Inflated estimated annual cost has now led to a inflated proposed direct debit.

Chrysalis

Current monthly cost for both types of energy around £60-70 (actual readings)

However I noticed a short time ago my most recent bill had a small note of estimated annual cost of £3800 just for electric, plus a little bit more for gas.

Now I got an email suggesting I increase my monthly payment to £424, it states its based on my future energy usage.  Octopus can see the future?

Why is my algorithm so broken?  Well Octopus currently are trying to push a bill on me which had a usage of over 30KwH of electric per day, and I expect this has fed into their algorithms ignoring my current smart meter readings, and the history of the account before the bill.  So a massive snowball effect.

Wont let me set below £312 for a usage of £60 a month.  Probably going to have to ask them to separate the disputed bill and put it on variable DD.

MattMattMattUK

Chrysalis said:

Current monthly cost for both types of energy around £60-70 (actual readings)

However I noticed a short time ago my most recent bill had a small note of estimated annual cost of £3800 just for electric, plus a little bit more for gas.

Now I got an email suggesting I increase my monthly payment to £424, it states its based on my future energy usage.  Octopus can see the future?

Why is my algorithm so broken?  Well Octopus currently are trying to push a bill on me which had a usage of over 30KwH of electric per day, and I expect this has fed into their algorithms ignoring my current smart meter readings, and the history of the account before the bill.  So a massive snowball effect.

Wont let me set below £312 for a usage of £60 a month.  Probably going to have to ask them to separate the disputed bill and put it on variable DD.

What is your annual usage of Gas and Electricity in kWh? What tariff are you on?

wrf12345

British Gas came up with a monthly estimate of three times my actual usage, based presumably on a yearly average that includes heavy gas consumption in winter (gas currently turned off) when I wanted to decrease my standing charge - just chat with them and tell them it is nonsensical. People are cutting back on energy consumption in a way that current computer predictions can't cope with. Ofgem claim they will clamp down on energy companies who misuse the standing charge but they say lots of things that in reality mean the opposite - there is no online link between usage and setting the standing charge (ie the computer could work out three months average use and then let the user set that as a minimum payment), only the ability for the user to INCREASE the standing charge. Senseless at a time when most will be decreasing use of energy and it takes 30-60 minutes just to contact a customer service person.

If Ofgem were doing their job properly, there would be the ability for the user to set standing charges online subject to a minimum as above rather than making empty promises of protecting the consumer.

QrizB

OP I'm sure you've got a thread on this dispute over your electricity usage already.

You probably also know that you can adjust your own Octopus DD on their website.

[Deleted User]

wrf12345 said:

British Gas came up with a monthly estimate of three times my actual usage, based presumably on a yearly average that includes heavy gas consumption in winter (gas currently turned off) when I wanted to decrease my standing charge - just chat with them and tell them it is nonsensical. People are cutting back on energy consumption in a way that current computer predictions can't cope with. Ofgem claim they will clamp down on energy companies who misuse the standing charge but they say lots of things that in reality mean the opposite - there is no online link between usage and setting the standing charge (ie the computer could work out three months average use and then let the user set that as a minimum payment), only the ability for the user to INCREASE the standing charge. Senseless at a time when most will be decreasing use of energy and it takes 30-60 minutes just to contact a customer service person.

If Ofgem were doing their job properly, there would be the ability for the user to set standing charges online subject to a minimum as above rather than making empty promises of protecting the consumer.

Suppliers, or more precisely their data collectors, use Ofgem-regulated algorithms to produce annual estimates. Sadly, these tend to go awry when consumers fail to provide frequent meter readings, and when there is a change of a supplier: particularly, when there is a switch in Winter.  DD calculations are based on a rolling 12 month cost unless the consumer is on a fixed term contract.

FWiW, I am also with Octopus. It allows its customers to set their own monthly DD payments. Octopus didn’t bat an eyelid when I reduced my DD payment to £1 a month for a few months; that said, I do ensure that there is enough credit left in my account to cover in full the charges for the following month.

wild666

Chrysalis said:

Current monthly cost for both types of energy around £60-70 (actual readings)

However I noticed a short time ago my most recent bill had a small note of estimated annual cost of £3800 just for electric, plus a little bit more for gas.

Now I got an email suggesting I increase my monthly payment to £424, it states its based on my future energy usage.  Octopus can see the future?

Why is my algorithm so broken?  Well Octopus currently are trying to push a bill on me which had a usage of over 30KwH of electric per day, and I expect this has fed into their algorithms ignoring my current smart meter readings, and the history of the account before the bill.  So a massive snowball effect.

Wont let me set below £312 for a usage of £60 a month.  Probably going to have to ask them to separate the disputed bill and put it on variable DD.

Complain and if they don't sort it out using your actual readings go to the ombudsman. Octopus have 8 weeks to resolve the matter then you can go to the ombudsman, Resolver is how I did my last energy claim against OFTM. I would expect them to resolve the issue and reduce the DD without you going to the ombudsman and say it's a software glitch.

pochase

wrf12345 said:

British Gas came up with a monthly estimate of three times my actual usage, based presumably on a yearly average that includes heavy gas consumption in winter (gas currently turned off) when I wanted to decrease my standing charge - just chat with them and tell them it is nonsensical. People are cutting back on energy consumption in a way that current computer predictions can't cope with. Ofgem claim they will clamp down on energy companies who misuse the standing charge but they say lots of things that in reality mean the opposite - there is no online link between usage and setting the standing charge (ie the computer could work out three months average use and then let the user set that as a minimum payment), only the ability for the user to INCREASE the standing charge. Senseless at a time when most will be decreasing use of energy and it takes 30-60 minutes just to contact a customer service person.

