General advice RE process when defending a claim on the OCMC MoneyClaim (beta) system

Tunstallstoven

Hi

I recently received a Money Claim against me for money owed (I had some work done and was unhappy with it and so have only part paid). The claim was made using the new beta OCMC system (not the MCOL system). I wondered if anyone here familiar with the system could please help? I'm finding there's very little guidance about the OCMC (Money Claims beta) system and as such I'm finding putting my defence together quite difficult.

1. Can the different aspects of the form be saved and revisited/changed prior to submission? For example, “choose a response”. If I choose “admit part” can I change it to “reject all” later if needs be (while still at draft stage/before submitting?

2. What’s the format for the defence? Aside from the details of the defence is there also a separate timeline?

3. “List any evidence (optional)”. If, for example, I have got lots of photos of various parts of the job do I just put in one entry for all the photos? Or a separate line for each and every photo? Or group photos per topic?

4. Is this the only chance I get to list evidence or do I get another chance later in the whole court process? I don’t know at this stage whether some of the evidence will be relevant or not.

5. I note the claimant has not entered anything on his “List any evidence (optional)” screen (unless he has and we don’t get to see it yet?). If we would see his list of evidence and there is none, does he get another chance add evidence later?

6. From what I can tell there are no word limits, but could anyone confirm please?

Any thoughts on the above or links to guides would be a massive help.

Many thanks

Tunstallstoven

If anyone has any insights before I go ahead and make a pig's ear of it, please do share!    Many thanks

Tunstallstoven

And a  quick aside...  When writing my defence is it best to refer to myself as "I" or "the defendant"?  Ta

Jenni_D

Defences are always in the 3rd person - the Defendant this, the Defendant that, the Claimant the other. When it comes to Witness Statement and evidence stage then things change and it should be in the 1st person (my, myself and I).

I'm not sure if you'll get someone who's been through the Beta system ... most advice is based around MCOL. However, how different are they? (With the MCOL system it's advised in the Parking board to only use the portal to do the AoS, and thereafter to treat MCOL as read-only. Defence should be emailed as a PDF attachment [with Statement of Truth and signature]).

Tunstallstoven

Hi @Jenni_D

Many thanks for confirming RE the third person.  Out of interest should the claimant do the same in their PoCs?  And if they don't, does it really matter - is it just something that might be mildly frowned upon?  

Jenni_D said:

I'm not sure if you'll get someone who's been through the Beta system ... most advice is based around MCOL. However, how different are they? 

That's certainly what I've found!  And that has made replying more difficult as I feel like I'm somewhat in the dark.  It's different to MCOL in as much as everything is submitted online through the beta system.  I have not seen how the defence is laid out though because I want to be 100% sure I can revise decisions first.  So the first thing I'm asked is whether I admit, part admit or reject.  I haven't got full costings yet so not sure which applies.  Yet without answering that I can't get to see how the next stages are presented...  Perhaps (fingers crossed) someone who has defended a clam using OCMC might stumble on this and know the answers to that and/or the other questions in the OP.

Thanks again

Tunstallstoven

Does anyone know RE the OCMC system:

- If I defend only, does the claim then leave the OCMC system and revert to standard?
- When the courts ask for evidence, do they tend to ask for paper copies or an e-bundle nowadays?  

Many thanks

KeithP

Tell us more about this 'OCMC system'.
All you've done is mention it a couple of times.
Link?
What do those letters stand for?

Tunstallstoven

KeithP said:

Tell us more about this 'OCMC system'.
All you've done is mention it a couple of times.
Link?
What do those letters stand for?

I posted a little while back when I was still more confused about the different systems.  See:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6347291/small-claims-difference-between-money-claim-online-mcol-and-money-claims-service#latest

OCMC = Online Civil Money Claims Service.  

It's the system you use if you go through here (providing to meet the criteria):

https://www.gov.uk/make-court-claim-for-money/make-claim

Ta

Tunstallstoven

Hi all

I've submitted my defence through the Money Claim beta system (OCMC) and took notes while I did so to share on here.  I found it difficult to get any info before I did mine, so if someone stumbles upon this in the future perhaps it might prove useful.  

- Changes and Revisions.  Yes, you can revise everything.  You just go back in and change it however you want.  It is all changeable up until when you submit it at the final stage.

- Word Limit.  There did not seem to be a word limit for the defence or timeline.
- Error Messages.  However, when I copied and pasted my draft defence from a word document onto the online system, it did throw up and error message when I first tried to get to the next screen.  I panicked initially thinking I'd exceeded a word limit.  But after A LOT of monkeying around for ages I found out it wasn’t due to the amount of words but that it did not like one particular sentence.  I've no idea why not, but when I played around with it the error disappeared.  Very odd!  

- Costs (i.e. a breakdown of how much you think you don't owe).  There was no separate page for this.  It just asked how much I think I owe (as a part admit).  So I kept the costings calcs I made in the defence.

- Formatting of Defence.  When you get to the last confirm and submit page, it puts all of the sentences and paragraphs of the defence into one long stream of consciousness, with no paragraph spaces etc.  But once it actually creates the form, the spacing comes back again, so no need to worry.  

- Directions Questionnaire.  This formed part of the process, and so was submitted at the same time as the defence.  

Here's a run down of all the different pages I got whilst submitting the defence.  Note that I part admitted.  Presumably if you fully admit, or fully defend you'll get different pages.  

1.Prepare your response

- Confirm your details

       - Date of birth

       - Phone number (optional)

- Decide if you need more time to respond

2.Respond to claim

- Choose a response

       - I admit all the claim / I admit part of the claim / I reject all of the claim

       - Have you paid the claimant the money you owe?

- How much money do you admit you owe?

- Why do you disagree with the amount claimed?

- Box to enter defence

- Timeline.  And option to comment on their timeline.

- Evidence.  And option to list any parts of their evidence you disagree with 

- When will you pay the £xxx?

       - Immediately *or* by set date *or* repayment plan.

3.Resolving the claim

Free telephone mediation

- Agree to / decline

- Phone number

4.Your hearing requirements

- Give us details in case there’s a hearing

- Support you require

- Choose hearing location

- Expert witness (it says:  “It’s rare for a judge to allow you to use an expert in a small claim. Most small claims don’t need an expert.  An expert is not a legal representative.”)  

Options are continue without *or* I think this case requires an expert.  

- Do you want to give evidence?

- Do you want other people to give evidence?  How many?

- Are there dates in the next 9 months when you or your witnesses can’t go to a hearing?

5.Submit

- Check and submit your response

- Includes statement of truth

Cheers

Debbo1

Hi,  If you've successfully used this service then I'd be grateful for advice.   I have now spent over 2 weeks trying to submit a completed form N349 to them and pay the fee to someone who owes me money and has not responded to a CCJ.  The service does not appear to allow this.  I've  emailed to CCBC tell me it's ocmc. Waited on phone for an hour to speak to someone there without success on several occasions.  They don't answer emails.  Then found MCOL, same thing , no help.  Went back into original application for CCJ and would have thought that logically you could progress next steps but nothing.  A guide telling you what to do, but not how to do it.  At my wits end.  Any advice gratefully received.

Tunstallstoven

Hi @Debbo1

I wish I could help, but unfortunately I have no idea.  I'm pretty sure the MoneyClaim (beta) system that I refer to in this thread is something different though.  That system only goes so far along the claim process.  It deals with the initial claim, the defence, and referral to mediation.  If the matter is not resolved at that stage, the case is then referred to the courts and the online MoneyClaim bit is no longer involved. 

With that in mind, it might be better to start a new thread where hopefully someone will be able to help you out.  Have you tried CAB for advice?