Same Day Pricing for Funds

coyrls

I have found with II that trade confirmations for Vanguard funds tend to take longer to come through but that when the confirmation does arrive, the actual trade has taken place on the expected day.

GeoffTF

coyrls said:

I have found with II that trade confirmations for Vanguard funds tend to take longer to come through but that when the confirmation does arrive, the actual trade has taken place on the expected day.

With Vanguard funds, on both Vanguard's own platform and iWeb, you do not get a contract note until late in the evening of the day after the trade was executed.

peter021072

Notepad_Phil said:

peter021072 said:

I'm primarily talking about the majority of funds which are priced at 12 mid-day.

Has anyone ever obtained the same day price for an order placed between 8am and 11:55am with Interactive Investor?

I don't know about after 9am, but I have certainly put in orders before 9am (maybe a little bit later too) and where I've expected to get todays price cause of a midday pricing point then that's what I've always got. Whether this is for all funds with such a pricing point I can't say.

and you are referring to Internet orders not phone?

Notepad_Phil

peter021072 said:

Notepad_Phil said:

peter021072 said:

I'm primarily talking about the majority of funds which are priced at 12 mid-day.

Has anyone ever obtained the same day price for an order placed between 8am and 11:55am with Interactive Investor?

I don't know about after 9am, but I have certainly put in orders before 9am (maybe a little bit later too) and where I've expected to get todays price cause of a midday pricing point then that's what I've always got. Whether this is for all funds with such a pricing point I can't say.

and you are referring to Internet orders not phone?

Yup, internet orders via logging into ii.co.uk.

peter021072

Interactive Investor don't have the cut off times listed on their site but they gave me cut off times for four funds I gave as an example.  All four are priced at 12 noon. According to Interactive Investor three of these have a cut off time of 11:00 in the morning, yet a fourth (Invesco High Yield UK Y Accumulation) has a cut off time of 23:00 in the late evening!  Presumably that means if we send an order in at 23:01 for that fund, it misses the following days pricing at 12:00 noon altogether and gets the price 2 days on, almost 37 hrs later.  That doesn't sounds right.

Albermarle

peter021072 said:

Interactive Investor don't have the cut off times listed on their site but they gave me cut off times for four funds I gave as an example.  All four are priced at 12 noon. According to Interactive Investor three of these have a cut off time of 11:00 in the morning, yet a fourth (Invesco High Yield UK Y Accumulation) has a cut off time of 23:00 in the late evening!  Presumably that means if we send an order in at 23:01 for that fund, it misses the following days pricing at 12:00 noon altogether and gets the price 2 days on, almost 37 hrs later.  That doesn't sounds right.

The general idea of OEIC funds is that they are used mainly for  long term investments. So whether a fund is priced one day, or the next at a different price is going to make minimal/no difference in the long run . In  any case a delay could just as well run in your favour as against.
If you have a more traditional personal or workplace pension, with the likes of Scottish widows etc  there seems to be even less clarity about speed of switching and pricing times . However over 25 years it will make zero difference.

Thrugelmir

peter021072 said:

yet a fourth (Invesco High Yield UK Y Accumulation) has a cut off time of 23:00 in the late evening! 

Just means all the admin is performed the following morning during normal working hours. A little more involved than simply pressing a few buttons. 

GeoffTF

Albermarle said:

peter021072 said:

Interactive Investor don't have the cut off times listed on their site but they gave me cut off times for four funds I gave as an example.  All four are priced at 12 noon. According to Interactive Investor three of these have a cut off time of 11:00 in the morning, yet a fourth (Invesco High Yield UK Y Accumulation) has a cut off time of 23:00 in the late evening!  Presumably that means if we send an order in at 23:01 for that fund, it misses the following days pricing at 12:00 noon altogether and gets the price 2 days on, almost 37 hrs later.  That doesn't sounds right.

The general idea of OEIC funds is that they are used mainly for  long term investments. So whether a fund is priced one day, or the next at a different price is going to make minimal/no difference in the long run . In  any case a delay could just as well run in your favour as against.
If you have a more traditional personal or workplace pension, with the likes of Scottish widows etc  there seems to be even less clarity about speed of switching and pricing times . However over 25 years it will make zero difference.

Some of us do transactions where we sell a fund and either buy a similar fund, or buy the same fund in another account. We want to get the pricing points for the sale and purchase as close as possible. Some of us to that every year.

peter021072

Albermarle said:

peter021072 said:

Interactive Investor don't have the cut off times listed on their site but they gave me cut off times for four funds I gave as an example.  All four are priced at 12 noon. According to Interactive Investor three of these have a cut off time of 11:00 in the morning, yet a fourth (Invesco High Yield UK Y Accumulation) has a cut off time of 23:00 in the late evening!  Presumably that means if we send an order in at 23:01 for that fund, it misses the following days pricing at 12:00 noon altogether and gets the price 2 days on, almost 37 hrs later.  That doesn't sounds right.

The general idea of OEIC funds is that they are used mainly for  long term investments. So whether a fund is priced one day, or the next at a different price is going to make minimal/no difference in the long run . In  any case a delay could just as well run in your favour as against.
If you have a more traditional personal or workplace pension, with the likes of Scottish widows etc  there seems to be even less clarity about speed of switching and pricing times . However over 25 years it will make zero difference.

Imagine the situation where you were selling a fund investing in Russian stocks for example.  You sense the possibility of a market crash or suspension in their stockmarket early in the week and send an order to sell at 23:30 on a Tuesday only to have it priced for Thursday. Of course this is an extreme example, but very sharp price movements can occur over a day or two, and irrespective of whether it makes a big difference, surely in principle the cut off times and pricing should be transparent? 

Fidelity seem to to be transparent here.  They list the minority of funds which don't have a cut off at 11am, and what the cut off time is. 

If cut off times are determined by the fund managers rather than brokers, perhaps these times are valid across all brokers?  According to Fidelity the latest cut off time seems to be 4pm (on normal days).

DireEmblem

GeoffTF said:

coyrls said:

I have found with II that trade confirmations for Vanguard funds tend to take longer to come through but that when the confirmation does arrive, the actual trade has taken place on the expected day.

With Vanguard funds, on both Vanguard's own platform and iWeb, you do not get a contract note until late in the evening of the day after the trade was executed.

IIRC this is because Vanguard funds price around 9pm GMT.  I dont think they are actually 'valued' at this time, but more the very next day, so the price at which you achieve, although at 9pm GMT, will not be confirmed until around midday the next day, which is then released to the transfer agent to apply against all dealing, and then released to your platform provider to forward on to yourself.