If Ofgem were doing their job properly, there would be the ability for the user to set standing charges online subject to a minimum as above rather than making empty promises of protecting the consumer.

I assume you mean direct debit when you are referring to standing charges? 

Most suppliers have a possibility to change the direct debit amounts online, but many will only allow a realistic figure. I agree that most of the users in this forum are aware and are trying to reduce their energy use, but there a lot more people who just think it is unfair or wrong that their DD is increasing so much and who are trying to reduce it to an amount that will get them into debt.

Chrysalis

QrizB said:

OP I'm sure you've got a thread on this dispute over your electricity usage already.

You probably also know that you can adjust your own Octopus DD on their website.

I will requote this part for you, this is a separate issue, related to the DD, hence new thread.  Sorry if it upset you I raised this as a problem, as to "you know you can set your DD on the website", please read my full post next time.

"Wont let me set below £312 for a usage of £60 a month.  Probably going to have to ask them to separate the disputed bill and put it on variable DD."

Anyway I rang up Octopus and luckily it was dealt with very easily, the lady very quickly read through my account details without me having to explain much, she voluntarily told me the bill situation is ridiculous and advised me to continue to fight on it and set my DD back to where it was, she even offered to set it lower as my actual bill is lower, but I said back to where it was is fine.

I will update the bill issue on the bill thread I made.  Which is currently with their billing team.  (she confirmed it was escalated).

Chrysalis

pochase said:

wrf12345 said:

British Gas came up with a monthly estimate of three times my actual usage, based presumably on a yearly average that includes heavy gas consumption in winter (gas currently turned off) when I wanted to decrease my standing charge - just chat with them and tell them it is nonsensical. People are cutting back on energy consumption in a way that current computer predictions can't cope with. Ofgem claim they will clamp down on energy companies who misuse the standing charge but they say lots of things that in reality mean the opposite - there is no online link between usage and setting the standing charge (ie the computer could work out three months average use and then let the user set that as a minimum payment), only the ability for the user to INCREASE the standing charge. Senseless at a time when most will be decreasing use of energy and it takes 30-60 minutes just to contact a customer service person.

If Ofgem were doing their job properly, there would be the ability for the user to set standing charges online subject to a minimum as above rather than making empty promises of protecting the consumer.

I assume you mean direct debit when you are referring to standing charges? 

Most suppliers have a possibility to change the direct debit amounts online, but many will only allow a realistic figure. I agree that most of the users in this forum are aware and are trying to reduce their energy use, but there a lot more people who just think it is unfair or wrong that their DD is increasing so much and who are trying to reduce it to an amount that will get them into debt.

Yep its a mess, in my case (I suppose luckily for me) my actual usage is nowhere near what they changed it to, instead their algorithm which estimates annual usage simply broke because of a out of whack bill, so Octopus didnt argue and set my DD back.  So it is now adjusted back.

Chrysalis

wild666 said:

Chrysalis said:

Current monthly cost for both types of energy around £60-70 (actual readings)

However I noticed a short time ago my most recent bill had a small note of estimated annual cost of £3800 just for electric, plus a little bit more for gas.

Now I got an email suggesting I increase my monthly payment to £424, it states its based on my future energy usage.  Octopus can see the future?

Why is my algorithm so broken?  Well Octopus currently are trying to push a bill on me which had a usage of over 30KwH of electric per day, and I expect this has fed into their algorithms ignoring my current smart meter readings, and the history of the account before the bill.  So a massive snowball effect.

Wont let me set below £312 for a usage of £60 a month.  Probably going to have to ask them to separate the disputed bill and put it on variable DD.

Complain and if they don't sort it out using your actual readings go to the ombudsman. Octopus have 8 weeks to resolve the matter then you can go to the ombudsman, Resolver is how I did my last energy claim against OFTM. I would expect them to resolve the issue and reduce the DD without you going to the ombudsman and say it's a software glitch.

Thank you, thankfully I rang them this morning and it was changed back with little fuss.

Chrysalis

Dolor said:

wrf12345 said:

British Gas came up with a monthly estimate of three times my actual usage, based presumably on a yearly average that includes heavy gas consumption in winter (gas currently turned off) when I wanted to decrease my standing charge - just chat with them and tell them it is nonsensical. People are cutting back on energy consumption in a way that current computer predictions can't cope with. Ofgem claim they will clamp down on energy companies who misuse the standing charge but they say lots of things that in reality mean the opposite - there is no online link between usage and setting the standing charge (ie the computer could work out three months average use and then let the user set that as a minimum payment), only the ability for the user to INCREASE the standing charge. Senseless at a time when most will be decreasing use of energy and it takes 30-60 minutes just to contact a customer service person.

If Ofgem were doing their job properly, there would be the ability for the user to set standing charges online subject to a minimum as above rather than making empty promises of protecting the consumer.

Suppliers, or more precisely their data collectors, use Ofgem-regulated algorithms to produce annual estimates. Sadly, these tend to go awry when consumers fail to provide frequent meter readings, and when there is a change of a supplier: particularly, when there is a switch in Winter.  DD calculations are based on a rolling 12 month cost unless the consumer is on a fixed term contract.

FWiW, I am also with Octopus. It allows its customers to set their own monthly DD payments. Octopus didn’t bat an eyelid when I reduced my DD payment to £1 a month for a few months; that said, I do ensure that there is enough credit left in my account to cover in full the charges for the following month.

Seems they dont let you set below a certain value now, I got an email saying they suggest to increase to £424 based on future usage, I logged in and it told me its been changed and will apply from 16 June my next DD date, I tried to change it back to £95, it said invalid data with a note in a box saying if you wish to set below £312 please contact our team.

The good news is the lady checked my smart mater bill and set it without any argument.  So it is now resolved until they try to do the same thing again.