to contact her on her mobile and the next step was for me to visit the shop with my daughter and confront her.

My daughter used to have a login for her personal tax but the way she verified herself was discontinued and it was impossible to provide the information that was requested to verfiy herself.    We've checked again this morning and she can now use her passport and driving licence to verifiy herself so we can look at her personal tax record.

It shows that her employment ended with the company on 1st April 2022, which was a bit shocking but not surprising given the lack of payslips and pathetic excuses.    It sounds very dodgy and I wondered if anyone had had experience of this before?     Is it some kind of tax fiddle?       I would really like some advice as to what her next steps are, i.e. does she report this to the HMRC?

Thanks in advance

Marcon

Peter999_2 said:

My daughter has a part-time job (she is 17, 18 early next year) in a cafe in our city.

She has worked there for about a year and really enjoys it, the owners are a bit hopeless but it is very profitable.    She has always waited ages for payslips (I know this is illegal and she is entitled to receive a payslip on or before her normal pay day) but has eventually got them.     My wife and I try to let her solve these sorts of problems herself to help her gain experience etc. and she is really good at sticking up for herself.

However, she now hasn't got a payslip since April (surprise surprise, just before tax year end).    She has had numerous excuses as to why they haven't been printed, but after three months of no payslips she has asked us for help.

I have emailed her employer but not had a response though she has spoken to my daughter and is not happy that we sent the email.   I have been trying to contact her on her mobile and the next step was for me to visit the shop with my daughter and confront her.

My daughter used to have a login for her personal tax but the way she verified herself was discontinued and it was impossible to provide the information that was requested to verfiy herself.    We've checked again this morning and she can now use her passport and driving licence to verifiy herself so we can look at her personal tax record.

It shows that her employment ended with the company on 1st April 2022, which was a bit shocking but not surprising given the lack of payslips and pathetic excuses.    It sounds very dodgy and I wondered if anyone had had experience of this before?     Is it some kind of tax fiddle?       I would really like some advice as to what her next steps are, i.e. does she report this to the HMRC?

Thanks in advance

If this part time job pays below the threshold for paying tax or NI, it may not be the big deal you think. Annoying? Very - but in practical terms of little consequence. Utter incompetence on the part of the employer is far more likely than a tax fiddle.

How much is your daughter earning and is she paid the correct amount, despite the lack of a payslip? If the answer is 'yes' to both of these, and she really enjoys the job, is it worth making such a fuss? 

Peter999_2

Marcon said:

If this part time job pays below the threshold for paying tax or NI, it may not be the big deal you think. Annoying? Very - but in practical terms of little consequence. Utter incompetence on the part of the employer is far more likely than a tax fiddle.

How much is your daughter earning and is she paid the correct amount, despite the lack of a payslip? If the answer is 'yes' to both of these, and she really enjoys the job, is it worth making such a fuss? 

Thanks for the reply.   She won't earn enough to pay NI and Tax as it is only part time but she should be getting payslips (they haven't paid her the correct money since April, it is always too much or too less, but mainly too much.   When she brought this up with the employer she was told she got a raise in April - but obviously she had no idea as she was not told and not had payslips)

None of the staff have had payslips since April, including the full time people.   One of her full time friends needs her payslips for a car loan and just never gets them which smacks to me of more than incompetence.  Also, my daughter was the only person who got paid on the correct day this month though I don't know if they have since been paid.  I also know that they have paid some of the employees cash out of the til previously instead of the normal bank transaction that they send.

She's worked all week this week which would be about £400 and will be devastated if she doesn't get paid for it.   I just want some advice on what to do next and who to report it to.

Dazed_and_C0nfused

If at least one employee is earning above the lower earnings level for NI then the employer should be reporting the pay for everyone that are employed to HMRC.

elsien

I’d reword your comment about “confronting” the employer. You do not have a contract with them and they are under no obligation to discuss anything with you.
Does your daughter have any reason to believe that she won’t be paid what is owed this week given that she has always been paid up till now? How are the hours that she works tracked in case of any dispute? Is she paid directly into her bank account? 

silvercar

Peter999_2 said:

Marcon said:

If this part time job pays below the threshold for paying tax or NI, it may not be the big deal you think. Annoying? Very - but in practical terms of little consequence. Utter incompetence on the part of the employer is far more likely than a tax fiddle.

How much is your daughter earning and is she paid the correct amount, despite the lack of a payslip? If the answer is 'yes' to both of these, and she really enjoys the job, is it worth making such a fuss? 

Thanks for the reply.   She won't earn enough to pay NI and Tax as it is only part time but she should be getting payslips (they haven't paid her the correct money since April, it is always too much or too less, but mainly too much.   When she brought this up with the employer she was told she got a raise in April - but obviously she had no idea as she was not told and not had payslips)

None of the staff have had payslips since April, including the full time people.   One of her full time friends needs her payslips for a car loan and just never gets them which smacks to me of more than incompetence.  Also, my daughter was the only person who got paid on the correct day this month though I don't know if they have since been paid.  I also know that they have paid some of the employees cash out of the til previously instead of the normal bank transaction that they send.

She's worked all week this week which would be about £400 and will be devastated if she doesn't get paid for it.   I just want some advice on what to do next and who to report it to.

