Buying Probate Property - Advice Needed

akorn77

Just want to start off by saying I have zero experience or knowledge of probates.

I'm currently in the process of buying a probate property. The Sellers are awaiting the Grant of Probate (GOP). I've been told that its a "simple" probate consisting of just 1 house and 1 beneficiary. The EA sells alot of these no chain probate properties and they told me that these this one is likely to take circa 8 weeks with the local councils probate office. The Sellers applied for the probate in the first week of March, so at present its been 14 weeks since the probate was applied for. 

My solicitor has had zero updates from the Sellers solicitor regarding timeframes. EA and the Sellers have also been unable to provide any updates. EA keeps telling me that the Probate Office/Court (not sure which), does not provide specific updates and has simply been telling the Sellers that the application ia being "processed".

To further complicate matters I'm in the middle of a chain, and my Buyers mortgage is due to expire this month and it looks as though they need to obtain an extension on their mortgage offer and incur a higher interest rate.

As I have zero experience with probates, I dont know what to believe. There are some questions which spring to mind:

1) Is the EA telling the truth by saying that Probate courts/offices provide no updates?

2) How much longer is something like this likely to take? I keep reading online that probates take 6-12 months so why has the EA quoted me 8 weeks? I'm very confused! 

3) Is there anything I can do in this situation to try and find out how much longer it will take? 

teachergirl

.I have no experience of buying a probate property but I am trying to get probate myself at the moment a process I have done twice before. Mine is also a simple probate case. If you look on the probate website it says probate is currently taking 8 weeks . This is sadly untrue. I applied more than 8 weeks ago. At 7 weeks the office asked a question. I was confused by this as I knew I had already answered these questions. Turns out it is just a delaying tactic as they had to “stop” my application and now it might take another 6 weeks😡 Despite me answering immediately.
If you phone up you wait for at least 45 minutes for someone to answer who will just say it is in process but cannot tell you any details. You cannot be put through to a supervisor. You can complain via email but then they do not answer the email……personally I am at a complete loss as to what to do next.
Previously when I have applied for probate(about 3 years ago) and there was a delay the person at the end of the phone could tell you what was holding it up(in my case a signature on the front page..not mine)
So the buyers are probably telling the truth

Bendy_House

Hi Akorn.

Almost certainly there's nothing to be concerned about (other than the time it's taking), but it's 'just' a case of an overworked solicitor or official. 

If your solicitor is good, ask them to keep piling on the pressure and to ask WHAT the hold-up is. Your EA should also be doing this, but if they were suggesting that the WHOLE conveyancing process could/would be done in 8 weeks, then I don't think they are being realistic.

Mil has just bought a probate bungalow. This had been empty for nearly 2 years, and the probate side of it fully sorted, we were told. No survey or searches were required at it was in a retirement village, so all the 'building' side was taken care of by the company. No mortgage even. It still took the 'usual' ~4 months from offer to completion.

The seller's solicitor was agonisingly slow to respond to queries, and the property manager at the site was, well, simply out of their depth, and didn't have the most basic info to hand even tho' 3 or 4 houses sold there each year, and it should have been as simple as pressing a button on their keyboard.

The vendor's solicitor was local, and when mil also tried to find a local solicitor to handle the purchase, they were all swamped with work and wouldn't take on any more work! She fortunately found a terrific outfit recommended by a friend - it was 200 miles away, but they were simply superb and kept the pressure on.

Sooooo, the '8 weeks' was almost certainly completely unrealistic, and solicitors are very likely still swamped under their workload. There is sadly nothing unusual about the delay you are experiencing.

I guess just 'nicely' pester your solicitor and EA to keep pestering them. Ask WHAT the delay is - what actual piece of info is holding things up.

p00hsticks

Bendy_House said:

If your solicitor is good, ask them to keep piling on the pressure and to ask WHAT the hold-up is. Your EA should also be doing this, but if they were suggesting that the WHOLE conveyancing process could/would be done in 8 weeks, then I don't think they are being realistic.

They're not saying the whole conveyancing process will be done in eight weeks - they're saying that the normal turn around time for a simple probate application is quoted by the probate office as being eight weeks. If everything else has been done and that's what causing the hold up, then there's nothing either the conveyancer (yours or theirs) or the EA can do - it's up to the probate office, and it's almost impossible to get hold of them to find out what's causing the hold up. It could come through tomorrow, or if there are any issues, like someone challenging the will or the will being signed incorrectly then it could take months or even years.  

