What rates are you being offered by your provider at the moment?

PK_London

BaffledBloke said:

muzzie2 said:

Thanks for your information.
Shell isn't releasing it's October 1st prices yet.   So I am guessing that 80% on top of  my current variable tariff is a rough idea of Shell's next rise.   That makes is around 48.72 per kwh.   Until the next rise on January 1st. 
Will check out EDF and Octopus by phone.   I wish that there was more choice, but I followed the advice not to switch.
I hate feeling so out of control with my energy costs.   I have reduced my electricity usage to the bare minimum and have even turned off the oven as there is a clock on it.  Candles in all rooms!

Hi. First post here so apologies if this has been covered elsewhere. I'll get the hang of it one day.

I've just had an email from Shell Energy saying they're upping my direct debit by an extra £120 on the next cycle, which is towards the end of this month.

I've had previous battles with them since my a/c was moved to them following the Pure Planet collapse: smart meter issues (ongoing), mistakes with billing "but if you pay the extra you'll build up credit" etc. (I suspect these are all familiar here.) So, before I go into battle with their call centre once more, is this just the Ofgen increase kicking in a little early, or a price rise prior to the price cap increase in October?

The latter would be surprising as I've been doing plenty of reducing usage since their last increase. 

Thanks for any help and opinions.

I spoke to EON today and convinced them to drop my DD from £270 to £170. I have been with them for 9 months so they took my actual usage and re-calculated my DD. I am already £320 in credit and this DD is based on the October price cap.

Doc_N

PK_London said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Well, capping the entire wholesale price will do nothing to discourage consumption - the lack of supply is the reason prices are sky high. If Liz does nothing to discourage excess consumption WE WILL HAVE BLACKOUTS. People will die and businesses will move out the country.

I would personally prefer a solution where the first 5 units a day of 150 units a month of electricity was capped with the rest being on the market rate or at your fixed rate. Businesses could possibly have a higher cap.

We have to assume that this supply constraint will last at least 2yrs so throwing endless money at people will not do anything.

People won't die, stop being dramatic.

Planned blackouts, if necessary, can be planned for.

However I do agree the options being muted do not lend themselves to people reducing energy consumption.

Yes people will die.  People who are on oxygen concentrators, home dialysis machines, artificial ventilators. People who rely on stairlifts, bath hoists and adjustable beds. 

They will be forced to stay in hospitals and the NHS is already at breaking point. Black outs cannot be allowed to happen but they will if people who can curb their usage do not do so.

I suspect people will still be cutting usage, even if the cap is frozen. I also suspect, though, that there will be electricity cuts, probably on the scheduled basis of the early 1970s. Not a good scenario, and the result of years of failure to plan ahead.

PK_London

Well it looks like we'll be spending £100bn a year on an artificial cap. Prices will just continue to spiral as energy producers will be able to charge anything they like and there is no incentive to use less when supply has fallen off a cliff blackouts here we come. 

No amount of money will magic supply into existence.

Mstty

PK_London said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Well, capping the entire wholesale price will do nothing to discourage consumption - the lack of supply is the reason prices are sky high. If Liz does nothing to discourage excess consumption WE WILL HAVE BLACKOUTS. People will die and businesses will move out the country.

I would personally prefer a solution where the first 5 units a day of 150 units a month of electricity was capped with the rest being on the market rate or at your fixed rate. Businesses could possibly have a higher cap.

We have to assume that this supply constraint will last at least 2yrs so throwing endless money at people will not do anything.

People won't die, stop being dramatic.

Planned blackouts, if necessary, can be planned for.

However I do agree the options being muted do not lend themselves to people reducing energy consumption.

Yes people will die.  People who are on oxygen concentrators, home dialysis machines, artificial ventilators. People who rely on stairlifts, bath hoists and adjustable beds. 

They will be forced to stay in hospitals and the NHS is already at breaking point. Black outs cannot be allowed to happen but they will if people who can curb their usage do not do so.

OK let's go facts

STORM Eunice cut power to over 200,000 homes and 3 people died, none of whom you are talking about.

They charged up their batteries and backups or made other arrangements. That was not planned or definite like planned blackouts will be.

People will not die, they may be inconvenienced but they won't die.

Mee

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Well, capping the entire wholesale price will do nothing to discourage consumption - the lack of supply is the reason prices are sky high. If Liz does nothing to discourage excess consumption WE WILL HAVE BLACKOUTS. People will die and businesses will move out the country.

I would personally prefer a solution where the first 5 units a day of 150 units a month of electricity was capped with the rest being on the market rate or at your fixed rate. Businesses could possibly have a higher cap.

We have to assume that this supply constraint will last at least 2yrs so throwing endless money at people will not do anything.

People won't die, stop being dramatic.

Planned blackouts, if necessary, can be planned for.

However I do agree the options being muted do not lend themselves to people reducing energy consumption.

The evidence provided by the NHS Confederation would seem to contradict your assertion that People won't die:




If one doesn't accept increased deaths perhaps one can accept there will be increased morbidity and loss of life chances:

Mee

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Well, capping the entire wholesale price will do nothing to discourage consumption - the lack of supply is the reason prices are sky high. If Liz does nothing to discourage excess consumption WE WILL HAVE BLACKOUTS. People will die and businesses will move out the country.

I would personally prefer a solution where the first 5 units a day of 150 units a month of electricity was capped with the rest being on the market rate or at your fixed rate. Businesses could possibly have a higher cap.

We have to assume that this supply constraint will last at least 2yrs so throwing endless money at people will not do anything.

People won't die, stop being dramatic.

Planned blackouts, if necessary, can be planned for.

However I do agree the options being muted do not lend themselves to people reducing energy consumption.