What outcome do you want here?

Your daughter may have to accept that this is how the company operates. Provided she is paid for the hours she has worked, she has to decide if the lack of payslips is enough to start questioning and cause aggravation. I agree it is wrong, but too much prodding the management could result in your daughter losing her job and the company employing someone who isn't questioning them in this area.

Brie

I'd be concerned that the cafe is in trouble financially and that things may eventually go pop.  Easy to pay one part time employee but not more if there's not enough cash to go around?  Better to have 1 person happy then everyone know for sure that things are not good? 

As for letting things just continue on the basis that she's been paid - well is that ok if they aren't actually paying the tax & NI to HMRC??  Even if it's for other and not for her.  

I hope it's a momentary blip - maybe the person that does the payroll/banking/accounts has been off sick or on holiday or....??

liz_bartun

Peter999_2 said:

Marcon said:

If this part time job pays below the threshold for paying tax or NI, it may not be the big deal you think. Annoying? Very - but in practical terms of little consequence. Utter incompetence on the part of the employer is far more likely than a tax fiddle.

How much is your daughter earning and is she paid the correct amount, despite the lack of a payslip? If the answer is 'yes' to both of these, and she really enjoys the job, is it worth making such a fuss? 

Thanks for the reply.   She won't earn enough to pay NI and Tax as it is only part time but she should be getting payslips (they haven't paid her the correct money since April, it is always too much or too less, but mainly too much.   When she brought this up with the employer she was told she got a raise in April - but obviously she had no idea as she was not told and not had payslips)

None of the staff have had payslips since April, including the full time people.   One of her full time friends needs her payslips for a car loan and just never gets them which smacks to me of more than incompetence.  Also, my daughter was the only person who got paid on the correct day this month though I don't know if they have since been paid.  I also know that they have paid some of the employees cash out of the til previously instead of the normal bank transaction that they send.

She's worked all week this week which would be about £400 and will be devastated if she doesn't get paid for it.   I just want some advice on what to do next and who to report it to.

There is nothing wrong in being paid in cash from the till, providing the employer has records of the payments and made any necessary deductions for tax/ni etc.

Even if she's paid below the threshold for paying NI, if she's paid more than the lower earnings limit (£123 weekly/£520 monthly) she should be paid via PAYE.

If she's paid weekly, she would pay national insurance on £400 earnings.

I think ACAS may be able to help?

penners324

Marcon said:

Peter999_2 said:

My daughter has a part-time job (she is 17, 18 early next year) in a cafe in our city.

She has worked there for about a year and really enjoys it, the owners are a bit hopeless but it is very profitable.    She has always waited ages for payslips (I know this is illegal and she is entitled to receive a payslip on or before her normal pay day) but has eventually got them.     My wife and I try to let her solve these sorts of problems herself to help her gain experience etc. and she is really good at sticking up for herself.

However, she now hasn't got a payslip since April (surprise surprise, just before tax year end).    She has had numerous excuses as to why they haven't been printed, but after three months of no payslips she has asked us for help.

I have emailed her employer but not had a response though she has spoken to my daughter and is not happy that we sent the email.   I have been trying to contact her on her mobile and the next step was for me to visit the shop with my daughter and confront her.

My daughter used to have a login for her personal tax but the way she verified herself was discontinued and it was impossible to provide the information that was requested to verfiy herself.    We've checked again this morning and she can now use her passport and driving licence to verifiy herself so we can look at her personal tax record.

It shows that her employment ended with the company on 1st April 2022, which was a bit shocking but not surprising given the lack of payslips and pathetic excuses.    It sounds very dodgy and I wondered if anyone had had experience of this before?     Is it some kind of tax fiddle?       I would really like some advice as to what her next steps are, i.e. does she report this to the HMRC?

Thanks in advance

If this part time job pays below the threshold for paying tax or NI, it may not be the big deal you think. Annoying? Very - but in practical terms of little consequence. Utter incompetence on the part of the employer is far more likely than a tax fiddle.

How much is your daughter earning and is she paid the correct amount, despite the lack of a payslip? If the answer is 'yes' to both of these, and she really enjoys the job, is it worth making such a fuss? 

That's completely wrong. The company has got to submit RTI information even if they are below the thresholds.

She won't be getting months or years credited for pension purposes if they're not submitting.

It will also impact on universal credit and other benefit claims.

Dazed_and_C0nfused

They only need to register and file information under the RTI system if they meet one (or more) of these conditions,

•  pay any employees, including company directors, £123 or more a week

•. employ anyone who’s getting a pension or already has another job

•  provide expenses or benefits to employees, including company directors

• use subcontractors under the Construction Industry Scheme (CIS), or reclaim CIS deductions taken from payments

Peter999_2

Just to come back and update this thread.   Thanks for all the replies from everyone.

My daughter has finally received her payslips and they are correct.  She did get a rise in April (really don't understand why they didn't tell her, when I was an employer I found it very easy to tell people they had got a payrise, haha).

The HMRC personal tax site is now updated to show that she is employed by them and has never left.    Everything is up to date on there including the April, May and June pay.      She is happy now to work there, and has found out she has got a payrise again as she is now a supervisor (another £3 an hour which is great for her). 

Thanks again for the replies from everyone, it is appreciated.