In my personal opinion, it's rather bad form to put a property on the market without having the grant of probate (there's nothing to stop an executor in doing so, but they won't have the authority to actually exchange/complete on the sale until they have that piece of paper in hand).But I do now understand why people do - I put in my probate application around this time last year before actively putting the house on the market, expecting it to take eight weeks,  and was taken by surprise when it came though in only ten days, before I had the house prepared. Fast foward and I've now had to start paying council tax on the property again (you get allowed six months exemption after probate) after the initial sale dragged on and then fell through - I now have a second sale proceeding, fingers crossed.

user1977

akorn77 said:

I keep reading online that probates take 6-12 months 

Can you point us towards where you've read this?

Have you maybe misunderstood a reference to the whole process of dealing with the estate, from death to distribution of the assets? That's more likely to be what they were talking about than merely waiting for an application for probate to be processed.

If an estate is particularly complicated than the initial work in figuring out what the deceased owned and valuing it can take longer - but it sounds like that's already been done here.

diystarter7

OP

Best bet and most accurate guesstimate will come from your EA/solicitors. Due to Covid etc, things are taking longer and taking longer in some parts of the UK than others

Your EA and solicitors will have a better idea but it also depends on everyone else involved.

meeemee

Once probate is applied for its in the hands of the probate office so it’s just a sit and wait situation until it’s granted, nobody has any control over timeframes so even solicitors can’t hurry it up. Some take weeks done take months, after it’s been granted it should be straight forward and like a regular sale and purchase process. 

akorn77

teachergirl said:

.I have no experience of buying a probate property but I am trying to get probate myself at the moment a process I have done twice before. Mine is also a simple probate case. If you look on the probate website it says probate is currently taking 8 weeks . This is sadly untrue. I applied more than 8 weeks ago. At 7 weeks the office asked a question. I was confused by this as I knew I had already answered these questions. Turns out it is just a delaying tactic as they had to “stop” my application and now it might take another 6 weeks😡 Despite me answering immediately.
If you phone up you wait for at least 45 minutes for someone to answer who will just say it is in process but cannot tell you any details. You cannot be put through to a supervisor. You can complain via email but then they do not answer the email……personally I am at a complete loss as to what to do next.
Previously when I have applied for probate(about 3 years ago) and there was a delay the person at the end of the phone could tell you what was holding it up(in my case a signature on the front page..not mine)
So the buyers are probably telling the truth

Thank you for your insight, thats very valuable information. Sounds like the exact same thing is happening to my Seller! Do time-frames vary depending on which local council is undertaking the probate? 

Bendy_House said:

Hi Akorn.

Almost certainly there's nothing to be concerned about (other than the time it's taking), but it's 'just' a case of an overworked solicitor or official. 

If your solicitor is good, ask them to keep piling on the pressure and to ask WHAT the hold-up is. Your EA should also be doing this, but if they were suggesting that the WHOLE conveyancing process could/would be done in 8 weeks, then I don't think they are being realistic.

Mil has just bought a probate bungalow. This had been empty for nearly 2 years, and the probate side of it fully sorted, we were told. No survey or searches were required at it was in a retirement village, so all the 'building' side was taken care of by the company. No mortgage even. It still took the 'usual' ~4 months from offer to completion.

The seller's solicitor was agonisingly slow to respond to queries, and the property manager at the site was, well, simply out of their depth, and didn't have the most basic info to hand even tho' 3 or 4 houses sold there each year, and it should have been as simple as pressing a button on their keyboard.

The vendor's solicitor was local, and when mil also tried to find a local solicitor to handle the purchase, they were all swamped with work and wouldn't take on any more work! She fortunately found a terrific outfit recommended by a friend - it was 200 miles away, but they were simply superb and kept the pressure on.

Sooooo, the '8 weeks' was almost certainly completely unrealistic, and solicitors are very likely still swamped under their workload. There is sadly nothing unusual about the delay you are experiencing.

I guess just 'nicely' pester your solicitor and EA to keep pestering them. Ask WHAT the delay is - what actual piece of info is holding things up.

Thanks for your insight. All parties have been chasing, but no information is being provided. The only sliver of information I have from the EA is that the probate office have not asked the Sellers for any additional information or asked them to re-complete any documents, which is apparently a "good" sign. 

My solicitor said once the probate is done, we can exchange and complete within 1 week. Everything else is ready. 

user1977 said:

akorn77 said:

I keep reading online that probates take 6-12 months 

Can you point us towards where you've read this?

Have you maybe misunderstood a reference to the whole process of dealing with the estate, from death to distribution of the assets? That's more likely to be what they were talking about than merely waiting for an application for probate to be processed.

