VAT and credit refunds

ffs27

Shell took over my electricity account when my provider went bust.  I had a credit of £172.  Shell has applied this against my first bill, i.e. deducting it from the total of my usage, standing charge plus VAT  - I think that my credit should be deducted from my usage and standing charge only and not from my usage, standing charge plus VAT.  It comes to a few pounds in my favour but nonetheless if it is wrongly applied then the energy companies are making easy money.  

Verdigris

As it happens I got my final statement from another failed supplier, this morning. VAT is taken into account in reaching my final  credit, so it would seem to me that it would be applied against the VAT inclusive figure in the SoLRs bill.

MWT

ffs27 said:

Shell took over my electricity account when my provider went bust.  I had a credit of £172.  Shell has applied this against my first bill, i.e. deducting it from the total of my usage, standing charge plus VAT  - I think that my credit should be deducted from my usage and standing charge only and not from my usage, standing charge plus VAT.  It comes to a few pounds in my favour but nonetheless if it is wrongly applied then the energy companies are making easy money.  

I've yet to see one of these energy supplier bills with incorrect VAT treatment, but I do understand why some find them confusing.

When you make a DD payment to your supplier that is considered to be inclusive of VAT.

So the supplier can either deduct it from the VAT inclusive total in full as seems to be the case here, or they can reduce it by the amount of VAT and then deduct it from the total before VAT.

What they cannot do is deduct the VAT inclusive payment from the VAT exclusive total, or remove the VAT element from the payment and then deduct that from the VAT inclusive charges.

So what you describe is the correct treatment.

wild666

When I work out my bill whether it's weekly, Octopus winter workout, gas,  or monthly, which I will be doing from now on. I always use the prices with VAT added and the bill is within a few pence either way.

Sam0101

Shell Pulled Direct debit from me 3 March 2022,  Bill arrived 8 March 22, no sign of payment that was pulled 3 March on the bill  - Contacted Shell and asked them where the payment was, Blamed my Bank and said they would not amend bill, only if going forward to todays date that it can be done, i.e using readings from 8th March inclusive plus last month rolled up,  Agreed as technically in arrears (only because Shell too slow at processing changeover bills).  Upshot is 1) where did the DD go for 3 working days? 2) why did Shell create a bill when they knew it was due to receive a payment from me and finally,  3) why is their billing system so inflexible to take account of their error and ask the customer to pay for this inflexibilty.  Really not impressed  and after new bill arrived tonight, Shell has miscalulated standing charge days and used an estimate (I have a smart meter -which returns data half hourly). (Sneaked an extra day in) They managed all of this without actually admitting to the error on their part. No apology offered.  Seems customer service is sadly lacking here and not a lot of joined up thinking going on.  Rant over.  

Ultrasonic

Sam0101 said:

Shell Pulled Direct debit from me 3 March 2022,  Bill arrived 8 March 22, no sign of payment that was pulled 3 March on the bill  - Contacted Shell and asked them where the payment was, Blamed my Bank and said they would not amend bill, only if going forward to todays date that it can be done, i.e using readings from 8th March inclusive plus last month rolled up,  Agreed as technically in arrears (only because Shell too slow at processing changeover bills).  Upshot is 1) where did the DD go for 3 working days? 2) why did Shell create a bill when they knew it was due to receive a payment from me and finally,  3) why is their billing system so inflexible to take account of their error and ask the customer to pay for this inflexibilty.  Really not impressed  and after new bill arrived tonight, Shell has miscalulated standing charge days and used an estimate (I have a smart meter -which returns data half hourly). (Sneaked an extra day in) They managed all of this without actually admitting to the error on their part. No apology offered.  Seems customer service is sadly lacking here and not a lot of joined up thinking going on.  Rant over.  

What was the date of the bill (not when it arrived)?

Robin9

Sam0101 said:

Shell Pulled Direct debit from me 3 March 2022,  Bill arrived 8 March 22, no sign of payment that was pulled 3 March on the bill  - Contacted Shell and asked them where the payment was, Blamed my Bank and said they would not amend bill, only if going forward to todays date that it can be done, i.e using readings from 8th March inclusive plus last month rolled up,  Agreed as technically in arrears (only because Shell too slow at processing changeover bills).  Upshot is 1) where did the DD go for 3 working days? 2) why did Shell create a bill when they knew it was due to receive a payment from me and finally,  3) why is their billing system so inflexible to take account of their error and ask the customer to pay for this inflexibilty.  Really not impressed  and after new bill arrived tonight, Shell has miscalulated standing charge days and used an estimate (I have a smart meter -which returns data half hourly). (Sneaked an extra day in) They managed all of this without actually admitting to the error on their part. No apology offered.  Seems customer service is sadly lacking here and not a lot of joined up thinking going on.  Rant over.  

These bills are often prepared many days in advance -  what was the date on the bill itself ?   And two of those days between the 3rd and the 8th were over a weekend

Mobtr

Sam0101 said:

Shell Pulled Direct debit from me 3 March 2022,  Bill arrived 8 March 22, no sign of payment that was pulled 3 March on the bill  - Contacted Shell and asked them where the payment was, Blamed my Bank and said they would not amend bill, only if going forward to todays date that it can be done, i.e using readings from 8th March inclusive plus last month rolled up,  Agreed as technically in arrears (only because Shell too slow at processing changeover bills).  Upshot is 1) where did the DD go for 3 working days? 2) why did Shell create a bill when they knew it was due to receive a payment from me and finally,  3) why is their billing system so inflexible to take account of their error and ask the customer to pay for this inflexibilty.  Really not impressed  and after new bill arrived tonight, Shell has miscalulated standing charge days and used an estimate (I have a smart meter -which returns data half hourly). (Sneaked an extra day in) They managed all of this without actually admitting to the error on their part. No apology offered.  Seems customer service is sadly lacking here and not a lot of joined up thinking going on.  Rant over.  

Sounds like a simple case of the bill being produced before the direct debit was received. Not sure why you’re so het up about this, it’ll just show on your next bill