worth switching to plug-in hybrid?

iwb100

Petriix said:

One massive advantage of getting a plug in car is that it gives you access to Octopus Go at 7.5p per kWh. That alone could save you £hundreds off your household usage before you even think about the mileage costs. 

A PHEV makes sense if you'll regularly be driving over 200 miles in a day. If it's only occasionally then an EV would be a better option. I strongly recommend taking a test drive in one before writing them off: the instant torque and smooth driving is addictive. 13,000 miles has cost me just £150.

How would an EV work out when two or three times a year you have to take a 330 mile trip with young kids? Genuinely curious. Are there always free charging points at the services? How long does the charging take? As more buy EVs would you not be in big queues?

I absolutely would like one but this is the thing that puts me off. The knowledge that I can make that journey comfortably on a full tank whereas I doubt many EVs would stretch especially with the family and luggage.

mysteryUser

iwb100 said:

Petriix said:

One massive advantage of getting a plug in car is that it gives you access to Octopus Go at 7.5p per kWh. That alone could save you £hundreds off your household usage before you even think about the mileage costs. 

A PHEV makes sense if you'll regularly be driving over 200 miles in a day. If it's only occasionally then an EV would be a better option. I strongly recommend taking a test drive in one before writing them off: the instant torque and smooth driving is addictive. 13,000 miles has cost me just £150.

How would an EV work out when two or three times a year you have to take a 330 mile trip with young kids? Genuinely curious. Are there always free charging points at the services? How long does the charging take? As more buy EVs would you not be in big queues?

I absolutely would like one but this is the thing that puts me off. The knowledge that I can make that journey comfortably on a full tank whereas I doubt many EVs would stretch especially with the family and luggage.

A lot depends on the EV you have, some earlier ones have fairly low ranges. My below experience is as a new EV driver, driving a hire car. 

Last weekend I done Durham to Edinburgh (with a few extra miles picking up people in Newcastle and some extra miles heading to the coast / zoo and bits) in an EV which in this weather suggests a range of around 190 miles. My trip probably was pretty much the milage you mention, 330. 

There are rapid chargers (good to get the battery up to a max of 80%) and there's fast chargers (good to get the car up to 100%). 

We stopped in Dunbar for breakfast for 45 minutes and done a rapid charge while there. 
Later we parked in Edinburgh for 2 hours while exploring the area - plugged into a fast charger there. 
Stopped at Alnwick for 15 minutes on the way back and done a rapid charge while having a short rest. 

Arrived back home with 45 miles left in the 'tank'. 

I felt that the car with around 190 miles range pretty good - it generally needs to stop for a drink and rest as often as I'd like to anyway. On a separate trip, at the motorway services at lunch time, all EV bays were full when I arrived. I done a lap around the car park and then was free. I can imagine sometimes you may have to wait for one - could be a 40 minute wait, which would be rather annoying. 

Petriix

iwb100 said:

Petriix said:

One massive advantage of getting a plug in car is that it gives you access to Octopus Go at 7.5p per kWh. That alone could save you £hundreds off your household usage before you even think about the mileage costs. 

A PHEV makes sense if you'll regularly be driving over 200 miles in a day. If it's only occasionally then an EV would be a better option. I strongly recommend taking a test drive in one before writing them off: the instant torque and smooth driving is addictive. 13,000 miles has cost me just £150.

How would an EV work out when two or three times a year you have to take a 330 mile trip with young kids? Genuinely curious. Are there always free charging points at the services? How long does the charging take? As more buy EVs would you not be in big queues?

I absolutely would like one but this is the thing that puts me off. The knowledge that I can make that journey comfortably on a full tank whereas I doubt many EVs would stretch especially with the family and luggage.

If it's just a handful of times per year then you just adapt. If it wasn't already the accepted paradigm it would seem crazy to create loads of pollution and spend 10x the price on fuel for every single journey just to get a benefit 3 times per year.

If you're planning a holiday on the other side of the country you can always book a night somewhere halfway and charge to full again. Otherwise you avoid peak times, travel overnight, take shorter slower routes, take an extended break to do something fun (meal, cinema, Ikea, Science Museum, zoo, whatever).

The trick is never to be simply waiting for the car to charge, just let it charge while you're busy - ideally sleeping overnight. If it's too problematic, just get the train or hire a car.

I've done a bunch of longer trips including 420 miles in one day (that required 3 x 40 minute charges) without any issues at all. I tend to avoid the motorway services and pick charging stops where there are plenty of alternatives nearby.