Yes people will die.  People who are on oxygen concentrators, home dialysis machines, artificial ventilators. People who rely on stairlifts, bath hoists and adjustable beds. 

They will be forced to stay in hospitals and the NHS is already at breaking point. Black outs cannot be allowed to happen but they will if people who can curb their usage do not do so.

OK let's go facts

STORM Eunice cut power to over 200,000 homes and 3 people died, none of whom you are talking about.

They charged up their batteries and backups or made other arrangements. That was not planned or definite like planned blackouts will be.

People will not die, they may be inconvenienced but they won't die.

With all due respect your analogy is like comparing apples and pears. A storm and temporary loss of power is not the same as the attritional or insidious effects of  prolonged low temperatures or absence of heating especially when combined with food poverty, etc.

The_Green_Hornet

Mee said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Well, capping the entire wholesale price will do nothing to discourage consumption - the lack of supply is the reason prices are sky high. If Liz does nothing to discourage excess consumption WE WILL HAVE BLACKOUTS. People will die and businesses will move out the country.

I would personally prefer a solution where the first 5 units a day of 150 units a month of electricity was capped with the rest being on the market rate or at your fixed rate. Businesses could possibly have a higher cap.

We have to assume that this supply constraint will last at least 2yrs so throwing endless money at people will not do anything.

People won't die, stop being dramatic.

Planned blackouts, if necessary, can be planned for.

However I do agree the options being muted do not lend themselves to people reducing energy consumption.

Yes people will die.  People who are on oxygen concentrators, home dialysis machines, artificial ventilators. People who rely on stairlifts, bath hoists and adjustable beds. 

They will be forced to stay in hospitals and the NHS is already at breaking point. Black outs cannot be allowed to happen but they will if people who can curb their usage do not do so.

OK let's go facts

STORM Eunice cut power to over 200,000 homes and 3 people died, none of whom you are talking about.

They charged up their batteries and backups or made other arrangements. That was not planned or definite like planned blackouts will be.

People will not die, they may be inconvenienced but they won't die.

With all due respect your analogy is like comparing apples and pears. A storm and temporary loss of power is not the same as the attritional or insidious effects of  prolonged low temperatures or absence of heating especially when combined with food poverty, etc.

I think that temporary loss of power lasted for days in some areas.

Mee

The_Green_Hornet said:

Mee said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Well, capping the entire wholesale price will do nothing to discourage consumption - the lack of supply is the reason prices are sky high. If Liz does nothing to discourage excess consumption WE WILL HAVE BLACKOUTS. People will die and businesses will move out the country.

I would personally prefer a solution where the first 5 units a day of 150 units a month of electricity was capped with the rest being on the market rate or at your fixed rate. Businesses could possibly have a higher cap.

We have to assume that this supply constraint will last at least 2yrs so throwing endless money at people will not do anything.

People won't die, stop being dramatic.

Planned blackouts, if necessary, can be planned for.

However I do agree the options being muted do not lend themselves to people reducing energy consumption.

Yes people will die.  People who are on oxygen concentrators, home dialysis machines, artificial ventilators. People who rely on stairlifts, bath hoists and adjustable beds. 

They will be forced to stay in hospitals and the NHS is already at breaking point. Black outs cannot be allowed to happen but they will if people who can curb their usage do not do so.

OK let's go facts

STORM Eunice cut power to over 200,000 homes and 3 people died, none of whom you are talking about.

They charged up their batteries and backups or made other arrangements. That was not planned or definite like planned blackouts will be.

People will not die, they may be inconvenienced but they won't die.

With all due respect your analogy is like comparing apples and pears. A storm and temporary loss of power is not the same as the attritional or insidious effects of  prolonged low temperatures or absence of heating especially when combined with food poverty, etc.

I think that temporary loss of power lasted for days in some areas.

Yes indeed, I did not intend to trivialise the effects of the storm, but to emphasis the different temporal effects. It should also be noted the deaths were due to the destructive nature of the storm.

John_Philip_Howarth

What rates are you being offered by your provider at the moment?

Please keep to the title of this thread 

Mstty

The_Green_Hornet said:

Mee said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Mstty said:

PK_London said:

Well, capping the entire wholesale price will do nothing to discourage consumption - the lack of supply is the reason prices are sky high. If Liz does nothing to discourage excess consumption WE WILL HAVE BLACKOUTS. People will die and businesses will move out the country.

I would personally prefer a solution where the first 5 units a day of 150 units a month of electricity was capped with the rest being on the market rate or at your fixed rate. Businesses could possibly have a higher cap.

We have to assume that this supply constraint will last at least 2yrs so throwing endless money at people will not do anything.

People won't die, stop being dramatic.

Planned blackouts, if necessary, can be planned for.

However I do agree the options being muted do not lend themselves to people reducing energy consumption.

Yes people will die.  People who are on oxygen concentrators, home dialysis machines, artificial ventilators. People who rely on stairlifts, bath hoists and adjustable beds. 

They will be forced to stay in hospitals and the NHS is already at breaking point. Black outs cannot be allowed to happen but they will if people who can curb their usage do not do so.

OK let's go facts

STORM Eunice cut power to over 200,000 homes and 3 people died, none of whom you are talking about.

They charged up their batteries and backups or made other arrangements. That was not planned or definite like planned blackouts will be.

People will not die, they may be inconvenienced but they won't die.

With all due respect your analogy is like comparing apples and pears. A storm and temporary loss of power is not the same as the attritional or insidious effects of  prolonged low temperatures or absence of heating especially when combined with food poverty, etc.

I think that temporary loss of power lasted for days in some areas.

Exactly this, unplanned and power out for days for some, 3 unrelated health deaths only.

The blackouts being talked about were 2-3 hours at peak times. You get prepared before hand because you know it's planned and no one dies.