If an estate is particularly complicated than the initial work in figuring out what the deceased owned and valuing it can take longer - but it sounds like that's already been done here.

You're probably right, I probably did misunderstand! I did read something else which said the average is 8 weeks. My Sellers are now at 14 weeks and its still not done. The EA said they are confident it will come through this month, but who knows. Surely, it cant to on for 6-12 months for a simple probate?  

canaldumidi

Councils don't undertake probate.

The Probate Office does. Though they have regional offices around the country.

p00hsticks

akorn77 said:

teachergirl said:

.I have no experience of buying a probate property but I am trying to get probate myself at the moment a process I have done twice before. Mine is also a simple probate case. If you look on the probate website it says probate is currently taking 8 weeks . This is sadly untrue. I applied more than 8 weeks ago. At 7 weeks the office asked a question. I was confused by this as I knew I had already answered these questions. Turns out it is just a delaying tactic as they had to “stop” my application and now it might take another 6 weeks😡 Despite me answering immediately.
If you phone up you wait for at least 45 minutes for someone to answer who will just say it is in process but cannot tell you any details. You cannot be put through to a supervisor. You can complain via email but then they do not answer the email……personally I am at a complete loss as to what to do next.
Previously when I have applied for probate(about 3 years ago) and there was a delay the person at the end of the phone could tell you what was holding it up(in my case a signature on the front page..not mine)
So the buyers are probably telling the truth

Thank you for your insight, thats very valuable information. Sounds like the exact same thing is happening to my Seller! Do time-frames vary depending on which local council is undertaking the probate? 

Bendy_House said:

Hi Akorn.

Almost certainly there's nothing to be concerned about (other than the time it's taking), but it's 'just' a case of an overworked solicitor or official. 

If your solicitor is good, ask them to keep piling on the pressure and to ask WHAT the hold-up is. Your EA should also be doing this, but if they were suggesting that the WHOLE conveyancing process could/would be done in 8 weeks, then I don't think they are being realistic.

Mil has just bought a probate bungalow. This had been empty for nearly 2 years, and the probate side of it fully sorted, we were told. No survey or searches were required at it was in a retirement village, so all the 'building' side was taken care of by the company. No mortgage even. It still took the 'usual' ~4 months from offer to completion.

The seller's solicitor was agonisingly slow to respond to queries, and the property manager at the site was, well, simply out of their depth, and didn't have the most basic info to hand even tho' 3 or 4 houses sold there each year, and it should have been as simple as pressing a button on their keyboard.

The vendor's solicitor was local, and when mil also tried to find a local solicitor to handle the purchase, they were all swamped with work and wouldn't take on any more work! She fortunately found a terrific outfit recommended by a friend - it was 200 miles away, but they were simply superb and kept the pressure on.

Sooooo, the '8 weeks' was almost certainly completely unrealistic, and solicitors are very likely still swamped under their workload. There is sadly nothing unusual about the delay you are experiencing.

I guess just 'nicely' pester your solicitor and EA to keep pestering them. Ask WHAT the delay is - what actual piece of info is holding things up.

Thanks for your insight. All parties have been chasing, but no information is being provided. The only sliver of information I have from the EA is that the probate office have not asked the Sellers for any additional information or asked them to re-complete any documents, which is apparently a "good" sign. 

My solicitor said once the probate is done, we can exchange and complete within 1 week. Everything else is ready. 

user1977 said:

akorn77 said:

I keep reading online that probates take 6-12 months 

Can you point us towards where you've read this?

Have you maybe misunderstood a reference to the whole process of dealing with the estate, from death to distribution of the assets? That's more likely to be what they were talking about than merely waiting for an application for probate to be processed.

If an estate is particularly complicated than the initial work in figuring out what the deceased owned and valuing it can take longer - but it sounds like that's already been done here.

  Surely, it cant to on for 6-12 months for a simple probate?

It depends on what you class as simple - most are straightforward, but there have been cases reported over on the 'death, funerals and probate' board where the probate office have come back and e.g. wanted contact details for witnesses of a will, queried signatures or asked for supporting documentation. And one poor person there has been waiting (I think) years because apparently for a very small fee one can, if you wish, lodge a caveat against a probate application without having to give a reason and that stops the application dead in it's tracks.

p00hsticks

canaldumidi said:

Councils don't undertake probate.

The Probate Office does. Though they have regional offices around the country.

Although I think now that all probate applications are submitted to one central address (gone are the days where executors had to turn up at their local probate office in person and swear an oath)