Used Car from Arnold Clark faulty and no sign of repair

Bungle5393

I purchased a Citroen C4 Cactus in December 2021 from an Arnold Clark dealership in Glasgow, collected the vehicle on 27th Dec 2021.

On 7th Feb 2022, I noticed exhaust fumes inside the cabin. Checked under the bonnet and there were exhaust gases venting from the front of the engine bay. The cat converter and DPF are both located in this area so could be anything from a split hose to a failure of one of those components.

Booked the car in the following week to my local Citroen branch to be diagnosed and repaired as it was still under the 60 day sales warranty. The car was dropped off on 15th Feb 2022. Initially came back and said there was engine oil in the coolant and that’s what they were going to fix. I said that’s likely to be a separate fault then as both the engine oil and coolant systems are supposed to be sealed systems (they share a common pump which they said had fractured). So if there’s oil in the coolant, does that mean there is coolant in the oil I said? Not sure they said. I challenged them that this would not be causing the exhaust gases to vent, they said that’s what they had diagnosed and were going to fix, and they would do further tests to check it had actually resolved the issue. Fair enough I thought, this might take some time.

Note the repairing branch isn’t the branch I purchased the car from, but it’s still part of Arnold Clark.

Received a phone call a few days later saying they were waiting on a part to complete the repair. I asked for a loan car which I received from the selling dealership on 25th Feb 2022.

On 1st Mar 2022 I phoned for an update to be told the part wasn’t due in for another week or two. 

I called again on 18th Mar 2022 to be told the part was still on backorder, they would call with me with any news.

I haven’t heard from them since. I’ve deliberately not called them, as I don’t feel it should be me doing the chasing.

The chap I bought the car from texted me last night saying they need the loan car back by Wednesday - there was no mention of a replacement. So basically I am going to be left high and dry without a vehicle and my car still in the repair garage.

I’m getting a call today or tomorrow from the selling dealership with a resolution. Initially they offered to swap the car, but tried to palm me off with an older car with higher mileage which I rejected on the basis I should not end up in a worse position than what I was at the start of all this. I have offered to pay 50% of the difference to a more expensive car (maybe £2k more), which I feel is reasonable.

According to the Consumer Rights Act 2015, they have 1 opportunity to fix this fault, and this repair should be carried out within a reasonable amount of time (generally accepted to be 28 days). As they have now had the car for 2 months (and the required part not due to be available until June), I think it’s fair to say they have not achieved this.

*** So am I within my rights to reject the car and ask for a full refund, minus something for the 6 weeks I actually had the car? ***

I don’t think I want to buy another car from them now after them wanting to pull the rug out with this loan car, I’d rather go somewhere else where I might be valued as a customer.

Grumpy_chap

In the current climate, some parts are on extended lead times, so the 28 days to repair may not be as reasonable as normal times.

It sounds like AC were amenable to taking the car back, but the suitable replacement car or value just needs to be negotiated.  What level of value were you willing to absorb in return for the 4 months you had a car?

Bungle5393 said:

I purchased a Citroen C4 Cactus in December 2021 from an Arnold Clark dealership in Glasgow, collected the vehicle on 27th Dec 2021.

On 7th Feb 2022, I noticed exhaust fumes inside the cabin. Checked under the bonnet and there were exhaust gases venting from the front of the engine bay. The cat converter and DPF are both located in this area so could be anything from a split hose to a failure of one of those components.

Booked the car in the following week to my local Citroen branch to be diagnosed and repaired as it was still under the 60 day sales warranty. The car was dropped off on 15th Feb 2022. Initially came back and said there was engine oil in the coolant and that’s what they were going to fix. I said that’s likely to be a separate fault then as both the engine oil and coolant systems are supposed to be sealed systems (they share a common pump which they said had fractured). So if there’s oil in the coolant, does that mean there is coolant in the oil I said? Not sure they said. I challenged them that this would not be causing the exhaust gases to vent, they said that’s what they had diagnosed and were going to fix, and they would do further tests to check it had actually resolved the issue. Fair enough I thought, this might take some time.

Note the repairing branch isn’t the branch I purchased the car from, but it’s still part of Arnold Clark.

Received a phone call a few days later saying they were waiting on a part to complete the repair. I asked for a loan car which I received from the selling dealership on 25th Feb 2022.

On 1st Mar 2022 I phoned for an update to be told the part wasn’t due in for another week or two. 

I called again on 18th Mar 2022 to be told the part was still on backorder, they would call with me with any news.

I haven’t heard from them since. I’ve deliberately not called them, as I don’t feel it should be me doing the chasing.

The chap I bought the car from texted me last night saying they need the loan car back by Wednesday - there was no mention of a replacement. So basically I am going to be left high and dry without a vehicle and my car still in the repair garage.

I’m getting a call today or tomorrow from the selling dealership with a resolution. Initially they offered to swap the car, but tried to palm me off with an older car with higher mileage which I rejected on the basis I should not end up in a worse position than what I was at the start of all this. I have offered to pay 50% of the difference to a more expensive car (maybe £2k more), which I feel is reasonable.

