Who can be a certificate provider for an LPA?

Brie

OK - this has been left almost too late but I'm hoping to remedy the situation.

I've been intending to help my MiL put an LPA for health in place for a few years now.  And of course life is always too busy isn't it?

So yesterday was extra busy as we had an ambulance out twice for her.  The first time the chaps attending were reluctant to take her to the hospital.  And she said she felt fine.  But she always says that to any medical person as she doesn't want to be a bother.  So they left and about 3 hours later we had to call an ambulance out again and because her distress (& puddles of blood) was obvious there was no question of leaving her at home. 

The problem with the first chaps is they couldn't take our word for it that MiL needed to be in the hospital as there's no LPA. 

Stupidly we should know better than to have let this slide.  When she was last hospitialised 4 years back the doctor attending her was willing to discuss her situation with us as she was too ill to make decisions.  He said he would make a medical decision which he hoped we would agree with and would take any comments/suggestions we made into consideration regarding DNR etc.  He made it clear he would make the final decision and said should she survive we should really sort the LPA.  

So now she is in hospital again would we be too late to do something??  If a doctor at the hospital could see she understood an LPA for health (or whatever it is called) could s/he confirm that on an application?  Or would it need to be someone who has known her longer?  My thought is that if this would work and if OH & I are jointly & separately attorneys (so either of us could decide things) and if another staff member could witness our signatures we'd be good to go. 

I know the application process will take some time (which we may or may not have) but if the forms have at least been submitted that would at least prove some intent should we be questioned as we were by the first ambulance chaps..

fyi - not concerned about an LPA for finances as she has no bills or assets beyond some bank accounts and we are either joint on those or have third party authority already.

sheramber

See 'who can be a certificate provider'.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/make-a-lasting-power-of-attorney/lp12-make-and-register-your-lasting-power-of-attorney-a-guide-web-version#A10

Brie

Thanks @sheramber
I was sure i'd seen something about this previously but couldn't find it today.  So when they say "your doctor" it could mean any random doctor at the hospital that is looking after her that shift??

JGB1955

Brie said:

Thanks @sheramber
I was sure i'd seen something about this previously but couldn't find it today.  So when they say "your doctor" it could mean any random doctor at the hospital that is looking after her that shift??

I doubt they would be willing to sign..... you should be looking at someone who has known the donor for 2 years+.

Ms_Chocaholic

Does your MIL have capacity to make decisions at the moment? If so then an LPA would not benefit you/her at this precise time but would be useful for a time when she loses capacity.

Keep_pedalling

Hospital doctors are not going to be able to do it as all they are dealing with is her current medical requirements. They have no idea of her mental state or her ability to understand what she is doing. It does not need to be a medical person to be the certificate provided just someone who now’s her well.

it is crucial that you act quickly on this and you must have a financial LPA in place as the lack of one of those can cause a lot more problems than the lack of a welfare one.

While you are doing this get your own LPAs in place, it is not something to leave to your old age accident and illness can strike at any age.

ChilliBob

I was about to start a thread on the exact same thing -  as I have had a reminder the ones I started for my folks are about to be deleted unless I login again!....... The certificate provider is the only sticking point.

In my situation it's what's defined as 'family'...... we were going to use my sister in law - that's obviously a relation to *me* -  and of course she comes to family events and stuff, but in the strictest use of the word, is she *family*?

sheramber

ChilliBob said:

I was about to start a thread on the exact same thing -  as I have had a reminder the ones I started for my folks are about to be deleted unless I login again!....... The certificate provider is the only sticking point.

In my situation it's what's defined as 'family'...... we were going to use my sister in law - that's obviously a relation to *me* -  and of course she comes to family events and stuff, but in the strictest use of the word, is she *family*?

from the link above

People who can’t be a certificate provider

The certificate provider must not be:

• a member of your or your attorneys’ families – including wives, husbands, civil partners, in-laws and step-relatives

• an unmarried partner, boyfriend or girlfriend of yours or of any of your attorneys – whether or not they live at the same address

sheramber

Keep_pedalling said:

Hospital doctors are not going to be able to do it as all they are dealing with is her current medical requirements. They have no idea of her mental state or her ability to understand what she is doing. It does not need to be a medical person to be the certificate provided just someone who now’s her well.

it is crucial that you act quickly on this and you must have a financial LPA in place as the lack of one of those can cause a lot more problems than the lack of a welfare one.

While you are doing this get your own LPAs in place, it is not something to leave to your old age accident and illness can strike at any age.

A doctor or lawyer does  not need to have known you.

Many lawyers certify LPAs for people they do not personally know.

A certificate provider must be at least 18 years old and either:

• a friend, colleague or someone you’ve known well for at least two years – they must be more than just an acquaintance

• your doctor or lawyer or someone with the professional skills to judge whether you understand what you’re doing and are not being forced to make an LPA

ChilliBob

sheramber said:

ChilliBob said:

I was about to start a thread on the exact same thing -  as I have had a reminder the ones I started for my folks are about to be deleted unless I login again!....... The certificate provider is the only sticking point.

In my situation it's what's defined as 'family'...... we were going to use my sister in law - that's obviously a relation to *me* -  and of course she comes to family events and stuff, but in the strictest use of the word, is she *family*?

from the link above

People who can’t be a certificate provider

The certificate provider must not be:

• a member of your or your attorneys’ families – including wives, husbands, civil partners, in-laws and step-relatives

• an unmarried partner, boyfriend or girlfriend of yours or of any of your attorneys – whether or not they live at the same address

Yeah I've just re-read that. Conveniently enough my wife's a social worker, and hence has social worker friends who we know who aren't family, so I'll probably go down that route, or I think my Mum might take it to some of her church mates or something!

Brie

Keep_pedalling said:

it is crucial that you act quickly on this and you must have a financial LPA in place as the lack of one of those can cause a lot more problems than the lack of a welfare one.

Why do you think a financial LPA is so crucial?  She has no assets and little money.