Alanp

mysteryUser said:

iwb100 said:

Petriix said:

One massive advantage of getting a plug in car is that it gives you access to Octopus Go at 7.5p per kWh. That alone could save you £hundreds off your household usage before you even think about the mileage costs. 

A PHEV makes sense if you'll regularly be driving over 200 miles in a day. If it's only occasionally then an EV would be a better option. I strongly recommend taking a test drive in one before writing them off: the instant torque and smooth driving is addictive. 13,000 miles has cost me just £150.

How would an EV work out when two or three times a year you have to take a 330 mile trip with young kids? Genuinely curious. Are there always free charging points at the services? How long does the charging take? As more buy EVs would you not be in big queues?

I absolutely would like one but this is the thing that puts me off. The knowledge that I can make that journey comfortably on a full tank whereas I doubt many EVs would stretch especially with the family and luggage.

A lot depends on the EV you have, some earlier ones have fairly low ranges. My below experience is as a new EV driver, driving a hire car. 

Last weekend I done Durham to Edinburgh (with a few extra miles picking up people in Newcastle and some extra miles heading to the coast / zoo and bits) in an EV which in this weather suggests a range of around 190 miles. My trip probably was pretty much the milage you mention, 330. 

There are rapid chargers (good to get the battery up to a max of 80%) and there's fast chargers (good to get the car up to 100%). 

We stopped in Dunbar for breakfast for 45 minutes and done a rapid charge while there. 
Later we parked in Edinburgh for 2 hours while exploring the area - plugged into a fast charger there. 
Stopped at Alnwick for 15 minutes on the way back and done a rapid charge while having a short rest. 

Arrived back home with 45 miles left in the 'tank'. 

I felt that the car with around 190 miles range pretty good - it generally needs to stop for a drink and rest as often as I'd like to anyway. On a separate trip, at the motorway services at lunch time, all EV bays were full when I arrived. I done a lap around the car park and then was free. I can imagine sometimes you may have to wait for one - could be a 40 minute wait, which would be rather annoying. 

Therin  lies another problem, if you arrive at the motorway services and all the charging bays are in use and you have to wait 40 min or more, could you then be in danger of being over the car parks limit, ? , don’t they have a maximum time you can stay there?

[Deleted User]

Alanp said:

mysteryUser said:

iwb100 said:

Petriix said:

One massive advantage of getting a plug in car is that it gives you access to Octopus Go at 7.5p per kWh. That alone could save you £hundreds off your household usage before you even think about the mileage costs. 

A PHEV makes sense if you'll regularly be driving over 200 miles in a day. If it's only occasionally then an EV would be a better option. I strongly recommend taking a test drive in one before writing them off: the instant torque and smooth driving is addictive. 13,000 miles has cost me just £150.

How would an EV work out when two or three times a year you have to take a 330 mile trip with young kids? Genuinely curious. Are there always free charging points at the services? How long does the charging take? As more buy EVs would you not be in big queues?

I absolutely would like one but this is the thing that puts me off. The knowledge that I can make that journey comfortably on a full tank whereas I doubt many EVs would stretch especially with the family and luggage.

A lot depends on the EV you have, some earlier ones have fairly low ranges. My below experience is as a new EV driver, driving a hire car. 

Last weekend I done Durham to Edinburgh (with a few extra miles picking up people in Newcastle and some extra miles heading to the coast / zoo and bits) in an EV which in this weather suggests a range of around 190 miles. My trip probably was pretty much the milage you mention, 330. 

There are rapid chargers (good to get the battery up to a max of 80%) and there's fast chargers (good to get the car up to 100%). 

We stopped in Dunbar for breakfast for 45 minutes and done a rapid charge while there. 
Later we parked in Edinburgh for 2 hours while exploring the area - plugged into a fast charger there. 
Stopped at Alnwick for 15 minutes on the way back and done a rapid charge while having a short rest. 

Arrived back home with 45 miles left in the 'tank'. 

I felt that the car with around 190 miles range pretty good - it generally needs to stop for a drink and rest as often as I'd like to anyway. On a separate trip, at the motorway services at lunch time, all EV bays were full when I arrived. I done a lap around the car park and then was free. I can imagine sometimes you may have to wait for one - could be a 40 minute wait, which would be rather annoying. 

Therin  lies another problem, if you arrive at the motorway services and all the charging bays are in use and you have to wait 40 min or more, could you then be in danger of being over the car parks limit, ? , don’t they have a maximum time you can stay there?

