Faulty watch

Marvinmolar4

Marvinmolar4 said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Marvinmolar4 said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Marvinmolar4 said:
S.75 claim made. Card provider wrote back in November to advise that claim had been accepted and money was recredited, with proviso that this could change.

Letter received late December saying that retailer (copy of retailer's response was enclosed) had supplied a third strap so claim was cancelled and money was debited again. This is a lie and a third strap was never sent. The straps cost £100 retail and funnily enough the retailer can't provide any sort of tracking number (because it was never sent). I also have emails to the retailer from my wife stating that as one repair had failed, she wanted a refund under the Consumer Rights Act.

Letter sent back to Sainsburys bank querying why they had accepted the retailer's lie, reiterating that the S75 claim should continue as he retailer is not fulfilling their duties under CRA.

Letter received today saying that the purchase isn't covered as my wife gave the watch to me as a gift.

Is this right? If you buy somone an expensive gift, but it quickly becomes faulty, the purchaser can't make a claim? Also wondering why they didn't use this line first time round as it was known back then.

Any words of wisdom would be much appreciated. Might make a claim to Ombudsman if Sainsbury's are wrong.

That was a chargeback then rather than a Section 75 claim; you only get rebursed up front for chargebacks and not S75... they only reimburse at the end of the process and is also why the merchant was involved.

S75 requires direct relationships between the supplier, creditor and debtor so...

1) Who is the account holder? As your wife bought it was it her account or a secondard card on your account?
2) Who's name is on the invoice from the supplier?

Hi

We made a S75 claim in writing to the credit card company. Does it sound like they've treated it as something else?

My wife is the account holder, purchased on her card (we don't do secondary cards as we both earn) and it was her name on the invoice (we did this deliberately). So...if a gift had never been mentioned, they would never have known.

The first one was certainly a chargeback, its normal for most disputes to be processed as one initially if within the timelimits/rules.

On the second one you need to log a complaint, section S75 says there must be a D-C-S link, urban myth not the law says there are issues for gifts etc. 

Thanks for your advice on this one. I thought Sainsbury's were trying it on.

Another upate as once again people took the time to respond. S.75 claim rejected by Sainsbury's. Referral to Ombudsman. Email received by my wife yesterday from Ombudsman who have upheld the complaint and advised that Sainsbury's will be issuing a refund due to breach of contract by the retailer and joint liability by Sainsbury's. Result!

One thing that puzzles me, no one has mentioned returning the watch? As Sainsbury's are issuing the refund and presumably won't want it back themselves to sell it, where does it go? WIll Sainsbury's claim from retailer who will then want the item back?

HillStreetBlues

Marvinmolar4 said:

Another upate as once again people took the time to respond. S.75 claim rejected by Sainsbury's. Referral to Ombudsman. Email received by my wife yesterday from Ombudsman who have upheld the complaint and advised that Sainsbury's will be issuing a refund due to breach of contract by the retailer and joint liability by Sainsbury's. Result!

One thing that puzzles me, no one has mentioned returning the watch? As Sainsbury's are issuing the refund and presumably won't want it back themselves to sell it, where does it go? WIll Sainsbury's claim from retailer who will then want the item back?

Congrats
You have also showed that you do not have to return an item before making a S75 claim.

If you have full payout I believe Sainsbury's now can claim the watch as you have full refund.
But they will have to arrange it and pay for collection.
The retailer has no rights to the watch, if they do try and claim it say you will only return it via Sainsbury's.

Personally I would just sit tight as  see if anything happens.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

HillStreetBlues said:

Marvinmolar4 said:

Another upate as once again people took the time to respond. S.75 claim rejected by Sainsbury's. Referral to Ombudsman. Email received by my wife yesterday from Ombudsman who have upheld the complaint and advised that Sainsbury's will be issuing a refund due to breach of contract by the retailer and joint liability by Sainsbury's. Result!

One thing that puzzles me, no one has mentioned returning the watch? As Sainsbury's are issuing the refund and presumably won't want it back themselves to sell it, where does it go? WIll Sainsbury's claim from retailer who will then want the item back?

Congrats
You have also showed that you do not have to return an item before making a S75 claim.

If you have full payout I believe Sainsbury's now can claim the watch as you have full refund.
But they will have to arrange it and pay for collection.
The retailer has no rights to the watch, if they do try and claim it say you will only return it via Sainsbury's.

Personally I would just sit tight as  see if anything happens.

Generally speaking there isn’t a obligation to return the goods before receiving a refund, the trader should refund within 14 days of it being agreed a refund is due, in turn the consumer should return/make available for collection, whilst that has no timeframe given you’d expect the two to tie together nicely in an amicable situation.

Were the consumer not to do so then strictly it would fall on the trader to refund and then make a claim against the consumer for a failure of their duty. 

The exception is a chargeback where born_again has said the bank requires the goods to be sent back, although I’m not sure if that means before the chargeback is opened or during the process.  

OP I agree to only give the watch to Sainsburys. On the good advice from born_again it seems with S75 the bank covers the refund so the goods would belong to them. If the bank reclaimed the money from the retailer at a later date the bank should then give the goods back to the retailer (but that bit is not your concern ).

Best thing to do is ask really, preferably by email so you have a record, they’ll either say keep it or ask you to return it to them. I’m not sure what they would do with it if they wanted it back, maybe @born_again knows? 

If for any reason they didn't reply, or answer the question directly, it would be best to write an old fashioned letter noting you have the watch and what would they like you to do. 

If they don’t want it buy a new strap for £100 and enjoy the watch  

born_again

Marvinmolar4 said:

Another upate as once again people took the time to respond. S.75 claim rejected by Sainsbury's. Referral to Ombudsman. Email received by my wife yesterday from Ombudsman who have upheld the complaint and advised that Sainsbury's will be issuing a refund due to breach of contract by the retailer and joint liability by Sainsbury's. Result!

One thing that puzzles me, no one has mentioned returning the watch? As Sainsbury's are issuing the refund and presumably won't want it back themselves to sell it, where does it go? WIll Sainsbury's claim from retailer who will then want the item back?

Good result. 👍

As to watch, best speak to bank & ask if they want it.

If bank were in contact with retailer. It would have to try to resolve already. So doing it now is in many ways pointless. But as above just ask what they want you to do with the watch. 
Although it is a surprising result, given issue is only the strap. So would have expected a refund to be inline with just replacing the strap.
But that is their fault for not looking at the cost of goodwill here. Now it has cost them far more than the cost of a decent replacement strap.😶‍🌫️

If they don't want it back, then you can get a new strap & carry on with a nice refund. 😍

PHK

Not really of any use now, but there is a history of very soft leather being used on straps for Junghans watches (showing marks and wear after a few weeks) and quite a market in replacement straps.