Economy 7 phasing out

YBR

1961Nick said:

JKenH said:

That not as far fetched as it might seem. Toyota have already implemented the installation of locally generated hydrogen fuelling stations based on the SimpleFuel project (links below). If the hydrogen is on tap in the home (rather than needing to be generated) then getting it into the car shouldn’t be technically beyond us. The cost ma6 be beyond the average home but perhaps it could be adopted at some commercial sites.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1108482_simplefuel-home-hydrogen-fuel-dispenser-wins-1-million-doe-prize

https://fuelcellsworks.com/news/toyota-introduces-simplefuel-station-for-the-production-and-supply-of-hydrogen-from-renewable-energy-at-motomachi-plant/

I anticipate this post will generate some negative comment from those opposed to hydrogen in principle.

The problem would be the size & cost of a domestic plant to liquify gaseous hydrogen. 

Hydrogen is also a waste product of some processes, but there'll be competition with Hydrogen-fuelled trains (already in service in Germany, and in testing in the UK) which is seen as a way to de-carbonise Rail where overhead electrification is impractical.

1961Nick

YBR said:

1961Nick said:

JKenH said:

That not as far fetched as it might seem. Toyota have already implemented the installation of locally generated hydrogen fuelling stations based on the SimpleFuel project (links below). If the hydrogen is on tap in the home (rather than needing to be generated) then getting it into the car shouldn’t be technically beyond us. The cost ma6 be beyond the average home but perhaps it could be adopted at some commercial sites.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1108482_simplefuel-home-hydrogen-fuel-dispenser-wins-1-million-doe-prize

https://fuelcellsworks.com/news/toyota-introduces-simplefuel-station-for-the-production-and-supply-of-hydrogen-from-renewable-energy-at-motomachi-plant/

I anticipate this post will generate some negative comment from those opposed to hydrogen in principle.

The problem would be the size & cost of a domestic plant to liquify gaseous hydrogen. 

Hydrogen is also a waste product of some processes, but there'll be competition with Hydrogen-fuelled trains (already in service in Germany, and in testing in the UK) which is seen as a way to de-carbonise Rail where overhead electrification is impractical.

There's plenty of low hanging fruit for hydrogen to replace fossil fuels without targeting domestic heating at this stage. Office buildings, industrial buildings, plant, railways, haulage etc.

The cheapest way to get hydrogen energy into a domestic property is surely by turning it into electricity & using the existing infrastructure. An electric boiler would be an easy conversion from gas or better still use both fuels.

Pulpdiction

The main issues which were the topic of conversation at policy level were the cost of infrastructure improvements to the network and the health and safety issues around the near colourless flame. If a gas main ruptured and caught fire you'd see it from miles around, but with hydrogen you could literally drive a car into a flame before you were aware of it.  So network monitoring would need to improve massively.  But plan was to repurpose the current infrastructure.

Martyn1981

1961Nick said:

YBR said:

1961Nick said:

JKenH said:

That not as far fetched as it might seem. Toyota have already implemented the installation of locally generated hydrogen fuelling stations based on the SimpleFuel project (links below). If the hydrogen is on tap in the home (rather than needing to be generated) then getting it into the car shouldn’t be technically beyond us. The cost ma6 be beyond the average home but perhaps it could be adopted at some commercial sites.

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1108482_simplefuel-home-hydrogen-fuel-dispenser-wins-1-million-doe-prize

https://fuelcellsworks.com/news/toyota-introduces-simplefuel-station-for-the-production-and-supply-of-hydrogen-from-renewable-energy-at-motomachi-plant/

I anticipate this post will generate some negative comment from those opposed to hydrogen in principle.

The problem would be the size & cost of a domestic plant to liquify gaseous hydrogen. 

Hydrogen is also a waste product of some processes, but there'll be competition with Hydrogen-fuelled trains (already in service in Germany, and in testing in the UK) which is seen as a way to de-carbonise Rail where overhead electrification is impractical.

There's plenty of low hanging fruit for hydrogen to replace fossil fuels without targeting domestic heating at this stage. Office buildings, industrial buildings, plant, railways, haulage etc.

The cheapest way to get hydrogen energy into a domestic property is surely by turning it into electricity & using the existing infrastructure. An electric boiler would be an easy conversion from gas or better still use both fuels.

Yep. Or even better don't turn the clean leccy into H2 in the first place, since that's gonna be the main source of green H2.

Of course if there's no other large scale storage solution left to fill with excess leccy, then low efficiency H2 storage is a great fallback and large scale storage on site at a conventional gas generation site may be possible. Then burn it at around 60% efficiency, lose ~10% in transmission, then put the 54% through a heatpump at 2.9 COP, giving 1.56kWh(t) for 1kWh of H2 v's about 0.9kWh(t) from a H2 boiler, if the issues of domestic transmission can be resolved.