With enough imagination it is easy to overcome problems like that:

https://www.adeltd.co.uk/news/2018/october/45kva-perkins-trailer-mounted-diesel-generator/

You can charge it up whenever you want, wherever you want and not be limited to charging bays.

mgfvvc

mysteryUser said:

I've just recently bought a 7 year old Golf GTE for £14000.

... I do have the concern that my servicing costs are going to be higher.

Why would servicing costs be higher? Electric motors are much simpler than internal combustion engines. You aren't running a pressurised cooling system. There's no clutch and gearbox to go wrong. Oil changes will be infrequent, if they are required at all. Some people say that the complex electronics used in electric cars are a risk, but practically all modern cars depend on complex electronics.

Battery electric cars should be significantly cheaper to maintain than petrol or diesel cars.

[Deleted User]

mgfvvc said:

mysteryUser said:

I've just recently bought a 7 year old Golf GTE for £14000.

... I do have the concern that my servicing costs are going to be higher.

Why would servicing costs be higher? Electric motors are much simpler than internal combustion engines. You aren't running a pressurised cooling system. There's no clutch and gearbox to go wrong. Oil changes will be infrequent, if they are required at all. Some people say that the complex electronics used in electric cars are a risk, but practically all modern cars depend on complex electronics.

Battery electric cars should be significantly cheaper to maintain than petrol or diesel cars.

Not that simple.

It isn't a washing machine motor.

There is a gear box.

There is oil.

There is complex electronics controlling 1000's of amps of electricity.

motorguy

mgfvvc said:

mysteryUser said:

I've just recently bought a 7 year old Golf GTE for £14000.

... I do have the concern that my servicing costs are going to be higher.

Why would servicing costs be higher? Electric motors are much simpler than internal combustion engines. You aren't running a pressurised cooling system. There's no clutch and gearbox to go wrong. Oil changes will be infrequent, if they are required at all. Some people say that the complex electronics used in electric cars are a risk, but practically all modern cars depend on complex electronics.

Battery electric cars should be significantly cheaper to maintain than petrol or diesel cars.

The Golf GTE is a Plug In Hybrid with a 1.4 litre turbocharged petrol engine, so quite a bit of complexity in there.

iwb100

Petriix said:

iwb100 said:

Petriix said:

One massive advantage of getting a plug in car is that it gives you access to Octopus Go at 7.5p per kWh. That alone could save you £hundreds off your household usage before you even think about the mileage costs. 

A PHEV makes sense if you'll regularly be driving over 200 miles in a day. If it's only occasionally then an EV would be a better option. I strongly recommend taking a test drive in one before writing them off: the instant torque and smooth driving is addictive. 13,000 miles has cost me just £150.

How would an EV work out when two or three times a year you have to take a 330 mile trip with young kids? Genuinely curious. Are there always free charging points at the services? How long does the charging take? As more buy EVs would you not be in big queues?

I absolutely would like one but this is the thing that puts me off. The knowledge that I can make that journey comfortably on a full tank whereas I doubt many EVs would stretch especially with the family and luggage.

If it's just a handful of times per year then you just adapt. If it wasn't already the accepted paradigm it would seem crazy to create loads of pollution and spend 10x the price on fuel for every single journey just to get a benefit 3 times per year.

If you're planning a holiday on the other side of the country you can always book a night somewhere halfway and charge to full again. Otherwise you avoid peak times, travel overnight, take shorter slower routes, take an extended break to do something fun (meal, cinema, Ikea, Science Museum, zoo, whatever).

The trick is never to be simply waiting for the car to charge, just let it charge while you're busy - ideally sleeping overnight. If it's too problematic, just get the train or hire a car.

I've done a bunch of longer trips including 420 miles in one day (that required 3 x 40 minute charges) without any issues at all. I tend to avoid the motorway services and pick charging stops where there are plenty of alternatives nearby.

I don’t know how many times you’ve undertaken a journey with a 5 year old and under one year old but if it were just me I’d happily adapt.

But we have to do this journey in school holidays. It’s visiting family. The train is not an option.

I have considered car hire to get around it but then I can’t really get my wife’s head around buying or leasing an expensive car but not actually using it for such journeys. 

When you are on the M6 and your baby needs changing and feeding you aren’t messing round. You need a services and need that to have a charging point available. 

Perhaps PHEV is more suited to me. 

[Deleted User]

There’s no oil to change on a fully electric vehicle. Much simpler maintenance wise than ICE cars. 

There should be no issue charging on the motorway network and it will only get better as time goes on. 

I would think that now is the time to go electric. 

I wouldn’t bother with PHEV as you would resent ever putting petrol in it and wound be plugging it in all the time.