Electrical item paid for repair but same item has broke again. Are we covered?

turfey21

Hi,

Before I go back to Siemens I would like to make sure I am stating the right thing to them as I feel we should not pay for another repair.

Briefly in 2016 we bought a coffee machine (£1500) and have looked after it exceptionally well, always descaling and cleaning and only myself and my husband use it once or twice a day.
Anyway in December 2020 it developed a fault. Husband tried to locate which part needing repairing but we had to contact Siemens who said that it was just out of its 6 year warranty and they could repair it but they would need it back.
I returned it and they said that the flow switch was blocked and the tank magnet was sticking, well this cost £200 and we had our coffee machine back. 

Today while doing its descale it has once again developed exactly the same fault as it did previously.

Siemens told us that the repair would only be warranted for 12 months - but I feel that the part has not lasted for a reasonable amount of time as only 13 months has passed and that they had not replaced it with a suitable product. For such an expensive coffee machine that makes maybe four cups of coffee a day this is not acceptable.

I know Siemens will want the product back, will want to charge us another £200 or try and wiggle out of it by saying it was another part.

Surely I am protected by some Consumer Act or similar that I can quote to them. 

Can anyone help please.

TELLIT01

Although the symptoms may be identical to the previous occasion, it doesn't mean that the cause of the fault is exactly the same.  It's not unreasonable that Siemens will want to examine the machine to make their own assessment of the problem.  Siemens only have your word for the amount of use it has had (I'm not doubting you) and may say that the failure is simply down to wear and tear.  The only way to know what their line will be is to contact them.

TonyMMM

If it was bought in 2016, with a six year warranty, why did you have to pay for the repair in 2020 and has that 6 years now expired  ?

bris

Whats blocking it? Sounds like a water problem have you thought about putting a water filter or descaler in before it enters the machine.

I would not assume a blockage is a manufacturing fault, get them to explain whats causing the blockage so you can take steps to avoid it in the future.

turfey21

TELLIT01 said:

Although the symptoms may be identical to the previous occasion, it doesn't mean that the cause of the fault is exactly the same.  It's not unreasonable that Siemens will want to examine the machine to make their own assessment of the problem.  Siemens only have your word for the amount of use it has had (I'm not doubting you) and may say that the failure is simply down to wear and tear.  The only way to know what their line will be is to contact them.

Thank you for your reply, the great thing about this machine is that it logs the amount and type of coffee it has made so they would easily be able to check our usage. 

Aylesbury_Duck

turfey21 said:

Hi,

Before I go back to Siemens I would like to make sure I am stating the right thing to them as I feel we should not pay for another repair.

Briefly in 2016 we bought a coffee machine (£1500) and have looked after it exceptionally well, always descaling and cleaning and only myself and my husband use it once or twice a day.
Anyway in December 2020 it developed a fault. Husband tried to locate which part needing repairing but we had to contact Siemens who said that it was just out of its 6 year warranty and they could repair it but they would need it back.
I returned it and they said that the flow switch was blocked and the tank magnet was sticking, well this cost £200 and we had our coffee machine back. 

Today while doing its descale it has once again developed exactly the same fault as it did previously.

Siemens told us that the repair would only be warranted for 12 months - but I feel that the part has not lasted for a reasonable amount of time as only 13 months has passed and that they had not replaced it with a suitable product. For such an expensive coffee machine that makes maybe four cups of coffee a day this is not acceptable.

I know Siemens will want the product back, will want to charge us another £200 or try and wiggle out of it by saying it was another part.

Surely I am protected by some Consumer Act or similar that I can quote to them. 

Can anyone help please.

You're confusing two different things.  Siemens are quite entitled to uphold a 12 month warranty, because warranties are not a consumer right.  Their warranty terms seem reasonable and if it's now expired, that's it.

You are protected by consumer rights but after all this time it's almost certainly a non-starter.  You'd need to prove an inherent fault and then the retailer (probably not Siemens?) would have the choice or replacement, repair or refund, but after such a long time, the replacement or refund would be heavily reduced to reflect the years of use you had before the fault.

turfey21

Hi, 

They said that it had a 6 year warranty, but we bought it while we lived in The Netherlands and obviously in the move back to the UK we misplaced our receipt and they could only go on the date it was manufactured. I hunted high and low for my receipt and although found my bank statement, again they would not use this as it was not in the UK. 
I was so exhausted back and forth chasing it we just got it repaired, now literally 13 months since it was repaired it is showing the exact same fault. It is quite a common fault I am finding on looking on the internet.

turfey21

It is not being blocked by limescale or anything as every few weeks it has a limescale treatment (Siemens one) and also a clean and cal treatment, again Siemens brand which ensure that it is kept clean.

Thank you for your replies everybody, now I will see what Siemens say.

Aylesbury_Duck

turfey21 said:

Hi, 

They said that it had a 6 year warranty, but we bought it while we lived in The Netherlands and obviously in the move back to the UK we misplaced our receipt and they could only go on the date it was manufactured. I hunted high and low for my receipt and although found my bank statement, again they would not use this as it was not in the UK. 
I was so exhausted back and forth chasing it we just got it repaired, now literally 13 months since it was repaired it is showing the exact same fault. It is quite a common fault I am finding on looking on the internet.

In which case, the UK consumer rights route is almost non-existent.  Consumer rights are exercised against the retailer, so your rights lie with the Dutch(?) retailer you bought it from whilst living there.

Unless you can negotiate something out of goodwill, you have no right to a free repair.

theonlywayisup

I have sent you a PM with something that may help (having had a Siemens coffee machine which lasted 12 years or so).  Sadly it's been replaced by a Miele which has spent more times in the workshop than in our kitchen.   

Are you using particularly oily beans?  This has been our downfall and it's taken some years (and 2 Miele replacements) to work it out!

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Aylesbury_Duck said:

turfey21 said:

Hi, 

They said that it had a 6 year warranty, but we bought it while we lived in The Netherlands and obviously in the move back to the UK we misplaced our receipt and they could only go on the date it was manufactured. I hunted high and low for my receipt and although found my bank statement, again they would not use this as it was not in the UK. 
I was so exhausted back and forth chasing it we just got it repaired, now literally 13 months since it was repaired it is showing the exact same fault. It is quite a common fault I am finding on looking on the internet.

In which case, the UK consumer rights route is almost non-existent.  Consumer rights are exercised against the retailer, so your rights lie with the Dutch(?) retailer you bought it from whilst living there.

Unless you can negotiate something out of goodwill, you have no right to a free repair.

OP has two contracts, one with the retailer for the machine, a second with Siemens for the repair (which was formed in 2020 when £200 was paid for a service of repair) so OP will have recourse against Siemens but would need something to show the repair they carried out wasn't sufficient (or the parts they fitting failed prematurely without misuse).