Upcoming window replacement project in the flat I'm buying

ce5656

Hi everyone, could you kindly give some advice on this?

I'm in the middle of buying a flat and the leasehold pack received recently disclosed an upcoming window replacement project which probably will cost this flat I'm buying around £10,000 (there's only a quote for the entire project but judging from the number of flats and windows involved, it's going to be around this figure). The sellers must know about this as according to the resident committee meeting notes last year, the residents were talking about when not whether to get the windows replaced. They must have reached some sort of agreement already and I assume that I will have to stick to whatever the sellers have already agreed. The building is Grade II listed and the planning application hasn't been submitted yet. The actual project is likely to be carried out either in 2022 or 2023. My solicitor has asked the sellers' solicitor for more information but they haven't responded yet.

Do you think I should go back and re-negotiate the price with the sellers? 

canaldumidi

If the Residents Association has a sinking fund (built up over preceding years) that will (or may) cover the cost of this project, then there is no problem. Information aout any sinking fund should be in the management pack.

If not, then this is clearly an unpredicted cost you will incur, and I'd suggest renegotiating the price. A difficulty is it is uncertain how much it will be. Estimates can change with any project (usually upwards!), and with a listed building the authories might impose specific (more expensive) requirements. So bear that in mind when the sellers suggest eg going 50/50 on the £10K cost.

You should also check what % of the total project cost your flat will be liable for. That should be made clear in the lease.

TripleH

It's a hard one because the sellers could quite easily say either :

a. The price they put it on for factors in the impending window replacement so you already have got the benefit

b. They don't / won't obtain any benefit from new windows so why should they pay anything towards them on top of what they already contributed to the sink fund

Ask, but be prepared for a blanket 'no' from the seller.

ce5656

canaldumidi said:

If the Residents Association has a sinking fund (built up over preceding years) that will (or may) cover the cost of this project, then there is no problem. Information aout any sinking fund should be in the management pack.

If not, then this is clearly an unpredicted cost you will incur, and I'd suggest renegotiating the price. A difficulty is it is uncertain how much it will be. Estimates can change with any project (usually upwards!), and with a listed building the authories might impose specific (more expensive) requirements. So bear that in mind when the sellers suggest eg going 50/50 on the £10K cost.

You should also check what % of the total project cost your flat will be liable for. That should be made clear in the lease.

Thanks!

The sinking fund is very small and covers about 10% of the quoted price. 

ce5656

TripleH said:

It's a hard one because the sellers could quite easily say either :

a. The price they put it on for factors in the impending window replacement so you already have got the benefit

b. They don't / won't obtain any benefit from new windows so why should they pay anything towards them on top of what they already contributed to the sink fund

Ask, but be prepared for a blanket 'no' from the seller.

I think the sinking fund will only cover maximum 10% of the quoted price as there's not that much money in there to begin with.

You have a point - the sellers did accept our offer which is about 10% off the asking price although nobody ever told us it's because of the windows. We made our offer based on comparable flats sold recently nearby and they just agreed to it with very little negotiation. We don't want to upset the sellers (they are an old couple who live overseas) but I also think that we made the offer not knowing this window project at all. I don't know how to re-negotiate without causing any offence.

eddddy

ce5656 said:
I don't know how to re-negotiate without causing any offence.

Are you buying through an estate agent?

If so, it's part of their job to present this kind of issue to the seller, without offending them.

The estate agent's key goal will be to make sure the sale happens - so they get their commission - they won't really care if it's for £10k more or less.

But, in order to achieve the sale, the estate agent might do both of these things...

• Say to you that you're being unreasonable by asking for a price reduction - and try to persuade you to stick with your original offer.

• Say to the seller that it's reasonable to ask for a price reduction - and try to persuade the seller to accept the reduced offer.

...and hope that one of you gives in and/or you both compromise and meet in the middle.

ce5656

eddddy said:

ce5656 said:
I don't know how to re-negotiate without causing any offence.

Are you buying through an estate agent?

If so, it's part of their job to present this kind of issue to the seller, without offending them.

The estate agent's key goal will be to make sure the sale happens - so they get their commission - they won't really care if it's for £10k more or less.

But, in order to achieve the sale, the estate agent might do both of these things...

• Say to you that you're being unreasonable by asking for a price reduction - and try to persuade you to stick with your original offer.

• Say to the seller that it's reasonable to ask for a price reduction - and try to persuade the seller to accept the reduced offer.

...and hope that one of you gives in and/or you both compromise and meet in the middle.

Thanks for the advice!

onylon

Will the new windows reduce your heating bills, reduce noise and/or increase the value of the property? 

It doesn't hurt to ask for a discount but I wouldn't be surprised if the vendor refuses to pay for work that doesn't benefit them.

canaldumidi

ce5656 said:

TripleH said:

It's a hard one because the sellers could quite easily say either :

a. The price they put it on for factors in the impending window replacement so you already have got the benefit

b. They don't / won't obtain any benefit from new windows so why should they pay anything towards them on top of what they already contributed to the sink fund

Ask, but be prepared for a blanket 'no' from the seller.

..... I don't know how to re-negotiate without causing any offence.

So English!

(is that a racist comment? One has to be soooo careful nowadays. Don't want another ban!)

Negotiation / market haggling comes easy in some cultures, but not here. But it's pretty normal in property buying and should just be done in a straight-forward way without embarassment.

Though as edddy says, it's in the EA job description.

ce5656

canaldumidi said:

ce5656 said:

TripleH said:

It's a hard one because the sellers could quite easily say either :

a. The price they put it on for factors in the impending window replacement so you already have got the benefit

b. They don't / won't obtain any benefit from new windows so why should they pay anything towards them on top of what they already contributed to the sink fund

Ask, but be prepared for a blanket 'no' from the seller.

..... I don't know how to re-negotiate without causing any offence.

So English!

(is that a racist comment? One has to be soooo careful nowadays. Don't want another ban!)

Negotiation / market haggling comes easy in some cultures, but not here. But it's pretty normal in property buying and should just be done in a straight-forward way without embarassment.

Though as edddy says, it's in the EA job description.

Haha no I don't find the comment racist although I must say that none of the individuals involved in this purchase/sale is English;)

I will wait for their solicitor to come back and confirm what they have agreed first. Meanwhile I need to work out what to say to the EA in my head.

user1977

I suspect your best argument might be that it would be an unexpectedly large bill to swallow shortly after buying the flat, and leave aside any discussions about the current/future value of the flat.