According to the Consumer Rights Act 2015, they have 1 opportunity to fix this fault, and this repair should be carried out within a reasonable amount of time (generally accepted to be 28 days). As they have now had the car for 2 months (and the required part not due to be available until June), I think it’s fair to say they have not achieved this.

*** So am I within my rights to reject the car and ask for a full refund, minus something for the 6 weeks I actually had the car? ***

I don’t think I want to buy another car from them now after them wanting to pull the rug out with this loan car, I’d rather go somewhere else where I might be valued as a customer.

TELLIT01

Grumpy_chap said:

In the current climate, some parts are on extended lead times, so the 28 days to repair may not be as reasonable as normal times.

It sounds like AC were amenable to taking the car back, but the suitable replacement car or value just needs to be negotiated.  What level of value were you willing to absorb in return for the 4 months you had a car?

The OP hasn't had the car 4 months.  They had use of it for about 7 weeks and it's been back with AC ever since.

Grumpy_chap

TELLIT01 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

In the current climate, some parts are on extended lead times, so the 28 days to repair may not be as reasonable as normal times.

It sounds like AC were amenable to taking the car back, but the suitable replacement car or value just needs to be negotiated.  What level of value were you willing to absorb in return for the 4 months you had a car?

The OP hasn't had the car 4 months.  They had use of it for about 7 weeks and it's been back with AC ever since.

But they also had the use of a courtesy car from 25th February

born_again

TELLIT01 said:

Grumpy_chap said:

In the current climate, some parts are on extended lead times, so the 28 days to repair may not be as reasonable as normal times.

It sounds like AC were amenable to taking the car back, but the suitable replacement car or value just needs to be negotiated.  What level of value were you willing to absorb in return for the 4 months you had a car?

The OP hasn't had the car 4 months.  They had use of it for about 7 weeks and it's been back with AC ever since.

From OP 

I purchased a Citroen C4 Cactus in December 2021 from an Arnold Clark dealership in Glasgow, collected the vehicle on 27th Dec 2021.

On 7th Feb 2022, I noticed exhaust fumes inside the cabin. Checked under the bonnet and there were exhaust gases venting from the front of the engine bay. The cat converter and DPF are both located in this area so could be anything from a split hose to a failure of one of those components.

Booked the car in the following week to my local Citroen branch to be diagnosed and repaired as it was still under the 60 day sales warranty. The car was dropped off on 15th Feb 2022. 

So while they may not have driven it for 4 months. They have owned the car.

Sadly a lot of parts are taking a long time to source.

Grumpy_chap

born_again said:

collected the vehicle on 27th Dec 2021.

On 7th Feb 2022, I noticed exhaust fumes inside the cabin.

 The car was dropped off on 15th Feb 

In addition the OP said:

. I asked for a loan car which I received from the selling dealership on 25th Feb 2022.

So, the OP had the use of a car for all bar 10 days.

TELLIT01

The OP was provided by a vehicle which has been unusable for all but 7 weeks (or thereabout) of their ownership.  I don't think it unreasonable for the OP to expect a major motor dealership to provide them with a courtesy car until such time as their own vehicle is fixed.  The availability of spare parts is a problem for the dealership, and should not be one for the purchaser.

Bungle5393

UPDATE : Arnold Clark have agreed to unwind the original transaction, pay off my finance and refund me the value of my trade in.

Arnold Clark didn't seem bothered about keeping me as a customer, or trying to help with a solution to resolve the situation and get me another car. There's a similar car sitting in Armadale, I asked the salesperson what deal his dealership manager could do for me (bear in mind they'd previously said that day they would "look after me"), they came back and said nothing beyond the standard offer. That car is currently £13700, their standard offer just now is £500 off which everyone gets. All I was looking for was another £200 to make it the same price as one I'd seen at Motorpoint. But no, not interested.

In all my dealings with Arnold Clark these last few months, their biggest stumbling block as far as customer service is concerned is that all their staff operate on commission and all the dealerships have their own profit targets. So if you're not benefitting the individual salesperson or the branch, they're not interested. They're just the Dixons of the car industry I think.

Grumpy_chap

Sounds like a fair outcome.
You are now free to buy whatever alternative car you choose from wherever.

born_again

TELLIT01 said:

The OP was provided by a vehicle which has been unusable for all but 7 weeks (or thereabout) of their ownership.  I don't think it unreasonable for the OP to expect a major motor dealership to provide them with a courtesy car until such time as their own vehicle is fixed.  The availability of spare parts is a problem for the dealership, and should not be one for the purchaser.

If you check the warranty terms of manufactures. Most say no temp car is provided. That is down to the dealer. These days many dealers do not the the level of staff cars to offer out in these situations as they can sell cars faster than they can get them.

But it's good to see company come through & do the decent thing for the OP. 👍